Mt. Saint Helens

Philip Sondericker wrote in message ...
in article fT27d.3595$mS1.2578@fed1read05, BTIZ at
wrote on 9/30/04 7:00 PM:

that would be one heck of a thermal ride... if it weren't for the rocks...
and "cough cough" the ash..

BT

I was thinking about this recently, and I was trying to determine exactly
what the effects would be on a small plane flying into an ash cloud. How
long would it take for the air filter to become completely clogged? And at
that point, assuming the plane had a carburetor, what would be the effect on
the engine? Would the plugs become fouled? Would they fire at all?

I'm a new pilot and relatively ignorant of engine operations, so I'm curious
to hear the answers.


Flying through forest fire smoke can roast and asphyxiate you. I'm
assuming volcanic ash is just as hot if not hotter (but possibly with
more oxygen). The air filter and spark plugs will be the least of your
worries at that point : )

-lance smith

"Orval Fairbairn" wrote in message
news
In article ,
Philip Sondericker wrote:

in article fT27d.3595$mS1.2578@fed1read05, BTIZ at

wrote on 9/30/04 7:00 PM:

that would be one heck of a thermal ride... if it weren't for the
rocks...
and "cough cough" the ash..

BT

I was thinking about this recently, and I was trying to determine
exactly
what the effects would be on a small plane flying into an ash cloud. How
long would it take for the air filter to become completely clogged? And
at
that point, assuming the plane had a carburetor, what would be the
effect on
the engine? Would the plugs become fouled? Would they fire at all?

I'm a new pilot and relatively ignorant of engine operations, so I'm
curious
to hear the answers.



You can count on an early overhaul, at best. During the 1980s, several
turbine aircraft, including a B747, encountered ash clouds in flight.
The ash is so abrasive that it eroded the compressors to the point of
flameout. The B747 descended to ~10000 ft before they got three engines
relit. A C130 had similar problems.

New Zealand-based pilots , especially those close to the central range on N
Island, have to deal with ash from time to time. When I visited in 1997, our
747 was sent from Auckland airport an hour early because Ruapehu was acting
up. Any Kiwis here can comment?

-- David Brooks

Philip Sondericker wrote in message ...
in article fT27d.3595$mS1.2578@fed1read05, BTIZ at
wrote on 9/30/04 7:00 PM:

that would be one heck of a thermal ride... if it weren't for the rocks...
and "cough cough" the ash..

BT

I was thinking about this recently, and I was trying to determine exactly
what the effects would be on a small plane flying into an ash cloud. How
long would it take for the air filter to become completely clogged? And at
that point, assuming the plane had a carburetor, what would be the effect on
the engine? Would the plugs become fouled? Would they fire at all?

I'm a new pilot and relatively ignorant of engine operations, so I'm curious
to hear the answers.
Phillip
If you were unlucky enough, or foolish enough to fly into a volcanic
ash cloud, your engine would probably quit within minutes. That is if
the turbulence, or heat, or other potential trash like huge boulders
isn't in there to get you first!
The ash would quickly plug the air filter choking out the airflow. The
ash would most likely corrode your windscreen to an opaque as well as
take off paint from the leading edges. The engine may quit entirely or
just run weakly. there are reports of jet aircraft that sucked up ash
cloud and destroyed the engines from the abrasive pumice they
ingested. Many people to the east of St Helens had some expensive
repairs to their vehicles after all the ash had settled. It was a
couple of feet deep in many places as far away as 90-100 miles in the
Columbia Basin and Moses Lake area.
A friend of mine was crop dusting east of St Helens in the Palouse
area, a day after it exploded, when he said the ash entered the
cockpit of the spray plane and he couldn't even see the panel! Only
many thousands of hours of experience saved him from crashing.
Oddly enough I was flying around St Helens about two weeks before it
blew up. Got some pics of the snow melting around the top of the
mountain. After I saw the eruption, I had to shake my head that I
wasn't flying over it then!! I did a lot of crop dusting in the WA/OR
area and some of it was on the south slopes of St Helen.

Ol shy & Bashful

There are plenty of films of people driving around
in the ash cloud.


They are likely driving at ten percent power.

Jose

--
(for Email, make the obvious changes in my address)

"John Clear" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Peter Duniho wrote:

No kidding? I'm shocked.

I've never heard the less then a dozen people left, but one of
those Discovery Channel type shows awhile back was on using DNA
markers to trace how humans have moved around and interbred over
the years. One of the things they found was that at one point,
the human population was drastically reduced to ~10,000 people.

Don't take Peter too seriously. If you see him on the street and say, "Nice
day," he will reply, "Who are you, the weatherman?" :-)

that reduced the worldwide human population to fewer than a
dozen individuals

Never heard that one before. Fewer than 12 people remaining, around the
entire globe you say? Yeah, right. I doubt any scientist with an actual
clue believes that.

Well, there *is* a certain well-documented story, very widely known
around the world, about a group of only 8 people left remaining after
a planet-wide calamity wiped out the rest of the human population, but
you probably don't believe that one either.

"Rutger" wrote in message
om...
Well, there *is* a certain well-documented story, very widely known
around the world, about a group of only 8 people left remaining after
a planet-wide calamity wiped out the rest of the human population, but
you probably don't believe that one either.

Nope, I don't. Anyone who takes that story literally just isn't using their
noodle.

By the way, you have a funny definition of "well documented". There are
many versions of that story, none of which agree with each other in any
significant detail.

"Rutger" wrote in message
om...
that reduced the worldwide human population to fewer than a
dozen individuals

Never heard that one before. Fewer than 12 people remaining, around the
entire globe you say? Yeah, right. I doubt any scientist with an
actual
clue believes that.

Well, there *is* a certain well-documented story, very widely known
around the world, about a group of only 8 people left remaining after
a planet-wide calamity wiped out the rest of the human population, but
you probably don't believe that one either.

The Hitchhikers Guide To The Galaxy?

Paul

MLenoch wrote:
I was in the St. Helens ash fallout in 1980. I was in a hanger in Wenachee WA
repairing the landing gear of a Steen Skybolt. The ash got into everything.
My car was inside the hanger with the doors & windows closed. The ash got
inside anyway.
In mid morning when the volcano blew, I heard the eruption. I wasn't near any
radio/TV, thus I thought I heard a sonic boom from a passing fighter. A few
hours later the ash came, preceeded by dark clouds like a midwestern fast
moving cold front....little did I know.
VL

Yep...I went down to Centralia (south of Olympia) and there was a few
inches of ash solidly covering the highways. They scooped most of it up
but it still remains to this day in huge piles along side of I-5 where
the Toutle river intersects.

The huge old growth fir trees that surrounded Mt St. Helens were knocked
down like toothpicks--it's quite the sight to see these monsters all
laying down pointing away from the mountain for 10 miles. They were so
impregnated with the silica-based ash that the logging companies
couldn't economically harvest them because the blades on their saws were
wearing out too fast.

Still, and as I mention in the newest thread on this subject below,
there are no notams or airmets out. I wonder why?

Antonio

Corky Scott wrote:

On Fri, 01 Oct 2004 02:20:25 GMT, Philip Sondericker
wrote:

I was thinking about this recently, and I was trying to determine
exactly what the effects would be on a small plane flying into an ash
cloud.

I recall reading a first hand experience of exactly what you are
describing.

Hi Corky,

the story you related is in my memory as well. About ten years ago, I
used to read flying stories from a gopher server. This was called the
"rec.aviation archive". It had a collection of around 50 great stories,
among them the Mount St. Helens one. Unfortunately, I have been unable to
locate this information ever since. The closest I came was the following
old posting but the link in there does not work anymo
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm...ercury.mcs.com
Does anybody know a new location of the mentioned site?

There were some other gems among the stories, too. I recall vividly a
visit to a Concorde cockpit and the famous Cessna hijack story (still
online today at http://www.prime-mover.org/Personal/travis.txt).


Greetings,
Markus