Charles Lindbergh, racist & Nazi sympathizer

Another freakin liberal trying to defame and change historic figures..........

Mr. Codefy,
Don't take things out of context. Lindbergh was not any more
racist than anybody else in 1940's America. He thought the Germans had a
good air force and they gave him the red carpet treatment when he was
over there. He was a pro neutrality guy, but later flew some combat in
the Pacific in P38's ( unofficially got 2 kills). Your venom is really
off target here.

codefy wrote:

Some American hero.

When Lindbergh died in Hawaii did he consider the people there with
any more maturity than when he made his racist comments or did he just
consider them his coolies ?

If there's a Hell I'm sure Lindbergh is roasting there for his racism
& Nazi sympathies.

You have to wonder how Lindbergh's grandson deals with that nasty part
of the legend that he's living off of.

"codefy" wrote in message
om...
Some American hero.

When Lindbergh died in Hawaii did he consider the people there with
any more maturity than when he made his racist comments or did he just
consider them his coolies ?

If there's a Hell I'm sure Lindbergh is roasting there for his racism
& Nazi sympathies.

You have to wonder how Lindbergh's grandson deals with that nasty part
of the legend that he's living off of.

The majority of US citizens shared Charles Linderghs views. They wanted to
avoid a war.

There is coverage of the affair, "Lindburghs Des Moines Speech" in this
article (70 page preface, the book is excellent):
http://www.csulb.edu/~kmacd/Preface.htm

They can't be called Anti-Semitic. When Lindburgh points out that some
Jewish groups want to get the US into war he was telling the simple truth
and he sympathizes with them.

Also remember there was no 'holocaust' at this time and no 'holocaust
industry' to raise consiciouncess of it. That didn't really exist till
1968. (I think a case can be made for arguing that without full blown US
and UK involvement there never would have been a holocaust; the Nazis wanted
to expell jews and break their social power in media, banking, finance,
proffesions and worked at re-settling them in Palestine on the basis of the
Balfur declaration or resettling in Madagascar etc. Highly assimilated jews
could survive in the German military eg the first officer of the Bismark was
jewish)

Roosevelt had to work very hard to get the US into war against Germany. US
destroyers escorting convoys were attacking German u-boats for almost 1 year
while the Germans did not fire back and the rare incidents when u-boats did
fire back were hyped as much as possible. By the time Pearl Harbour came
about Hitler did not have a choice as he was locked into treaties with the
Japanese.

The Case for Pearl Harbor Revisionism
http://theoccidentalquarterly.com/vo...arlharbor.html


If you look at the state of the world today, the destruction of white people
in Europe, and the US Lindbergh was absolutely correct. Another war would
finnish the white race and it effectvely has. Some, like you (I suspect
you are jewish?), might consider that a good thing.

"The Enlightenment" wrote in message

Also remember there was no 'holocaust' at this time and no 'holocaust
industry' to raise consiciouncess of it. That didn't really exist
till 1968. (I think a case can be made for arguing that without
full blown US and UK involvement there never would have been a
holocaust; the Nazis wanted to expell jews and break their social
power in media, banking, finance, proffesions and worked at
re-settling them in Palestine on the basis of the Balfur declaration
or resettling in Madagascar etc. Highly assimilated jews could
survive in the German military eg the first officer of the Bismark
was jewish)

This is either monumental ignorance or an apology for the some of the worst
monsters in history.

--
http://www.delversdungeon.dragonsfoot.org
Remove the X's in my email address to respond.
"Damn you Silvey, and your endless fortunes." - Stephen Weir
I hate furries.

"Bill Silvey" wrote in message om...
"The Enlightenment" wrote in message

Also remember there was no 'holocaust' at this time and no 'holocaust
industry' to raise consiciouncess of it. That didn't really exist
till 1968. (I think a case can be made for arguing that without
full blown US and UK involvement there never would have been a
holocaust; the Nazis wanted to expell jews and break their social
power in media, banking, finance, proffesions and worked at
re-settling them in Palestine on the basis of the Balfur declaration
or resettling in Madagascar etc. Highly assimilated jews could
survive in the German military eg the first officer of the Bismark
was jewish)

This is either monumental ignorance or an apology for the some of the worst
monsters in history.

Try and take apart my points one by one.

"Lawrence Dillard" wrote in message news:...
"JDupre5762" wrote in message
...
"codefy" wrote
Some American hero.

When Lindbergh died in Hawaii did he consider the people there with
any more maturity than when he made his racist comments or did he
just
consider them his coolies ?

Lindbergh died in what 1973? There had been a lot of change in
Americans
views
toward race by that time. I think above all Lindbergh was an American
and
while he probably echoed the prevalent racial and isolationist views of
the
1920's and 1930's in his heyday, ultimately he would be swayed by
performance
and character.

Seems to me that the essence of a Great Man is to be able to see beyond
conventional wisdom and to examine persons and situations independently
and
reach one's own conclusions and where possible, act on them. When it came
to
race and to anti-Semitism, Mr. Lindbergh, although IIRC a minister's son,
seems not to have conducted such a self-examination. One wonders whether
Lindbergh ever was in touch with the so-called "average American" or
whether
he could recognize and relate to views other than those fashionable in the
circles in which he habituated.

By the end of his life he could not have been ignorant of the
Tuskegee Airmen, Chappie James and Jesse Brown let alone Jackie
Robinson.
I
can't prove it but I dare say he would have rather forgotten any racist
remarks
he might have made. Don't forget that after Pearl Harbor Lindbergh
volunteered
for active duty and was denied several times by Roosevelt who harbored a
grudge
over Lindbergh's comments on the superiority of the Luftwaffe in the
late
1930's. A superiority that was as much Roosevelt's responsibility as it
was
Hitler's.

Actually, FDR desired to harness the charisma and persuasiveness which
Lindbergh possessed. Although FDR was certain, because of access to
sources
of his own, independent of Lindbergh's, that Nazi Germany's aircraft
industry had not the prowess its propaganda claimed for it, and that the
US
armaments industry, and especially the aircraft portion thereof, could be
resuscitated and could become strong enough in a rather short period of
time
so as to be able to interpose effectively against any expansionist
ambitions
held by the Axis, it is apparently not widely known that FDR, in the wake
of
Lindbergh's German tour, offered the latter the position of US aircraft
acquisition czar, with wide delegation of authority in overseeing US R&D
and
contracting; he wanted Lindbergh "on the team" instead of jeering from the
sidelines and counseling caution, if not defeatism. Lindbergh refused,
believing that FDR merely wanted to remove an irritating naysayer and
silence his independent voice of opposition.

Whereas FDR's attitude was "We'll show them!", Lindbergh's attitude
reflected a certain defeatism, "We'll never be able to match them, and
let's
not waste our energies trying to" attitude, and he appeared to be ready to
accept a second-rate status for the US in world affairs, because
intimidated
by a Nazi/Axis show of force.

As for his return to active duty, I submit that such a thing would have
opened a can of worms. Would Lindbergh have been able to submit to
military
discipline? Would he have been able to contribute effectively in a system
where his word or opinion was not necessarily considered tantamount to
revelation?

It is well to remember that no nation, including the US, forced the Nazis
to
re-arm in defiance of the WWI peace accords. FDR bore no responsibility
for
the collapse of the world-wide economy, other than to try to bring the US
portion of it back to life.

Lindbergh's comments in those days were that the German's were so
superior
to
us and we were so hopelessly outclassed we could not possibly affect the
outcome of a modern war in Europe so why bother. He was right of course
the US
Army was not even in the top ten in size in the world. Bulgaria had a
larger
standing army. A single Luftflotte in 1940 had more aircraft than the
entire US
Army Air Corps.

Again, a Great Man has to have matching vision. In this case, he seemed
determined to Think Small and seemed to lack an understanding of the
latent
manufacturing potential of the US, which was still badly scarred by the
economic depression of the 1930's. As is well-known, once Gen Marshall's
system was in place, the US began producing trained divisions at such a
pace
that, for example, WS Churchill initially could not comprehend how it was
being done. Lindbergh could not envision a dramatic increase in the number
of training a/c, pilots, transports, bombers, fighters, etc. which the US
proved to be capable of producing in relatively short order. Lindbergh
also
appears to have missed out on the inter-allied information interchange
which
kick-started US electronics and airframe development efforts.

Lindbergh was rightly called "Lucky Lindy" due to his successful solo
Atlantic crossing. However, the intense and universal celebrity (and
wealth)
that became attached to him attendant thereto seems to have caused him,
(as
well as many a person in other fields), to wrongly consider himself expert
at everything to which he turned his attention, and to believe that his
every opinion was sacrosanct. But Lindbergh was not a trained engineer, as
he demonstrated when the Nazis showed him around their alleged production
facilities, and was clueless in assessing the current and potential
industrial prowess of the US. Any of Gen Marshall's top staff could have
told him that the US would expand its army many-fold in a brief time, if
tasked to do so. Any of Adm Stark's top staff could have alerted him to
the
swelling size and strength of the US Navy, similarly.


Lindbergh was guilty more of naivete' than Nazism. Lindbergh was taken
in
many ways by such ruses as the only handful of a bomber type being flown
from
factory to factory and put back in the "production line" for him to
examine all
over again.

According to author "Ladislas Farago", intercepted German documents showed
that the Germans considered Lindbergh to be akin to one of their
propaganda
agents who could be relied upon to cause their sentiments to become widely
heard in the US. They were especially impressed by Lindbergh's expressed
anti-Semitism.

SNIP