2008 Proposed US Competition Rules Changes

On Dec 28, 12:12*am, Rick Culbertson wrote:
On Dec 24, 12:58 pm, AK wrote:

Thank you both for your examples I see your point. Do you have any
opinion on what is the best software for PDA in regards to entering
new tasks in the air? What I am looking for is any easy to operate,
with minimum attention, fewest steps software other than Glide
Navigator II. Thx.

AK

Hi AK,
The safety question of changing tasks in air the while somewhat
inconvenient has proven it's self to be a great tool and beneficial
for all concerned as noted by UH & BV. One of the many pre-contest
practice items to add to your check list is "changing tasks in the
air", be it AT, TAT or MAT. *Once you've put a dozen in air task
changes under your belt it will be fairly easy to accomplish. Try it
in simulation mode on the ground a bunch of times to get comfortable
then repeat the process in the air, you'll be fine.

As for a software that's "easy to operate, with minimum attention,
fewest steps" I don't know why you would discount GNll, it's certainly
the easiest software I know of to enter tasks on the fly. I also have
Winpilot but prefer GNll , especially in comps for the very reasons
you're looking for it's easy to operate, with minimum attention and
the fewest steps to complete, but with less bell and whistles, hense
easier. Most comps I've attended in the last four years have had one
or two task changes in the air, so count on it occurring.

Regards,
Rick - 21

Rick,

GNII would be perfect but it does not integrate with borgelt
variometers. Software that itegrates well with these variometers
include WinPilot, SeeYou Mobile and possibly flyWithCE (this is at
least what I know). Any experiance on any of them in regards to
entering tasks.

Thank you,

AK

On Dec 28, 3:45 pm, AK wrote:
On Dec 28, 12:12 am, Rick Culbertson wrote:



On Dec 24, 12:58 pm, AK wrote:

Thank you both for your examples I see your point. Do you have any
opinion on what is the best software for PDA in regards to entering
new tasks in the air? What I am looking for is any easy to operate,
with minimum attention, fewest steps software other than Glide
Navigator II. Thx.

AK

Hi AK,
The safety question of changing tasks in air the while somewhat
inconvenient has proven it's self to be a great tool and beneficial
for all concerned as noted by UH & BV. One of the many pre-contest
practice items to add to your check list is "changing tasks in the
air", be it AT, TAT or MAT. Once you've put a dozen in air task
changes under your belt it will be fairly easy to accomplish. Try it
in simulation mode on the ground a bunch of times to get comfortable
then repeat the process in the air, you'll be fine.

As for a software that's "easy to operate, with minimum attention,
fewest steps" I don't know why you would discount GNll, it's certainly
the easiest software I know of to enter tasks on the fly. I also have
Winpilot but prefer GNll , especially in comps for the very reasons
you're looking for it's easy to operate, with minimum attention and
the fewest steps to complete, but with less bell and whistles, hense
easier. Most comps I've attended in the last four years have had one
or two task changes in the air, so count on it occurring.

Regards,
Rick - 21

Rick,

GNII would be perfect but it does not integrate with borgelt
variometers. Software that itegrates well with these variometers
include WinPilot, SeeYou Mobile and possibly flyWithCE (this is at
least what I know). Any experiance on any of them in regards to
entering tasks.

Thank you,

AK

I have flown with WinPilot for a few years and it is easy to set a
task in flight. Two different types of windows you can work with. Do
I like to do it? No! We did too many at the US 15M Nats in 2006.
The changes were good for the task, but I still think it is one of the
most dangerous things we do at a contest. Especially if it involves
TAT's with many turnpoints.

TT

On Dec 22, 3:31 pm, wrote:
The proposed rule changes for 2008 US competition soaring
are posted at SSA.org/sailplane racing/rules & process.
Input is welcome.

Thank you Hank, and the entire rules committee, for faithfully
handling the annual survey and competition rules revisions that keep
our soaring competitions challenging and fair. Being a novice racer
(only two regionals to date), I know I have a long way to go to
understand all the pressures that drive changes in the rules.

I do have a concern with the creation of the Super Regional. I'm not
sure where this suggestion originated, as it was not in the annual
survey responses, but I did see the huge waiting list for Parowan last
year. The result was, as cited in the committee meeting minutes, that
very few out of region pilots were allowed to compete. My concern
stems from the fact that the conflict arises from the limited number
of slots and the super regional makes room for the out of region
pilots by reducing access for in region pilots. I believe this may run
counter to the purpose of regional competitions (to determine a
Regional Champion and to measure the performance of all entrants.
Additionally for Sports class, to provide an entry level for pilots
new to competitive sailplane racing to learn the skills and procedures
used in competition).

Specifically, I'm concerned that allowing a 0% in region slot
reservation may result in no opportunity for new racers to get their
first competition for a specific year. If a 0% slot reservation is set
for a super regional, one could argue the contest is now a mini
nationals. Perhaps there is a way to preserve access for in region
novices while keeping an increased access for out of region slots.

I would ask the rules committee to consider one or more of the
following proposed modifications:
a. Change the percentage of reservation slots for pilots in the region
to 25-75% as a balance to keep some preferred access.
b. Rather than allowing a super regional without restrictions, perhaps
the super regional cannot be declared until a regular regional has
been declared. This ensures opportunity for new in region racers.
c. Rather than establishing a super regional reservation for high
finishers at the specific super regional site, give priority to the
previous year's medallion winners regardless of the in region site.
This would allow top finishers from the pure regional to also get a
shot at the premier site.

Thank you again for allowing us to comment.

Respectfully,

Horst
L33

On Dec 22, 5:31 pm, wrote:
The proposed rule changes for 2008 US competition soaring
are posted at SSA.org/sailplane racing/rules & process.
Input is welcome. Final rules proposals go to the SSA for publication
in the board "Blue Book" in mid January.
Seasons Greetings to all from the SSA Competition Rules Subcommittee
UH
H Nixon
Chair

Could someone explain the origin of 1.02?

The new rule says:
"7. Combined 15-Meter/Standard class
Rule Text
[R]5.8 Competition Classes
[R]5.8.1 Regional FAI-class competitions may include one or more of
the classes described in Rule 6.12.
[R]5.8.2 As an alternative to separate 15-Meter and Standard Classes,
a Combined 15-Meter Class can be
included. To enter this class a sailplane must meet the requirements
for the 15-Meter Class (6.12.4). A
sailplane that also meets the requirements for Standard Class (6.12.5)
can compete in the Combined 15-Meter
Class and receive a 2% daily scored distance bonus.
[N]11.2.3.5 Not applicable
[R]11.2.3.5 For a sailplane competing in a Combined 15-Meter Class
(Rule 5.8.2) that meets the requirements
for Standard Class, scored distance is multiplied by 1.02.
"

A typical glider in 15-meter class is an ASW-27 (if flown in Sports
class it would have a handicap of .88.
A typical glider in standard class is Discus 2 or LS-8 (if flown in
Sport class they would have a handicap of .925)

Assuming the handicap system of sports class reflects performance for
the above gliders ASW-27 is about 5% better than LS-8 or Discus 2.
Mathematically the 2% should be more like 5%.

I would expect this rule if used will drive more standard class pilots
into sports class since they will have no chance in 15-meter class (at
least looking from the math point of view). The situation looks even
worse if you look at gliders like Diana 2.

Am I wrong thinking this number should reflect true differences
between best gliders in both FAI classes?

I think the idea is great the number 1.02 not so great.

copied from L33's post about the Super Regional:
I would ask the rules committee to consider one or more of the
following proposed modifications:
a. Change the percentage of reservation slots for pilots in the region
to 25-75% as a balance to keep some preferred access.
b. Rather than allowing a super regional without restrictions, perhaps
the super regional cannot be declared until a regular regional has
been declared. This ensures opportunity for new in region racers.
c. Rather than establishing a super regional reservation for high
finishers at the specific super regional site, give priority to the
previous year's medallion winners regardless of the in region site.
This would allow top finishers from the pure regional to also get a
shot at the premier site.

Thank you again for allowing us to comment.

Respectfully,

Horst
L33


I have to agree with Horst in this respect. When you have contest
sites like Perry and Parowan (both coasts, if you will)..perhaps a
"super regional" is a GREAT idea...however, what happens to all the
local regional people that want to get started in competition
soaring...where can they go? I have already had a contest
registration from a newbie Region 9 pilot that has not competed
before; for the June 2008 Parowan contest. Although I would like to
take all entries (up to 50% of out of region, because parowan is such
a popular site)...I feel that the region 9 pilots that would like to
START competing are going to be SHUT out, of flying. We are not for
sure (doubtful at best) that Region 9 will have any other regional.
Perhaps we could write into the rules, something to the effect, that
prior approval is required by the Rules Committee before declaring a
"super regional", and that their approval is based upon whether or not
the region in question has another regional that year to make sure
that we aren't forgetting to get new competition pilots involved able
to enter contests!
Just my 2 cents....Micki Minner, 2008 Parowan Region 9 Contest Manager

Rules issues aside, Parowan is not a good site or contest for someone
who does not have a lot of mountain cross country experience. There
will be a full grid of hard-charging national-level pilots, high
altitude downwind takeoffs, big tasks over spikey terrain. I would not
advise this as a first contest for someone with a fresh silver badge.
It will either be scary or discouraging.

Region 9 should hold a regional at a local, familiar site, just like
the other regions. If noone else does it, the pilots should organize
one! If no true "regional" happens, new pilots from Region 9 should
travel to nearby regions. The Hobbs regional, the air sailing sports
contest, or the region 12 contest at Warner springs are all great
places to go for a first contest.

If region 9 isn't producing a true regional, I'm not sure adding a
layer of hoops for the Parowan organizers to go through will help.

Note the super-regional can reserve 0-50% slots for in region, it can
do this differently for different classes, and it can use some inverse
seeding in sports. From the explanation on the SSA webpage: "We want
to give organizers latitude to create the most successful contest."
So the contest organizers can think about all these issues and create
the structure that works the best for their particular site and
region.

John Cochrane

BB wrote:
Rules issues aside, Parowan is not a good site or contest for someone
who does not have a lot of mountain cross country experience. There
will be a full grid of hard-charging national-level pilots, high
altitude downwind takeoffs, big tasks over spikey terrain. I would not
advise this as a first contest for someone with a fresh silver badge.
It will either be scary or discouraging.

When I was a newbie cross-country pilot, I'd go to Parowan every summer
because it was a *safer* place to fly cross country than the places I
normally flew. If you look at a map of the region, you'll note that
pretty much all of the soaring sites out here are near mountains, so
even pilots with fresh silver badges learn to deal with them. Perhaps
the hard-charging national-level pilots should consider going to, say, a
Nationals, if all those silver-level pilots are getting in their way...

Marc

On Dec 30, 5:26*pm, Marc Ramsey wrote:
If you look at a map of the region, you'll note that pretty much all
of the soaring sites out here are near mountains, so even pilots with
fresh silver badges learn to deal with them. *

Marc,
Good point. I fly out of Black Forest with a field elevation of
7,000 feet and was foolish enough to earn my Silver Badge by setting
Pike's Peak (elev 14.110) as my goal to attain the 50KM distance. Some
may feel I made it too hard on myself but it has paid huge dividends
on growing my sailplane experience.
Of course, a career as a fighter pilot helped a lot as well. I
turned to soaring after retirement because the cross country tasks
give me about the same level of intensity for risk assessment and
decision making.
Finally, my club has a wealth of very helpful world class
sailplane pilots. They become especially helpful when I bring in beer
before asking them about techniques and strategies ;-0.
All this has helped me advance very quickly, but I also know not
every glider guider has this full house of advantages. Hopefully there
is a way to balance the challenge of starting new folks in racing with
the desire to keep it interesting for the old heads, regardless of the
site.

Good Soaring and Happy New Year,

Horst
L33

BB wrote:
Rules issues aside, Parowan is not a good site or contest for someone
who does not have a lot of mountain cross country experience. There
will be a full grid of hard-charging national-level pilots, high
altitude downwind takeoffs, big tasks over spikey terrain. I would not
advise this as a first contest for someone with a fresh silver badge.
It will either be scary or discouraging.

Region 9 should hold a regional at a local, familiar site, just like
the other regions. If noone else does it, the pilots should organize
one! If no true "regional" happens, new pilots from Region 9 should
travel to nearby regions. The Hobbs regional, the air sailing sports
contest, or the region 12 contest at Warner springs are all great
places to go for a first contest.

If region 9 isn't producing a true regional, I'm not sure adding a
layer of hoops for the Parowan organizers to go through will help.

Note the super-regional can reserve 0-50% slots for in region, it can
do this differently for different classes, and it can use some inverse
seeding in sports. From the explanation on the SSA webpage: "We want
to give organizers latitude to create the most successful contest."
So the contest organizers can think about all these issues and create
the structure that works the best for their particular site and
region.

John Cochrane

I don't particularly like the new super regional rule. May be OK when
there are other nearby regionals, but that almost never happens out here
in Region 9. From Denver, Parowan is 500 miles and the next closest
regional contest is often 1000 road miles. It is our local contest.

The die hard, experienced Region 9 contest pilots will still likely get
in if its a super regional. The real newbies may also get in if any
slots are available for reverse seeding. But that will leave a bunch of
pilots that have tried racing and liked it, but did not score very well,
with no place to go race within a days drive. Does not seem like the
best interest of the sport to allow experienced out of region pilots to
bump local want to be's from their only available venue. That goes
against the point of the regional contest system in the first place.

But then even if the new proposed rule is approved, it is still up to
the organizers whether they want their contest to be a super regional or
not. Its an option, not a requirement. We'll have to wait and see, but
I'm sure they will get pressure from both sides, which will make the job
a whole lot less fun.

So, if Parowan does go "Super", is there any interest out there in
organizing or flying in a "reliever" regional on the eastern edge of the
Rockies?

Its good to live in Region 9, where everyone wants to take their soaring
vacation

-Dave Leonard