Landing without flaps

On Mar 10, 11:51 am, "Owner" wrote:
"Ken S. Tucker" wrote in ...



On Mar 10, 9:10 am, wrote:
On Mar 7, 9:30 pm, buttman wrote:

On 7 Mar, 19:22, Dudley Henriques wrote:

How's that? Learned something?:-)

--
Dudley Henriques

No because you did not teach anything. "This is how it is" is not
teaching, it's telling.

Anyways, the topic of discussion has never been about "is it OK to
starve fuel on takeoff". Even if it was, its not a matter of "yes" or
"no"

Safety is, in my opinion, never a "yes" or "no" kind of thing. Its
like discussing abortion or something. It's never as simple as "yes"
or "no".

By your logic a driving school should simulate (for training!) how to
handle a blowout by shooting out a tire while on a flyover ramp doing
70.
To make it interesting you could do it in the rain.

I'm enjoying this thread now, it's stimulating.
The fellas were discussing flying in the rain last
week. Shooting out tires, I'm placing that on next
weeks agenda.
Ken

You can do that in your flight sim Ken??? Wow, I'm impressed!

Sure but it's hard on the monitor.
Ken

"Ken S. Tucker" wrote in
:

On Mar 10, 11:51 am, "Owner" wrote:
"Ken S. Tucker" wrote in
messagenews:e17d1d43-2aa8-4684-a372-
legro
ups.com...



On Mar 10, 9:10 am, wrote:
On Mar 7, 9:30 pm, buttman wrote:

On 7 Mar, 19:22, Dudley Henriques wrote:

How's that? Learned something?:-)

--
Dudley Henriques

No because you did not teach anything. "This is how it is" is
not teaching, it's telling.

Anyways, the topic of discussion has never been about "is it OK
to starve fuel on takeoff". Even if it was, its not a matter of
"yes" or "no"

Safety is, in my opinion, never a "yes" or "no" kind of thing.
Its like discussing abortion or something. It's never as simple
as "yes" or "no".

By your logic a driving school should simulate (for training!) how
to handle a blowout by shooting out a tire while on a flyover ramp
doing 70.
To make it interesting you could do it in the rain.

I'm enjoying this thread now, it's stimulating.
The fellas were discussing flying in the rain last
week. Shooting out tires, I'm placing that on next
weeks agenda.
Ken

You can do that in your flight sim Ken??? Wow, I'm impressed!

Sure but it's hard on the monitor.

Like all your other activities.


Bertie

On Tue, 11 Mar 2008 04:42:28 -0700 (PDT), Dan
wrote:

On Mar 11, 4:53 am, Roger wrote:

After a brief practice I was expected to (and did) land the Deb using
only ailerons, rudder, and trim.
It aint all that difficult EXCEPT it'd be nice if some one 5'7" (just
happens to be my height) could see the runway while adjusting the
trim:-)) Ah well, I just thought of it like a no flap landing where
the only view of the airport is out the side windows.:-))

Roger -- any idea why Beech out the trim where it did? It's probably
the worst location in any airplane I've been in (except maybe the
overhead thing in a Cherokee (IIRC).

Absolutely none, nor have I seen any write ups about it either. Also
on the early Debs that trim is COARSE. Fortunately they fixed it late
in the first year or early in the second.


Dan


Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

On Mar 13, 9:04 pm, Roger wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2008 04:42:28 -0700 (PDT), Dan
wrote:

On Mar 11, 4:53 am, Roger wrote:

After a brief practice I was expected to (and did) land the Deb using
only ailerons, rudder, and trim.
It aint all that difficult EXCEPT it'd be nice if some one 5'7" (just
happens to be my height) could see the runway while adjusting the
trim:-)) Ah well, I just thought of it like a no flap landing where
the only view of the airport is out the side windows.:-))

Roger -- any idea why Beech out the trim where it did? It's probably
the worst location in any airplane I've been in (except maybe the
overhead thing in a Cherokee (IIRC).

Absolutely none, nor have I seen any write ups about it either. Also
on the early Debs that trim is COARSE. Fortunately they fixed it late
in the first year or early in the second.



Dan

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)www.rogerhalstead.com

The A36 manual (under the dash) trim is fine enough. The electric trim
is nigh unusable. I talked to the IA that maintains it and he said all
is within tolerance.

I'm having a tough time reaching the trim from the right seat.
Demonstrating steep turns is a bit of a challenge with no trim!

Dan

"Dan" wrote in message
...
On Mar 13, 9:04 pm, Roger wrote:
On Tue, 11 Mar 2008 04:42:28 -0700 (PDT), Dan
wrote:

On Mar 11, 4:53 am, Roger wrote:

After a brief practice I was expected to (and did) land the Deb using
only ailerons, rudder, and trim.
It aint all that difficult EXCEPT it'd be nice if some one 5'7" (just
happens to be my height) could see the runway while adjusting the
trim:-)) Ah well, I just thought of it like a no flap landing where
the only view of the airport is out the side windows.:-))

Roger -- any idea why Beech out the trim where it did? It's probably
the worst location in any airplane I've been in (except maybe the
overhead thing in a Cherokee (IIRC).

Absolutely none, nor have I seen any write ups about it either. Also
on the early Debs that trim is COARSE. Fortunately they fixed it late
in the first year or early in the second.



Dan

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)www.rogerhalstead.com

The A36 manual (under the dash) trim is fine enough. The electric trim
is nigh unusable. I talked to the IA that maintains it and he said all
is within tolerance.

I'm having a tough time reaching the trim from the right seat.
Demonstrating steep turns is a bit of a challenge with no trim!

Dan

I can really feel your pain on that one. At the moment, I don't have any
"within tolerance" war stories involving aircraft; but a lot of things that
are "within tolerance" seem to need a little TLC--before they drive you
nuts!

Peter :-(

On Fri, 7 Mar 2008 10:30:57 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip
wrote:

buttman wrote in news:24e58b46-6e28-45c9-93fb-
:

On Mar 4, 6:57 pm, Dudley Henriques wrote:

I have nothing against you personally. I don't even know you. You don't
use your actual name and the stage personna you've chosen souns like it
came from a 2 year old.

You think I don't know that? I picked this name for that very reason.
I don't play that name game crap. It don't matter what name appears
above my posts, the meaning stays the same.

Just a vast difference in opinion
between you and me as to how flight instruction should be performed.

You're darn right. If a student comes to me asking about somethi9ng,
I'll do my best to explain it to him in terms he or she can
understand. I'll never just bluntly say "This is how it is" without
any kind of reasoning, which is the technique you seem to prefer. I've
asked you how many times now to point out what exactly you find so
appaling about my ability to be an instructor? All I ever get from you
is "You are downright dangerous", "You damage this profession", "I
would never fly with you", these are very loaded words to be using
without any kind of backup whatsoever.

You don't post here because you care about safety. You don't post here
because you care about instructing. You don't even post here because
you care about aviation. You post here so you can call out people like
myself on weak bases such as my freaking internet chitchat handle.
Your existence here has never, and will never be anything more than a
huge ego stroke.

Hey,I never called you on yournhandle and I can see you are a complete and
utter tit..


Just out of curiosity I did a search on it. What did I find?

Bertie
Roger (K8RI) ARRL Life Member
N833R (World's oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

On Mon, 3 Mar 2008 21:56:54 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip
wrote:

wrote in news:b550bda9-cdfa-4ebf-83b7-
:

On Mar 3, 1:27 pm, "Ken S. Tucker" wrote:
On Mar 3, 12:04 pm, Gig 601XL Builder
wrote:

Ken S. Tucker wrote:

I had a great Instructor, he was strict and informative.
While doing our bank instruction - up to 60 degs - he
gently admonished that my ball was not centered.
He went on to explain that most pilots bank left to
site see and also in the circuit, so the left tank may
fill up from the right if your uncoordinated and too
lax to coordinate turns while site seeing.

It sort of depends on the aircraft and its' fuel system.

Of course, Cessna 150/2 herein.
Ken

Go out, do a long slip, and report back as to how much
imbalance occurs.

I think we're starting with a considerable amount of imbalance to start

Think so?:-))

All things considered, I wonder how long you'd have to circle in a
coordinated turn at 60, or 45 degrees before there was a fuel
imbalance? :-)) Pattern turns ARE STILL supposed to be coordinated
aren't they?cough

OTOH I wonder how long a 150 could remain in a maximum effort slip
without hitting the ground before a noticable/detectable fuel
imbalance developed?

with.


Bertie
Roger (K8RI) ARRL Life Member
N833R (World's oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

wrote in :

On Mon, 3 Mar 2008 21:56:54 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip
wrote:

All things considered, I wonder how long you'd have to circle in a
coordinated turn at 60, or 45 degrees before there was a fuel
imbalance? :-)) Pattern turns ARE STILL supposed to be coordinated
aren't they?cough

OTOH I wonder how long a 150 could remain in a maximum effort slip
without hitting the ground before a noticable/detectable fuel
imbalance developed?

with.

Well, i know someone who unported a Bird-dog slipping and ended up
deadsticking. They have no both selection, though.

Bertie

On Fri, 4 Apr 2008 08:03:59 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip
wrote:

wrote in :

On Mon, 3 Mar 2008 21:56:54 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip
wrote:

All things considered, I wonder how long you'd have to circle in a
coordinated turn at 60, or 45 degrees before there was a fuel
imbalance? :-)) Pattern turns ARE STILL supposed to be coordinated
aren't they?cough

OTOH I wonder how long a 150 could remain in a maximum effort slip
without hitting the ground before a noticable/detectable fuel
imbalance developed?

with.

Well, i know someone who unported a Bird-dog slipping and ended up
deadsticking. They have no both selection, though.

I've unported the Deb too, but it wasn't due to fuel running to the
other side:-)) No baffels in the tanks.

Bertie
Roger (K8RI) ARRL Life Member
N833R (World's oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

On Thu, 06 Mar 2008 16:08:55 -0500, Dudley Henriques
wrote:

I can see the headlines now........

"Three hundred and fifty killed in crash of DC10 on take off at Kennedy.
Investigators are puzzled by an initial report of strange evidence of
small dogs found to have been sucked through the engines."

Hey! lay off the small dogs. I gotta keep Streak fed somehow.

Roger (K8RI) ARRL Life Member
N833R (World's oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com