Terrain Avoidance at Night

"BTIZ" wrote:
know where you are know where the ground is and if lights in the
distance start blinking or disappearing there is either a cloud between
you and the light or solid ground

This is a crucial point. I am always amazed when I fly licensed pilots at
night and they don't understand BTIZ's point.

At HPN, 29 has a displaced threshold due to trees just beyond the airport
boundary, and no VASI. If you're on final, the trees are invisible, but
the threshold lighting is bright and clear. If the threshold lights
suddenly disappear, that means you've fallen below a flight path that keeps
you clear of the trees.

When this happens, I'll say something like, "You're too low". If that
doesn't get a reaction pretty fast, the next hint is a much more emphatic,
"You need to climb NOW", quickly followed by my taking the controls. Some
people just don't seem to get it.

In a situation like this, the first glimpse you'll get of the trees is when
branches start coming through the windshield.

BTW, if the lights straight below you start blinking, that's because you're
looking straight down through a thin layer of ground fog. You take off a
little before sunset on a clear evening with a small temp/dewpoint spread.
The sun goes down, radiation cooling drops the surface temp 5 or 10
degrees, and suddenly there's fog. Maybe not in Pheonix, but it happens a
lot around here. This is bad news. A 100 foot thick layer of fog makes
the lights twinkle when you're looking straight down through it. On final,
when you're looking through it at an oblique angle, it's zero-zero landing
conditions.

On 12 Sep 2006 17:16:19 -0700, "Dan" wrote:

My early years of flying were spent in the Midwest where as long as you
were over 2000 MSL, there were very few obstacles to hit and no
terrain. Now that I have moved out West (Phoenix) I am increasingly
paranoid about hitting terrain at night.

Choosing a cruise altitude is easy (well above anything even close to
your route). However, what I worry about is my letdown to pattern
altitude at the destination airport as well as departure. Short of
filing IFR (which carries with it Oxygen requirements for some local
MEAs) what other strategies do you all use? Any "systems" or
tricks to share, or is it pretty much just look at the sectional and
make a plan?

I am a Midwesterner, but worry about the same when traveling far from
Chicago.

A few thoughts...

1. Review sectionals prior to flight, and make sure you are above the
MEF on all segments. This may not be realistic/practical in all
locations b/c the highest point in the quadrant may be far away from
where you are flying, un-necessarily driving a higher altitude.

2. Buy a Garmin 496 handheld with Terrain database. In addition to
all the other cool stuff, it will give you realtime terrain relative
to your location. The comfort factor is huge.

-Nathan

Jay Beckman writes:

So now we're an expert in geography?

It depends on the location.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

On 12 Sep 2006 17:16:19 -0700, "Dan" wrote in
. com:

However, what I worry about is my letdown to pattern
altitude at the destination airport as well as departure.

It might be prudent to check here while planning your flight:

http://www.ngs.noaa.gov/AERO/dole.htm
The Airport Obstruction Chart (AOC) is a 1:12,000 scale graphic
(1:18,000 scale graphic for Denver International DEN 9077)
depicting Federal Aviation Regulations Part 77 surfaces, a
representation of objects that penetrate these surfaces, runway,
taxiway, and ramp areas, navigational aids, prominent airport
buildings, plus a selection of roads and other planimetric detail
in the airport vicinity.

"Dan" wrote in message
ups.com...
Any "systems" or tricks to share, or is it pretty much just
look at the sectional and make a plan?

If it's a clear night, stay up high until you can see the airport and then
descend... I once had to go from 14,000 ft to the 2011 ft pattern altitude
in 8 nm due to a TFR between the ridge and the airport... Throttle back to
80 kts, add full flaps, keep adding nose down pitch to maintain an 80 kt
descent... Couldn't even see the horizon through the top of the windshield
in my Grumman... Basically hanging on the flaps in a 2000+ fpm descent... At
around 4000 ft, I started reducing the flap setting and reducing the
elevator trim... Came out right on top of the airport and ready to intersect
the downwind at midfield... Interesting experience...

Oh, PLEEZE keep doing that. My kids need college money and I want a Hawaii
vacation next year. I make a lot of money from shock-cooled engine work.

Jim
A&P IA



"Grumman-581" wrote in message
...


If it's a clear night, stay up high until you can see the airport and then
descend... I once had to go from 14,000 ft to the 2011 ft pattern altitude
in 8 nm due to a TFR between the ridge and the airport... Throttle back to
80 kts, add full flaps, keep adding nose down pitch to maintain an 80 kt
descent... Couldn't even see the horizon through the top of the windshield
in my Grumman... Basically hanging on the flaps in a 2000+ fpm descent...
At
around 4000 ft, I started reducing the flap setting and reducing the
elevator trim... Came out right on top of the airport and ready to
intersect
the downwind at midfield... Interesting experience...

The sectional and preflight planning are OK, but in Arizona, you can see
your target destination from 50 to 100 miles out at night. When letting
down, if the lights of the city or the lights of the airport start to go
away, there is something big between you and the target.

Jim


"Dan" wrote in message
ups.com...


Any "systems" or
tricks to share, or is it pretty much just look at the sectional and
make a plan?

--Dan

RST Engineering writes:

Oh, PLEEZE keep doing that. My kids need college money and I want a Hawaii
vacation next year. I make a lot of money from shock-cooled engine work.

What is a shock-cooled engine?

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

Mxsmanic wrote:
RST Engineering writes:

Oh, PLEEZE keep doing that. My kids need college money and I want a Hawaii
vacation next year. I make a lot of money from shock-cooled engine work.

What is a shock-cooled engine?

Something that doesn't happen in MS flight sim.

In some real planes, however, if you've been flying in cruise for
a while, and you quickly pull the power back hard for a fast
descent, you can cool the engine quickly and unevenly, causing
stress and eventual damage.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shock_cooling_(engines)

Dan wrote:
... Short of
filing IFR (which carries with it Oxygen requirements for some local
MEAs) what other strategies do you all use? Any "systems" or
tricks to share, or is it pretty much just look at the sectional and
make a plan?

--Dan

I fly out of DVT also. I earned my PP-ASEL in 2002, and in the
following year I made a couple of night VFR cross country trips - one
from Tucson to DVT and one from LAS to DVT. The trip from Tucson was a
repeat of the night XC trip I took while training and it was very
comfortable and enjoyable. There is a lot of civilization along I-10
between Phoenix and Tucson, and in VMC the visual reference to the
horizon at night is pretty much as easy to maintain as in daylight.
The pre-dawn trip home from Las Vegas was another story. It was, as
you say, pretty much "look at the sectional and make a plan".
There was very little moonlight that morning, and although the weather
was clear and a million my trust in the attitude indicator was as
critical to the success of the flight as it would have been in IMC.
The flight went without a hitch, but not having flown at night away
from the comfortable blanket of city lights in a couple of years I
wouldn't make that trip today without a CFI in the right seat.

My current personal minimums with respect to night flight away from the
city now are "VFR, night, mountainous terrain - pick any two at once
but not all three". I'm just starting to work on my instrument rating
now, so that pretty much means my X-C travel is all during the day. I
didn't learn about Obstacle Departure Procedures while training for the
private certificate. Now that I know of their existence and
application I'd use them even VFR to get out of an unfamiliar airport
near any rising terrain at night.

I do frequently enjoy taking in the city lights. I just don't venture
far from the city at night these days. Familiarize yourself with the
McDowell Mountains, Camelback & Squaw Peak (renamed Piestewa Peak a few
years ago, but still referred to on the charts, by ATC, and by many if
not most locals as Squaw Peak), South Mountain (the one with all the
radio and TV towers), the White Tanks, the Sierra Estrella, and the San
Tan mountains, and you'll be pretty much good to go. Utilize the VFR
class B transition right up and over Squaw Peak - in my experience,
Phoenix Approach has never been anything but accommodating.

The little bumps right off the east end of Deer Valley can be quite
intimidating at night (and take note of this current NOTAM: DVT 08/021
DVT HILL UNKN .5 E LGTS OTS TIL 0609302359). I keep a feel for flying
around them in the dark by regularly practicing touch-and-go's at
sunset. Get a few landings in while they're still clearly visible, and
you'll have a feel for their height and location relative to your
departure profile as it gets dark. On a high DA day the bumps off the
end of 7L (the short north runway) are very much a factor.

Rob