Private air strip..... yes or no???

" just an average Farlang..." wrote:

Yesterday I took a flying lesson with a chief piot and he told me a
small plane can lift off after about a thousand feet of runway and
then the maximum climb would be about 500 feet per minute.

A Maule 235 will be off the ground in 250'. It will be about 1,000' up when it
passes over your house. An Aviat Husky will be higher than that. Performance
varies a lot from aircraft to aircraft.

He thought for a plane to stay the necessaary elevation over my property the
pilot is required a total of no less than 4000 feet.

Well, there isn't any regulation specifying a "necessary elevation" when landing
or taking off, so he's wrong there. The FAA *does* specify some requirements for
public use fields, but not for private ones. That instructor may have been
thinking of those.

George Patterson
A diplomat is a person who can tell you to go to hell in such a way that
you look forward to the trip.

I think I
already commented that I didn't know the extent of what the other
landowner intended to do. One flight one day of the month would be
peachy.


Have you tried to the novel approach of going down there and talking to him
to see what he is planning?? Maybe its not as bad as you imagine.

On Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:21:21 -0500 (EST), "" just an average "
Farlang..." wrote in Message-Id:
bm9yaWtv.2c49808e3f2f35f5431910160ea416b5@1076505 681.nulluser.com:

Can anyone tell me what criteria, rules, regulations a person needs to
be allowed to construct a private runway on his or her property.

The FAA and AOPA can provide that information:

www.faa.gov
www.aopa.org

Visit the web sites, and search for pertinent information. Contact
them by phone, and ask questions.

I know there are many factors that are not presently known in this
scenario but I can try to input as much as I know.

My neighbor owns land that is 2600 feet wide. The elevation is about
3000 feet and the hottest temperature is 91 degrees in the summer. The land
is located in Idaho. The prevailing winds position the optimal take off
direction to be directly over my house about 1500 feet from the
property line. I LOVE airplanes! I worked for Boeing (Lazy B) for the last
fifteen years. I worked at Cessna in Witchita before that. I stop to watch
planes take off and land. I LOVE PLANES!!! But what I don't love is buying 500
acres to finally get some peace and quiet and then having some loud
plane buzz my house at will.

I can see how the threat of aircraft might be disturbing to someone
seeking solitude. But if you are located near a highway, the highway
traffic noise will occur NON STOP day and night continuously.
Aircraft noise, on the other hand, is an infrequent, intermittent
occurrence lasting significantly less than a minute in duration. It
the impact won't be nearly as unpleasant as I think you might be
imagining.

The person wanting to put in the runway has
money to build a 3 floor nice house so I expect they will want to be
socialites and invite all their friends to fly in for a barbacue on the weekend.

Landing aircraft are typically operating at low power in a glide, so
half of the operations will be significantly quieter than you may be
anticipating. Take offs are generally full-power, and can be quite
noisy, but of short duration.

Should your worst case scenario (weekend fly-in barbecue) occur, I
think you'd be pleasantly surprised at how painless it might really
be.

I talked to planning and zoning and they don't even know what
prospective planes will be flown there i.e. ultralites or larger planes that
require longer runways. I would like to think it is being fair for me to
expect no planes flying over my land below 500 feet whether taking off, landing
or pattern flying.

Unfortunately, Code of Federal Regulation Title 14: Aeronautics and
Space, PART 91—GENERAL OPERATING AND FLIGHT RULES, § 91.119 exempts
landing and departing aircraft from the 500' minimum proximity to any
person, vessel, vehicle, or structure.
http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text....1.3.10.2.5.10

But I suspect that the environmental impact you are
imagining/anticipating is of a vastly larger magnitude than that which
may actually occur. In any given 24-hour period, given the single
owner commuting to/from work or town, there would likely be a total of
about one minute or two of objectionable noise; that's a very small
proportion.

I bought my land and paid for the use of each and every
acre. If by putting in a runway on the edge of my property that means
they are helping themselves to a sort of "easement" flying a hundred feet
or so over my land that doesn't seem at all fair. I may wish to build a barn,
corral animals (which might go crazy) penned up with planes buzzing
over them.

I understand. I would feel the same. But feelings are no substitute
for hard facts.

A thoughtful neighbor would have contacted the land owners who may be
affected before planning the construction of a runway. He would then
have an opportunity to mollify and assuage the fears of those who may
be adversely impacted. Why not give your neighbor an opportunity to
present his side before getting yourself too worked up over the rumor?
Even if your new neighbor doesn't know how to be neighborly, it
doesn't mean you can't enlighten him, and show him how a responsible
and considerate neighbor should behave in a small community.

Can I get some ideas on what is realistic?

Perhaps.

I don't even know what a common length of runway is but a friend of
mine told me using generic table calculations that a fully loaded small
plane on a hot day could very well need a long take off and after lift
off ....
how long a distance til that plane gets to minimal required elevation?

How long is a piece of string; quantifying such parameters requires
knowledge of the type of aircraft, its load, meteorologic conditions,
pilot proficiency, ...

Yesterday I took a flying lesson with a chief piot and he told me a
small plane can lift off after about a thousand feet of runway and
then the maximum climb would be about 500 feet per minute. He thought
for a plane to stay the necessaary elevation over my property the
pilot is required a total of no less than 4000 feet. The runway will
be a dirt strip which also requires more distance.

That estimate seems in the ball park.

any comments would be appreciated

Take courage in hand, and talk to your neighbor. Quit guessing and
imagining what he has planned. Ask him about the type of aircraft he
intends to operate, the frequency of operations, the time of day/night
of intended operations, how he intends to mitigate the noise impact of
his operations on his neighbors, etc. Tell him of your concerns
regarding safety, livestock impact, noise pollution, ... If he proves
unreasonable, retain an attorney; if he is willing to consider your
needs and accept responsibility for minimizing the negative impact his
intended activities may have, it'll probably work out fine.

If you are training to become a pilot, it might make more sense to
build the runway on a part of your 1.5 mile strip of land, so
operational noise impacts both of you less than it might if the runway
were on his parcel. And sharing the expenses involved in constructing
and maintaining the runway will be half. Who knows, he might be
willing to grant you use his airplane in exchange for use of your
runway: win-win.

"just an average Farlang..." wrote in message
news:bm9yaWtv.2c49808e3f2f35f5431910160ea416b5@107 6505681.nulluser.com...
Can anyone tell me what criteria, rules, regulations a person needs to
be
allowed to construct a private runway on his or her property.

The FAA just requires 90 day notice of intent to construct an air strip.
There are no rules or permission required from them. Just notification.

The bigger issue is always the local land use people.

EDR wrote:
In article busWb.278549$xy6.1422325@attbi_s02, Newps
wrote:


You do not own the airspace above your house. As long as it is legal
for him to have a runway on his property you are out of luck.


Not quite true.
Nothing to stop him from erecting a 500 foot tower on his property in
line with the runway.

Which doesn't affect what I said one iota.

I would like to think it is being fair for me to
expect no planes flying over my land below 500 feet

The reg is 500 feet from persons and property, when not taking off or
landing. If an airplane is just flying by there is no minimum altitude
required over the surface.

"Newps" wrote in message news:FWtWb.148128$U%5.676158@attbi_s03...


Not quite true.
Nothing to stop him from erecting a 500 foot tower on his property in
line with the runway.

Which doesn't affect what I said one iota.

Also the premise is true. You can't erect a tower with impunity either.
In addition to the local land use issues, towers that tall would require
FAA notification before they are constructed.

"just an average Farlang" wrote in
message
news:bm9yaWtv.a91bf72558d3777dd8d2f281cb08ef0c@107 6521641.nulluser.com

In Short... See original subject of message. I am trying to collect
information, (not personal feelings) as to whether a private air strip
is allowed according to federal regulations or common sense if it
known a plane cannot possibly take off with regards to a total of 2600
feet.

That question has been answered several times in this thread.

BTW, what makes you think it is "known a plane cannot possibly take off"
with a 2600' runway? I do it all the time.

--
John T
http://tknowlogy.com/TknoFlyer
http://www.pocketgear.com/products_s...veloperid=4415
____________________

" just an average Farlang..." wrote:

In Short... See original subject of message. I am trying to collect
information, (not personal feelings) as to whether a private air strip
is allowed according to federal regulations or common sense if it
known a plane cannot possibly take off with regards to a total of 2600
feet.

In short, plenty of planes can take off in that distance, so your statement
as to what you're trying to do is false on the face of it.

I lived on 5 acres and it is possible to take off and land a
cessna on that length of area so does that mean I can do as I please
and buzz over the next few miles just because the plane left the
ground on my own property?

Pretty much.

George Patterson
A diplomat is a person who can tell you to go to hell in such a way that
you look forward to the trip.

EDR wrote:

Nothing to stop him from erecting a 500 foot tower on his property in
line with the runway.

I would not care to be the defense lawyer if his neighbor crashes due to the
tower and it comes out that the only reason he built it was to interfere with
airplanes.

George Patterson
A diplomat is a person who can tell you to go to hell in such a way that
you look forward to the trip.