Steve Fossett missing?

Technician Class. Morse code tests are NOT required by any class any
more, so being you are an EE, I would try for the Extra Class so you
would have all available privileges. You may want to ultimately do more
than just aprs!

Scott
N0EDV

J. Severyn wrote:

Thanks!!!! This APRS system is outta-sight. As a retired EE, I've toyed
with getting a ham ticket since I was a kid...and this might just do it.
This has wide coverage....and does not depend on a G-switch like an
ELT.....even the new 406MHz units depend on a G-switch to trip if the victim
cannot trigger the unit manually.

I like the continual tracking feature.....just look where the signal
stopped.

I've spent some time in the past half-hour and understand the electronics.
But has someone put together a small transmitter with an embedded GPS, to
make the whole unit a "one box" solution? I have no problem building a APRS
transmitter myself, but it seems a single small package has a better chance
of always being in the plane, say mounted on a door post or under a glass
turtledeck. Maybe with a rechargable battery, external power plug (to keep
it charged from the ship's power).

OK..... tell me more. What class ham license do I need?

John Severyn
KLVK Livermore, Ca.


wrote in message
ups.com...

Fairly simple. The (2m) tracking unit has a small gps that feeds
digital signals to the attached transmitter. The signals include
latitude, longitude, speed, altitude, direction and are picked up by a
host of volunteer ham towers - digital repeaters and/or iGates. That
info is transferred to internet servers and you can easily see the
results on a Google (or other type) map on places like www.findu.com -
simplicity itself for users. I suggest that you pay another $15/yr for
a private website YourPlaneName.com where your relatives or FAA can go
to find the latest tracking.

A lot of automobile users use the system so their wives can tell where
they are (hmm?) . But their signals are often blocked by terrain. The
best performance is from aircraft - any ham digi or igate tower within
couple of hundred miles can see the signal. I have flown cross country
- remote areas - and there is rarely a break in 1 or 2 minute
reporting intervals.

Are you still gawking around. Memorize answers to some 100 ham
questions, pay the $20? fee and get a APRS tracker. It may save your
life.





--
Scott
http://corbenflyer.tripod.com/
Gotta Fly or Gonna Die
Building RV-4 (Super Slow Build Version)

Can you explain how this works, like we're a class of 8th graders? We'll,
7th graders, really. See, 8th grade just started, but we're still reviewing
from last year...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ummm, okay. Let's start by taking apart a GPS unit. Get rid of the
display, keyboard and housing, the guts boil down to a circuit board
about the size of a business card. You still need the antenna and a
source of power but the heart of the GPS unit is that single circuit
board, which has been available as new-surplus for at least ten years.

Whenever there's power to the circuit board -- and the antenna can see
the sky -- the circuit board spits out a constant stream of data. The
data would normally go to the GPS units display.

What hams have done is to make an equally small circuit board that
takes that stream of data, encodes it in a usable format and feeds it
to a ham radio -- typically a 'walkie-talkie' that uses the 2-meter
ham band. The ham radio broadcasts the data in short bursts for all
to hear. We call it our 'Automatic Position Reporting System' and it
has proven very useful in keeping track of things. (Indeed, a few
years ago I posted a message here suggesting it be used to keep track
of friends at Oshkosh, since the unit is small enough to put in your
pocket.)

On the ground, hams have covered the nation with receiving stations
tuned to the frequency used for automatic position reporting. Connect
a computer to a suitable radio, load the free software, and you can
track your friends -- or your cars, airplanes or whatever -- on a
nifty moving map display. It doesn't have to be a big computer --
there's software available for those palm-sized units.

'Tiny Trak' is one such unit and there's a Google group devoted to
automatic position reporting.

-R.S.Hoover
-(KA6HZF)

Basically the APRS tracker is a small gps receiver / 2M ham
transmitter which sends digital position signals to nearby digital ham
station, which in turn send the info to internet servers and you can
see your last reported position on google (or other) maps on sites
like www.findu.com. It is simplicity itself for end user.

I also suggest you invest $15/yr in a MyPlanexxx.com website where
your relatives (and FAA) could easily click to link to findu.com with
google map to see your location.

If some of you want the finished product I am willing to put it
together for you - you pay for expenses and labor - see
http://www.abri.com/sq2000/GPStrack.html
But you still need a ham license, which is easy to get.

APRS is superior to 406 unit since it is real time and does not depend
on "going off" in a crash.

On Sep 5, 11:32 pm, "Montblack" Y4_NOT!...
wrote:
wrote)

You can build an APRS tracker for about $250. A basic ham license is easy
to get.

For more infohttp://www.abri.com/sq2000/GPStrack.html

http://www.abri.com/sq2000/APRSBasics.txt
Interesting...

Bring a Pilot to School Day:

Can you explain how this works, like we're a class of 8th graders? We'll,
7th graders, really. See, 8th grade just started, but we're still reviewing
from last year...

Paul-Mont

wrote:

APRS is superior to 406 unit since it is real time and does not depend
on "going off" in a crash.


BUT.. in the way you propose to use, APRS involves you being recognized
as overdue by someone, and them initiating the search by reporting an
overdue aircraft and giving the last known coords.

Or do you think that filing a VFR flight plan with your own personal
findu.com emulation page address would suffice?

An impact activated ELT at least lets SOMEONE know you are down.
Particularly a 406 mhz one, since it broadcasts last known position as
part of its data burst.


I've not used APRS in the air, but I do realize its fairly easy to rig
up with a little handheld portable and tinytrack three, and the setup
can take a data feed from ANY NMEA gps, such as any of the portable
Garmins (aviation or not). On the ground, I use a APRS ready Mobile with
a GPS3 feeding it.


Dave

On Sep 6, 2:05 pm, Dave S wrote:
wrote:
APRS is superior to 406 unit since it is real time and does not depend
on "going off" in a crash.

BUT.. in the way you propose to use, APRS involves you being recognized
as overdue by someone, and them initiating the search by reporting an
overdue aircraft and giving the last known coords.


True, but it is typically a long time before S&R gets into action
anyway - and after FAA verifies that the signal is not an accident in
itself. My relatives watch my flight movements and would be anxious to
get into action if I did not report at end of the leg.

One possible problem might be when flying in places like dry lake beds.
If you're flying at say 500 feet will there always be a ham within
range to get the aprs report? At 100 MPH you might cover a lot of
potential ground without an aprs report getting received by someone.
The satellite unit can see the vast majority of Earth's surface from
space. But, I agree, the satellite method relies on that little
G-Switch to indicate trouble...

Scott
N0EDV

wrote:
Basically the APRS tracker is a small gps receiver / 2M ham
transmitter which sends digital position signals to nearby digital ham
station, which in turn send the info to internet servers and you can
see your last reported position on google (or other) maps on sites
like www.findu.com. It is simplicity itself for end user.

I also suggest you invest $15/yr in a MyPlanexxx.com website where
your relatives (and FAA) could easily click to link to findu.com with
google map to see your location.

If some of you want the finished product I am willing to put it
together for you - you pay for expenses and labor - see
http://www.abri.com/sq2000/GPStrack.html
But you still need a ham license, which is easy to get.

APRS is superior to 406 unit since it is real time and does not depend
on "going off" in a crash.

On Sep 5, 11:32 pm, "Montblack" Y4_NOT!...
wrote:

wrote)


You can build an APRS tracker for about $250. A basic ham license is easy
to get.

For more infohttp://www.abri.com/sq2000/GPStrack.html

http://www.abri.com/sq2000/APRSBasics.txt
Interesting...

Bring a Pilot to School Day:

Can you explain how this works, like we're a class of 8th graders? We'll,
7th graders, really. See, 8th grade just started, but we're still reviewing
from last year...

Paul-Mont




--
Scott
http://corbenflyer.tripod.com/
Gotta Fly or Gonna Die
Building RV-4 (Super Slow Build Version)

On Sep 5, 10:21 pm, wrote:

I have a APRS tracker that continuously sends position/velocity info
on the ham frequency.

This happens to be a topic near and dear to my uber-geeky heart. On
the one hand we have ELTs, which *hopefully* kick off when a plane
crashes. If it isn't damaged in the crash . . . if the batteries are
still good . . . if the antenna leads stay attached . . . etc. On
the other hand we have a system that is designed to tell you where the
plane is at all times, and hey, if the guy doesn't come home--play
back the recorded position data and go look in the area where the
signal stopped.

--Air-side cost . . . compared to an ELT, the things are quite
reasonable. Compared to a 406 ELT, they're peanuts.
--Ground-side cost . . . the ground side would need to get built--I
would speculate that a receiver/recorder per ATC sector would do
nicely. You could build the ground side for the entire nation for
next to nothing (when measured by gov't standards). There are guys on
this group, right now, that could design and deploy the whole ground
side without even thinking hard.
--Position data recording . . . compared to what a TIVO packs away,
setting up a system to record, say, the last 72 hours worth of
reported positions for airplanes in a given region is pretty darn
approachable. Lat/Lon, speed & altitude. That is not a lot a data.
Don't even record all of it, just record 5 minute intervals or
similar. Get fancy and make the intervals speed-sensitive. It's just
software on a PC, darn it. The amount of data is so small you could
do this on the computer the average junior high kid threw away last
week.
--Traffic avoidance . . . not only could your little ground recorder
get the signal, by golly other planes could too. Be a nice cheap way
to have live traffic in the cockpit without the ADS-B expense,
complexity and hassle.
--No electrical system? Guys at my airport without starters and
alternators are still using a little 12v batt for a radio.
--This system is a bit similar to something commercial shipping has
started doing. It's a transponder system for shipping, but instead of
being assigned a different squawk every time they go out, the have a
permanently assigned squawk. N-number anyone?
--Change the freq so you don't need the Ham ticket.

This stuff breaks my heart. It would be so simple, so cheap, so
effective, it might actually save a life (over and above the poor
track record ELT's have) and it ain't never going to happen. No one
will make money off it so no one will advocate it. I have to go for a
walk to calm down.

Stay safe, folks.

Steve.

"Steve S." wrote in message
ups.com...
On Sep 5, 10:21 pm, wrote:

I have a APRS tracker that continuously sends position/velocity info
on the ham frequency.

This happens to be a topic near and dear to my uber-geeky heart. On
the one hand we have ELTs, which *hopefully* kick off when a plane
crashes. If it isn't damaged in the crash . . . if the batteries are
still good . . . if the antenna leads stay attached . . . etc. On
the other hand we have a system that is designed to tell you where the
plane is at all times, and hey, if the guy doesn't come home--play
back the recorded position data and go look in the area where the
signal stopped.

--Air-side cost . . . compared to an ELT, the things are quite
reasonable. Compared to a 406 ELT, they're peanuts.
--Ground-side cost . . . the ground side would need to get built--I
would speculate that a receiver/recorder per ATC sector would do
nicely. You could build the ground side for the entire nation for
next to nothing (when measured by gov't standards). There are guys on
this group, right now, that could design and deploy the whole ground
side without even thinking hard.
--Position data recording . . . compared to what a TIVO packs away,
setting up a system to record, say, the last 72 hours worth of
reported positions for airplanes in a given region is pretty darn
approachable. Lat/Lon, speed & altitude. That is not a lot a data.
Don't even record all of it, just record 5 minute intervals or
similar. Get fancy and make the intervals speed-sensitive. It's just
software on a PC, darn it. The amount of data is so small you could
do this on the computer the average junior high kid threw away last
week.
--Traffic avoidance . . . not only could your little ground recorder
get the signal, by golly other planes could too. Be a nice cheap way
to have live traffic in the cockpit without the ADS-B expense,
complexity and hassle.
--No electrical system? Guys at my airport without starters and
alternators are still using a little 12v batt for a radio.
--This system is a bit similar to something commercial shipping has
started doing. It's a transponder system for shipping, but instead of
being assigned a different squawk every time they go out, the have a
permanently assigned squawk. N-number anyone?
--Change the freq so you don't need the Ham ticket.

This stuff breaks my heart. It would be so simple, so cheap, so
effective, it might actually save a life (over and above the poor
track record ELT's have) and it ain't never going to happen. No one
will make money off it so no one will advocate it. I have to go for a
walk to calm down.

Stay safe, folks.

Steve.


And, it is a built in "Anti-theft" tracker. If your airplane gets
stolen, and the thief doesn't turn it off, you can probably find the
aircraft and thief.

Our flight school should have one to track students on x-c. I once had a
student who almost tried to cross the Big Lake in a 150, we never would've
found him.

Al G

Al G wrote:

And, it is a built in "Anti-theft" tracker. If your airplane gets
stolen, and the thief doesn't turn it off, you can probably find the
aircraft and thief.

Our flight school should have one to track students on x-c. I once had a
student who almost tried to cross the Big Lake in a 150, we never would've
found him.

Al G



Here's the catch. If the transmitter is operating, there needs to be a
licensed amatuer radio operator with direct control of it. By the rules,
cant just leave it transmitting blind unattended or attended by an
unlicensed operator.

Now.. there is NO reason something similar cant be devised on a business
or aviation frequency for a given local operator. You put a reciever on
top of a 1000 ft tall antenna somewhere and you will pick up airborne
traffic for hundreds of miles. Do the same in a few key cities and you
can blanket an entire area.

Dave

"Dave S" wrote in message
...
Al G wrote:

And, it is a built in "Anti-theft" tracker. If your airplane gets
stolen, and the thief doesn't turn it off, you can probably find the
aircraft and thief.

Our flight school should have one to track students on x-c. I once
had a student who almost tried to cross the Big Lake in a 150, we never
would've found him.

Al G

Here's the catch. If the transmitter is operating, there needs to be a
licensed amatuer radio operator with direct control of it. By the rules,
cant just leave it transmitting blind unattended or attended by an
unlicensed operator.

Now.. there is NO reason something similar cant be devised on a business
or aviation frequency for a given local operator. You put a reciever on
top of a 1000 ft tall antenna somewhere and you will pick up airborne
traffic for hundreds of miles. Do the same in a few key cities and you
can blanket an entire area.

Dave

Oops, you're right. The neat deal here is that all of the antennas
already exist, in the Ham network. They are the ones providing a real
service.

Al G