"V-22 DESERT TESTING FINDS PROBLEMS THAT HURT MISSION EFFECTIVENESS"

Inside the Navy
January 22, 2007

DOT&E Report Outlines Concerns

V-22 DESERT TESTING FINDS PROBLEMS THAT HURT MISSION EFFECTIVENESS

The V-22 Osprey, which may deploy to Iraq with Marines this year,
suffered problems that hurt its mission effectiveness when the Air
Force tested it for a month in the New Mexico desert, according to a
new report from the Pentagon¹s top weapons tester.

The problems are described in the latest annual report from the Defense
Department¹s operational testing directorate, led by Charles McQueary.

The V-22 is a helicopter-plane hybrid developed by Bell Helicopter
Textron and Boeing. During an "operational utility evaluation"
conducted last summer in the desert at Kirtland Air Force Base, NM, the
effectiveness of the Osprey for training missions and potential combat
missions was "degraded by poor aircraft availability", says the report,
issued January 18.

"Frequent part and system failures, limited supply support, and high
false alarm rates in the built-in diagnostic systems caused frequent
flight delays and an excessive maintenance workload", the report says.

Some of the reliability problems "may be attributable to the extended
exposure to the desert operating environment" where the assessment
occurred, says the report.

The Osprey provided only "marginal operational availability" during the
41 flights (74 flight hours), the report says.

The Air Force Operational Test and Evaluation Center conducted the
assessment using four of the service¹s CV-22 aircraft. The testing
started June 6, 2006, and wrapped up July 10, said Katherine Gandara, a
spokeswoman for the center. The final test flight for the assessment
was conducted June 30, she said. All of the testing took place in the
desert, she said.

The Marine Corps version of the V-22 would likely suffer the same kinds
of problems in desert conditions, a Pentagon source said.

Both versions of the aircraft are very similar except the CV-22 has
some extra equipment for special operations missions. The Air Force
plans to buy 50 Ospreys for its special operations troops, while the
Marine Corps plans to buy 360.

The report urges the V-22 program to correct the deficiencies noted in
the "operational utility evaluation" before the CV-22 begins its
initial operational testing and evaluation in FY-08.

The report also calls on the program to monitor the operational
suitability of the Marine Corps¹ Block B version of the Osprey, which
is due to deploy this year, to determine the "discrepancy" between the
solid performance reported in the operational evaluation of the Marine
Corps version and the problems now coming to light.

James Darcy, the Navy¹s spokesman for the V-22 program, said the
problems encountered in last summer's testing involved both known and
previously unknown issues.

Program officials do not believe these issues will delay fielding plans
for the Marine Corps or Air Force versions of the Osprey, he said.

Darcy said the testing in New Mexico was originally intended to test
the Air Force¹s rigorous training curriculum. This was a "much more
stressful evaluation" compared to the conditions and types of flights
that the V-22 program anticipates on an actual deployment, he said.

But Philip Coyle, a former director of operational testing and
evaluation at the Pentagon, and now a senior adviser with the Center
for Defense Information, said it is amazing how many reliability
problems continue to affect the V-22.

"This produces a maintenance and support burden that the Marines really
can¹t afford", he said. "All of the reliability problems that they
continue to have here in the [United] States -- it¹s going to drive
them crazy overseas."

"Mike" wrote in message
ps.com...
Inside the Navy
January 22, 2007

DOT&E Report Outlines Concerns

V-22 DESERT TESTING FINDS PROBLEMS THAT HURT MISSION EFFECTIVENESS

The V-22 Osprey, which may deploy to Iraq with Marines this year,
suffered problems that hurt its mission effectiveness when the Air
Force tested it for a month in the New Mexico desert, according to a
new report from the Pentagon¹s top weapons tester.
[ SNIP ]

**********

These sound largely like software problems. That's no surprise - maybe 1 in
a 100 organizations actually write reliable code. You pretty much assume
that your software will be crap, and work around it.

It's a bit disturbing that the Osprey didn't get tested in a desert
environment for an extended period before last year. If it was so tested
prior to that, how is it that it suddenly sucked last year? It's not so much
that the V-22 is sensitive to desert conditions, but that nobody seems to
have examined the issue before. If the machine is in fact sensitive, that's
not necessarily a huge deal - the Afrika Korps managed with their tanks in
North Africa.

AHS

Arved Sandstrom wrote:
"Mike" wrote in message
ps.com...
Inside the Navy
January 22, 2007

DOT&E Report Outlines Concerns

V-22 DESERT TESTING FINDS PROBLEMS THAT HURT MISSION EFFECTIVENESS

The V-22 Osprey, which may deploy to Iraq with Marines this year,
suffered problems that hurt its mission effectiveness when the Air
Force tested it for a month in the New Mexico desert, according to a
new report from the Pentagon¹s top weapons tester.
[ SNIP ]

**********

These sound largely like software problems. That's no surprise - maybe 1 in
a 100 organizations actually write reliable code. You pretty much assume
that your software will be crap, and work around it.

It's a bit disturbing that the Osprey didn't get tested in a desert
environment for an extended period before last year. If it was so tested
prior to that, how is it that it suddenly sucked last year? It's not so much
that the V-22 is sensitive to desert conditions, but that nobody seems to
have examined the issue before. If the machine is in fact sensitive, that's
not necessarily a huge deal - the Afrika Korps managed with their tanks in
North Africa.

AHS

and Jimmy Carter said in an interview that he wished he had sent eight
helicopters rather than seven.

Arved Sandstrom wrote:
"Mike" wrote in message
ps.com...
Inside the Navy
January 22, 2007

DOT&E Report Outlines Concerns

V-22 DESERT TESTING FINDS PROBLEMS THAT HURT MISSION EFFECTIVENESS

The V-22 Osprey, which may deploy to Iraq with Marines this year,
suffered problems that hurt its mission effectiveness when the Air
Force tested it for a month in the New Mexico desert, according to a
new report from the Pentagon¹s top weapons tester.
[ SNIP ]

**********

These sound largely like software problems. That's no surprise - maybe 1 in
a 100 organizations actually write reliable code. You pretty much assume
that your software will be crap, and work around it.

It's a bit disturbing that the Osprey didn't get tested in a desert
environment for an extended period before last year. If it was so tested
prior to that, how is it that it suddenly sucked last year? It's not so much
that the V-22 is sensitive to desert conditions, but that nobody seems to
have examined the issue before. If the machine is in fact sensitive, that's
not necessarily a huge deal - the Afrika Korps managed with their tanks in
North Africa.

AHS


except that it is an "attack transport"

In such a role reliability is everything


Vince

Mike wrote:
Inside the Navy
January 22, 2007

DOT&E Report Outlines Concerns

V-22 DESERT TESTING FINDS PROBLEMS THAT HURT MISSION EFFECTIVENESS


Big surprise
it's the same flying turkey it always was


The V-22 Osprey, which may deploy to Iraq with Marines this year,
suffered problems that hurt its mission effectiveness when the Air
Force tested it for a month in the New Mexico desert, according to a
new report from the Pentagon¹s top weapons tester.

The problems are described in the latest annual report from the Defense
Department¹s operational testing directorate, led by Charles McQueary.

The V-22 is a helicopter-plane hybrid developed by Bell Helicopter
Textron and Boeing. During an "operational utility evaluation"
conducted last summer in the desert at Kirtland Air Force Base, NM, the
effectiveness of the Osprey for training missions and potential combat
missions was "degraded by poor aircraft availability", says the report,
issued January 18.

"Frequent part and system failures, limited supply support, and high
false alarm rates in the built-in diagnostic systems caused frequent
flight delays and an excessive maintenance workload", the report says.

Some of the reliability problems "may be attributable to the extended
exposure to the desert operating environment" where the assessment
occurred, says the report.


a month in the desert


The Osprey provided only "marginal operational availability" during the
41 flights (74 flight hours), the report says.


74 hours in 24 days by 4 aircraft
that is less than an hour a day per aircraft.

wow an hour a day must have really been tough on the aircraft

The Air Force Operational Test and Evaluation Center conducted the
assessment using four of the service¹s CV-22 aircraft. The testing
started June 6, 2006, and wrapped up July 10, said Katherine Gandara, a
spokeswoman for the center. The final test flight for the assessment
was conducted June 30, she said. All of the testing took place in the
desert, she said.

snip

Darcy said the testing in New Mexico was originally intended to test
the Air Force¹s rigorous training curriculum. This was a "much more
stressful evaluation" compared to the conditions and types of flights
that the V-22 program anticipates on an actual deployment, he said.

But Philip Coyle, a former director of operational testing and
evaluation at the Pentagon, and now a senior adviser with the Center
for Defense Information, said it is amazing how many reliability
problems continue to affect the V-22.

"This produces a maintenance and support burden that the Marines really
can¹t afford", he said. "All of the reliability problems that they
continue to have here in the [United] States -- it¹s going to drive
them crazy overseas."


Yeh but the brass really wants this overpriced over weight under sized
turkey since it flies much faster than a donkey or a camel

Vince

On 22 Jan 2007, Vince said the following in news:SIydnTP_zep-
.

Yeh but the brass really wants this overpriced over weight under sized
turkey since it flies much faster than a donkey or a camel

Congress jammed it down the brass' collective throat a long time ago.
Should we really complain when they attempt to swallow?

Regards,
Dann

How long have they been working this ship up?

On 29 Jan 2007, David E. Powell said the following in
oups.com.

How long have they been working this ship up?


Erg. My ability to recall dates being somewhat in question....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V-22_Osprey

First funding was appropriated during 1986. In 1988, then SecDef Dick
Cheney canceled the program. Congress disagreed.

As I recall from reading stories about it at the time, the problem was
that the program managers had ensured that there were jobs producing
parts for the program in lots of Congressional districts. So the program
had the support of not only defense minded Congress critters, and
Congress critters with defense contractors in their districts, but it
also had the support of Congress critters with newly created defense
related jobs in their otherwise non-defense-job-having districts.

Voting against jobs in your own district was and is considered bad form
for Congress Critters.

First flight was in 1989. Altitude was measured with a micrometer.

Regards,
Dann

On Jan 29, 3:59 am, Dann wrote:
On 29 Jan 2007, David E. Powell said the following groups.com.

How long have they been working this ship up?

Erg. My ability to recall dates being somewhat in question....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V-22_Osprey

First funding was appropriated during 1986. In 1988, then SecDef Dick
Cheney canceled the program. Congress disagreed.

As I recall from reading stories about it at the time, the problem was
that the program managers had ensured that there were jobs producing
parts for the program in lots of Congressional districts. So the program
had the support of not only defense minded Congress critters, and
Congress critters with defense contractors in their districts, but it
also had the support of Congress critters with newly created defense
related jobs in their otherwise non-defense-job-having districts.

Voting against jobs in your own district was and is considered bad form
for Congress Critters.

First flight was in 1989. Altitude was measured with a micrometer.

Regards,
Dann

These dates sound wrong. I went through 96H AIT at Ft. Huachuca in
1982 and they were test flying them out of there then. IIRC two-three
airframes out of one hangar there at the airfield. Pretty interesting
take-off. Don't remember seeing any landings. ;-)

I seem to remember that at that time it was still a "Marine only"
project undergoing joint testing to see if the Army would be
interested in co-funding.

So this bird's been flying for a quarter century and is still buggy?
Kill it already, it's stinking up the joint. Probably for the same
money a transport of like capability could have been designed using
Harrier tech.

D