Opinions wanted

In message , ArtKramr
writes
I am going to outline a real situaitoin that occured during WW II. I would
like to hear opinions and solutions as to how the situation should be handled.
I will give the real solutuion that was imposed during the war after a week or
so when many opinions have been offered.

There was a large factory producing torpedo gyroscopes and timeing devices
for the German submarine service. It was located in the midst of a very
populated area where the highly skilled workers lived with their families.
These workers were near irreplaceable. It took many years to learn the needed
skills, and without these workers production and quality would have been
dramatically down graded. One more point. This factory was not in any country
with which America or England was at war. What would you have done? Remember
these German torpedoes were slaughtering American and British seamen and
denying food and arms to England. What would you have done? Opinions?

I'd investigate the supply route those systems get to Germany by. Is it
along a sea route with anywhere convenient that RN destroyers could make
pointed inspections of neutral shipping, looking for and seizing war
materiel like torpedo gyroscopes? (You rarely get so lucky, but it's
worth checking)

Is there any political leverage that can be applied to persuade this
country to stop selling to a belligerent? (Or are we also buying
important precision components from them? That last confuses issues
badly and limits our more vehement options)

Can we outbid the Germans for those components? Good gyroscopes are
worth having with quite a lot of applications. US torpedoes are having
major depth-keeping problems until about 1944, can we get a solution
made there to keep those expensive neutral workers too busy to make
German components? And do these 'neutrals' make tumble-resistant
gyroscopes? I know there's at least one bombardier who'd really like one
for his Norden

Declaring war on them and bombing the hell out of the city district
where the factory sits is an option to consider, but may have more
problems than benefits.



Offhand I'd guess the factory was maybe in Switzerland, more likely
Sweden, and I think the eventual answer was to grit teeth, bear it, and
sink the U-boats so they never get to fire the torpedoes.

--
When you have to kill a man, it costs nothing to be polite.
W S Churchill

Paul J. Adam MainBoxatjrwlynch[dot]demon{dot}co(.)uk

Subject: Opinions wanted
From: "Paul J. Adam"
Date: 1/5/04 1:59 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:

In message , ArtKramr
writes
I am going to outline a real situaitoin that occured during WW II. I would
like to hear opinions and solutions as to how the situation should be
handled.
I will give the real solutuion that was imposed during the war after a week
or
so when many opinions have been offered.

There was a large factory producing torpedo gyroscopes and timeing devices
for the German submarine service. It was located in the midst of a very
populated area where the highly skilled workers lived with their families.
These workers were near irreplaceable. It took many years to learn the
needed
skills, and without these workers production and quality would have been
dramatically down graded. One more point. This factory was not in any
country
with which America or England was at war. What would you have done?
Remember
these German torpedoes were slaughtering American and British seamen and
denying food and arms to England. What would you have done? Opinions?

I'd investigate the supply route those systems get to Germany by. Is it
along a sea route with anywhere convenient that RN destroyers could make
pointed inspections of neutral shipping, looking for and seizing war
materiel like torpedo gyroscopes? (You rarely get so lucky, but it's
worth checking)

Is there any political leverage that can be applied to persuade this
country to stop selling to a belligerent? (Or are we also buying
important precision components from them? That last confuses issues
badly and limits our more vehement options)

Can we outbid the Germans for those components? Good gyroscopes are
worth having with quite a lot of applications. US torpedoes are having
major depth-keeping problems until about 1944, can we get a solution
made there to keep those expensive neutral workers too busy to make
German components? And do these 'neutrals' make tumble-resistant
gyroscopes? I know there's at least one bombardier who'd really like one
for his Norden

Declaring war on them and bombing the hell out of the city district
where the factory sits is an option to consider, but may have more
problems than benefits.



Offhand I'd guess the factory was maybe in Switzerland, more likely
Sweden, and I think the eventual answer was to grit teeth, bear it, and
sink the U-boats so they never get to fire the torpedoes.

--

Interesting set of options you offer. I think you will find the truth to be
beyond your wildlest dreams.


Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer

From: (ArtKramr)
Date: 1/5/2004 12:22 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

I am going to outline a real situaitoin that occured during WW II. I would
like to hear opinions and solutions as to how the situation should be
handled.
I will give the real solutuion that was imposed during the war after a week
or
so when many opinions have been offered.

There was a large factory producing torpedo gyroscopes and timeing devices
for the German submarine service. It was located in the midst of a very
populated area where the highly skilled workers lived with their families.
These workers were near irreplaceable. It took many years to learn the needed

skills, and without these workers production and quality would have been
dramatically down graded. One more point. This factory was not in any country
with which America or England was at war. What would you have done? Remember
these German torpedoes were slaughtering American and British seamen and
denying food and arms to England. What would you have done? Opinions?




Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer


I believe you are referring to Switzerland. The problem in questions was solved
by "accidentally" bombing a ball bearing (?) factory if memory serves.

Dan, U. S. Air Force, retired

Subject: Opinions wanted
From: (B2431)
Date: 1/5/04 2:19 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:

From: (ArtKramr)
Date: 1/5/2004 12:22 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

I am going to outline a real situaitoin that occured during WW II. I would
like to hear opinions and solutions as to how the situation should be
handled.
I will give the real solutuion that was imposed during the war after a week
or
so when many opinions have been offered.

There was a large factory producing torpedo gyroscopes and timeing devices
for the German submarine service. It was located in the midst of a very
populated area where the highly skilled workers lived with their families.
These workers were near irreplaceable. It took many years to learn the
needed

skills, and without these workers production and quality would have been
dramatically down graded. One more point. This factory was not in any
country
with which America or England was at war. What would you have done?
Remember
these German torpedoes were slaughtering American and British seamen and
denying food and arms to England. What would you have done? Opinions?




Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer


I believe you are referring to Switzerland. The problem in questions was
solved
by "accidentally" bombing a ball bearing (?) factory if memory serves.

Dan, U. S. Air Force, retired


Close but not quite there. Sorry. No Cigar. Besides no fair using your memory.
This is for guys who weren't there.


Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer

From: (ArtKramr)
Date: 1/5/2004 4:36 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

Subject: Opinions wanted
From: (B2431)
Date: 1/5/04 2:19 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:

From: (ArtKramr)
Date: 1/5/2004 12:22 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

I am going to outline a real situaitoin that occured during WW II. I
would
like to hear opinions and solutions as to how the situation should be
handled.
I will give the real solutuion that was imposed during the war after a week
or
so when many opinions have been offered.

There was a large factory producing torpedo gyroscopes and timeing
devices
for the German submarine service. It was located in the midst of a very
populated area where the highly skilled workers lived with their families.
These workers were near irreplaceable. It took many years to learn the
needed

skills, and without these workers production and quality would have been
dramatically down graded. One more point. This factory was not in any
country
with which America or England was at war. What would you have done?
Remember
these German torpedoes were slaughtering American and British seamen and
denying food and arms to England. What would you have done? Opinions?




Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer


I believe you are referring to Switzerland. The problem in questions was
solved
by "accidentally" bombing a ball bearing (?) factory if memory serves.

Dan, U. S. Air Force, retired


Close but not quite there. Sorry. No Cigar. Besides no fair using your
memory.
This is for guys who weren't there.


Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS


Awww, you are no fun.

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

"ArtKramr" wrote in message
...
Close but not quite there. Sorry. No Cigar. Besides no fair using your
memory.
This is for guys who weren't there.

How about infiltrate the civilian workforce in order to hamper production,
or lower reliability and effectiveness of the components?

Si

A wild and wacky thought comes to mind, like arranging the the factory
to be "bombed" and the product is "destroyed" (shipped elsewhere) and
they are no longer able to produce more (at least for the Germans). I
don't know if the real thing is anything like that, but I have the
impression that some pretty implausible schemes were considered, and
even tried during the Big One. Or if the Allies couldn't buy them or
interdict them, perhaps they could encourage them to compromise quality
control? What can you do about contaminated bearings or not cleaning off
enough of the acid core solder residue....

Subject: Opinions wanted
From: (ArtKramr)

Hello Art, I would purchase the entire factory, if I couldn't do that I'd
purchase all of their produced munitions, then use or sell them as I saw fit .
AL

"ArtKramr" wrote in message
...
I am going to outline a real situaitoin that occured during WW II. I
would
like to hear opinions and solutions as to how the situation should be
handled.
I will give the real solutuion that was imposed during the war after a
week or
so when many opinions have been offered.

There was a large factory producing torpedo gyroscopes and timeing
devices
for the German submarine service. It was located in the midst of a very
populated area where the highly skilled workers lived with their families.
These workers were near irreplaceable. It took many years to learn the
needed
skills, and without these workers production and quality would have been
dramatically down graded. One more point. This factory was not in any
country
with which America or England was at war. What would you have done?
Remember
these German torpedoes were slaughtering American and British seamen and
denying food and arms to England. What would you have done? Opinions?

The resonse depends on the country, and its then-current ties and
affiliations. This one is handled differently from that one. Quite similar
to today's dilema regarding Iraq and N. Korea.

Pete

Send in the U.S. OSS or British MI6, let then take care of it on the ground.
Jack

--
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"ArtKramr" wrote in message
...
I am going to outline a real situaitoin that occured during WW II. I
would
like to hear opinions and solutions as to how the situation should be
handled.
I will give the real solutuion that was imposed during the war after a
week or
so when many opinions have been offered.

There was a large factory producing torpedo gyroscopes and timeing
devices
for the German submarine service. It was located in the midst of a very
populated area where the highly skilled workers lived with their families.
These workers were near irreplaceable. It took many years to learn the
needed
skills, and without these workers production and quality would have been
dramatically down graded. One more point. This factory was not in any
country
with which America or England was at war. What would you have done?
Remember
these German torpedoes were slaughtering American and British seamen and
denying food and arms to England. What would you have done? Opinions?




Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer