This year's annual

"A Lieberma" wrote in message
. 18...
It's been a solid week, and I am still not flying in my Sundowner.....

Problems encountered.

Oil analysis came back with high count of copper
#3 cylinder low on compressions
snip
Soo, for the #3 cylinder, A&P was able to field service it and get the
compressions up to 65. Remaining three cylinders are in the 70's.


Allen

Don't give up to quickly on the low compression cylinder. Fly it hard for a
few hours. If the primary leakage is past the rings, it is possible to get
a low reading if the ring gaps are aligned. Fly it and they "should" move
and might surprise you on the next compression test.

If it is valves, try staking the rocker/valve with a soft hammer or block of
wood.. It could be a chip of lead or carbon under the valve seat. Of
course if none of this works, it might be a sign of a failing cylinder.

Hope you get in the air soon.
John Severyn
KLVK

"J. Severyn" wrote in
:

Don't give up to quickly on the low compression cylinder. Fly it hard
for a few hours. If the primary leakage is past the rings, it is
possible to get a low reading if the ring gaps are aligned. Fly it
and they "should" move and might surprise you on the next compression
test.

Hey John,

We are doing exactly what you are suggestiong and not giving up the ghost
on the cylinder.

If it is valves, try staking the rocker/valve with a soft hammer or
block of wood.. It could be a chip of lead or carbon under the valve
seat. Of course if none of this works, it might be a sign of a
failing cylinder.

I am not sure *exactly* what the A&P did (I am not mechanically
inclined). He told me it was complete "blow by" where it was passing the
rings. So, he did something to improve it, and I think he did something
what you described above with the rocker / valves but used a different
term.

I asked if I was running the mixture properly and he said I was doing
fine. No lead on the plugs, no lead anywhere to my knowledge.

Hope you get in the air soon.

Me too! I didn't buy a plane to look at it on the ground *smile*

I will know more on Monday. Maybe by the time I get to the airport, they
will have the paint gun in full gear :-)

Allen

A Lieberma wrote:



I am not sure *exactly* what the A&P did (I am not mechanically
inclined). He told me it was complete "blow by" where it was passing the
rings. So, he did something to improve it, and I think he did something
what you described above with the rocker / valves but used a different
term.

If it's passing the rings then it's coming out the breather line, not
likely to get better. Everybody thinks the rings move during operation,
no way. You don't just happen to get unlucky and have the rings lined
up at the annual.

Newps wrote in
:

If it's passing the rings then it's coming out the breather line, not
likely to get better. Everybody thinks the rings move during
operation, no way. You don't just happen to get unlucky and have the
rings lined up at the annual.

Since he got the compression up to 65, I am willing to give it a go.

With this in mind, how many hours down the road should I get him to run
another compression test?

He did have me change the oil from 15 weight to 20 weight. Do you think
this will mask the problem any?

Allen

A Lieberma wrote:
Newps wrote in
:


If it's passing the rings then it's coming out the breather line, not
likely to get better. Everybody thinks the rings move during
operation, no way. You don't just happen to get unlucky and have the
rings lined up at the annual.


Since he got the compression up to 65, I am willing to give it a go.

With this in mind, how many hours down the road should I get him to run
another compression test?

10-15.



He did have me change the oil from 15 weight to 20 weight. Do you think
this will mask the problem any?

The oil has nothing to do with it.

This is coming from a Student who is going to school to get his A&P...

To answer the question about how long before having an A&P Relook at
your engine and co another compression check.. If I remember correctly
it should 150 hours of flight time to allow the engine to be run in and
allow the rings to reseat and break in properly.

A Lieberma wrote:
Newps wrote in
:

If it's passing the rings then it's coming out the breather line, not
likely to get better. Everybody thinks the rings move during
operation, no way. You don't just happen to get unlucky and have the
rings lined up at the annual.

Since he got the compression up to 65, I am willing to give it a go.

With this in mind, how many hours down the road should I get him to run
another compression test?

He did have me change the oil from 15 weight to 20 weight. Do you think
this will mask the problem any?

Allen

On Sat, 04 Nov 2006 21:53:04 -0700, Newps wrote:

A Lieberma wrote:

I am not sure *exactly* what the A&P did (I am not mechanically
inclined). He told me it was complete "blow by" where it was passing the
rings. So, he did something to improve it, and I think he did something
what you described above with the rocker / valves but used a different
term.

If it's passing the rings then it's coming out the breather line, not
likely to get better. Everybody thinks the rings move during operation,
no way. You don't just happen to get unlucky and have the rings lined
up at the annual.

Actually, the rings do move during operation. It's when they quit
moving that we have problems. They don't rotate so much, but they do
squirm in and out as the piston moves up and down in the cylinder,
accommodating themselves to minor variations in the cylinder. I've
seen rings that were glued firmly into their grooves by deposits, not
moving at all, instead of springing free as they left the cylinder.
You don't get much sealing from rings in that condition, and once the
rings are stuck, that causes more damage.

The additive Allen mentioned could have been Avblend
(www.avblend.com). It's expensive, so you know it's FAA approved. Some
A&Ps use it. You can shop around for a slightly better price. Just fly
and maybe Avblend will loosen things up, in which case it's worth it.
Every once in a while, you get lucky.

And I don't wanna...

I don't WANNA

I DON'T WANNA

hear you bitching in here how much your annual cost you until you can tell
me how much of the owner assisted annual you did. So far as I can see,
about 75-80% of what you've had "done" could have been done yourself.

Jim



"A Lieberma" wrote in message
. 18...
It's been a solid week, and I am still not flying in my Sundowner.....

RST Engineering wrote:
And I don't wanna...

I don't WANNA

I DON'T WANNA

hear you bitching in here how much your annual cost you until you can tell
me how much of the owner assisted annual you did. So far as I can see,
about 75-80% of what you've had "done" could have been done yourself.

So Jim, it's ok to bitch about the costs associated with one's annual
and required repairs if, in fact, one has done as much of the owner
assisted work as possible? Really? And all this time I thought it was
just bitching about annuals that got under your skin :-)

Oh yeah, one more thing...never, NEVER, *NEVER* say something like "My
annual cost me insert amazing AMU amount here". Always, ALWAYS,
*ALWAYS* separate out the inspection from the *required repairs*

--
Jack Allison
PP-ASEL-Instrument Airplane

"To become a Jedi knight, you must master a single force. To become
a private pilot you must strive to master four of them"
- Rod Machado

(Remove the obvious from address to reply via e-mail)

"RST Engineering" wrote in
:

hear you bitching in here how much your annual cost you until you can
tell me how much of the owner assisted annual you did. So far as I
can see, about 75-80% of what you've had "done" could have been done
yourself.

Now, you got me curious, on all the problems listed, other then the oil
change, what exactly could I have legally done?

It's only a semi complaint about the cost, not so much for the workmanship,
but for what has to be worked on (low compression cylinder and corrosion).

Hell, in my opinion, A&P's are the doctors of my airplane engine. I work
on computers, not engines and airframes. I just want my airplane the
safest one on the ramp.

Also, the time it takes to do an annual amazes me, which would mean with my
work schedule the plane would be down longer then it be.

So, no you won't hear me complain about the basic annual cost, as I know my
A&P is of utmost integrity and quality. He's got enough bisiness passing
through his hands without having to jack up any prices or look for
problems.

Allen