Abject surrender

"Jarg" wrote in message
om...

"Yeff" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 15 Mar 2004 20:40:55 -0600, Tony wrote:

Well, we now have the first surrender in the War on Terror. Spain
has
surrendered to Al Quada and will remove its troops from Iraq.

Spain held an election and the people spoke. Damn democracy!

-Jeff B.
yeff at erols dot com

And people often get the government they deserve. But I hope that
isn't so
in this case.

Might well be the case.

I wonder if the new Socialist govt realises that AQ hates left wing
almost communists
as much as right wing conservatives? It seems to me that any govt not
based on the
principles of Islam is fair game in their book. We're all just infidels
to them.

The CO

"Tony" wrote in message news:WOt5c.5074$%g.3194@okepread02...
Well, we now have the first surrender in the War on Terror. Spain has
surrendered to Al Quada and will remove its troops from Iraq.
Do the Spanish really think that will be Al Quada's last demand?

I'm as disturbed as anyone that Al Quaeda has apparently influenced
the outcome of a democratic election; in other words, engaged in its
own 'regime change' with a lot less effort than it took in Iraq.

On the other hand we need to remember that the vast majority of the
Spanish people were always strongly against Spanish involvement in
Iraq, and it had always been the opposition party's (now the
government's) declared intention to pull out. Aznar lost the election
partly because the bombs reminded the voters just how much they
disliked his policy on Iraq, but also very much because his government
tried to pin the blame on ETA in a very heavy-handed way, and this
caused great outrage.

It is facile to assume that the Spanish cower before terrorism. If the
bombers had been ETA, the result would have been strong support for
the existing government in its fight against terrorism. It's just that
Iraq has always been an unpopular cause there.

Tony Williams
Military gun and ammunition website: http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk
Military gun and ammunition discussion forum:
http://forums.delphiforums.com/autogun/messages/

On 16 Mar 2004 00:05:01 -0800,
(Tony Williams) wrote:

"Tony" wrote in message news:WOt5c.5074$%g.3194@okepread02...
Well, we now have the first surrender in the War on Terror. Spain has
surrendered to Al Quada and will remove its troops from Iraq.
Do the Spanish really think that will be Al Quada's last demand?



It is facile to assume that the Spanish cower before terrorism. If the
bombers had been ETA, the result would have been strong support for
the existing government in its fight against terrorism. It's just that
Iraq has always been an unpopular cause there.

And it is very important to note that thier support for the invasion
of Afghanistan never flagged-- FOXNEWs aside, it is possible to be
allies and yet disagree on the course of action one needs to take--
and most of Europe felt that Iraq didn't need to be invaded.
Given that one of hte claims of the U.S. was that "you'll see when
we invade and get all those WMD's", it's unsurprising that the
popularity of the invasion declined even further when the WMD never
appeared.
Al Qaeda may have successfully exploited an issue, but poor ally
managemant put it there in the first place. A wiser-- a MUCH wiser
course woudl have been to thank Spain for their assistance, but not
put the government in the position of going into Iraq-- instead, they
could have aided us even more in Afghanistan, freeing troops for Iraqi
operations and incidentally, helping Spain's (then) government.

"Charles Gray" wrote in message
...
On 16 Mar 2004 00:05:01 -0800,
(Tony Williams) wrote:

"Tony" wrote in message
news:WOt5c.5074$%g.3194@okepread02...
Well, we now have the first surrender in the War on Terror. Spain has
surrendered to Al Quada and will remove its troops from Iraq.
Do the Spanish really think that will be Al Quada's last demand?



It is facile to assume that the Spanish cower before terrorism. If the
bombers had been ETA, the result would have been strong support for
the existing government in its fight against terrorism. It's just that
Iraq has always been an unpopular cause there.

And it is very important to note that thier support for the invasion
of Afghanistan never flagged-- FOXNEWs aside, it is possible to be
allies and yet disagree on the course of action one needs to take--
and most of Europe felt that Iraq didn't need to be invaded.

Which is ironic given the opinion poll published by the BBC which
shows that more IRAQI's are in favor of the invasion than
opposed it and 70% thought things would be better as a result.

Keith

"Yeff" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 15 Mar 2004 20:40:55 -0600, Tony wrote:

Well, we now have the first surrender in the War on Terror. Spain has
surrendered to Al Quada and will remove its troops from Iraq.

Spain held an election and the people spoke. Damn democracy!

-Jeff B.
yeff at erols dot com

And people often get the government they deserve. But I hope that isn't so
in this case.

Jarg