DG-300 or LS-3?

Hi,

I'm curious, what didn't you like about the LS-6. I've heard the
handling is superb, but the cockpit a bit cramped.

Thanks,
Brad

It's only cramped when you lose - when you win if fits like a glove!

66
(1K hours in my 6 and still loving it - keeps me on my diet!)

I seem to recall that DG has the larger 5" wheel. I know the
mechanism on both are equally poor and like to fold when they
shouldn't. Not so bad on the DG 300 but earlier designs were prone to
collapse. Same as the LS-4. I think Dirks and Lemke were is same gear
class at the university.
GA

On *FWIW, both
share the same (miserable) landing gear and brake (except I believe
the most recent DG-produced LS8). * So, neither is as forgiving as the
Schleicher designs (for example) in a rough field or hard braking
situation.

My 0.02. *YMMV.

P3

On Apr 26, 3:38*pm, glider wrote:
* *I seem to recall that DG has the larger 5" wheel...

Yes, and that makes the glider a lot easier to push around, especially
on soft ground. However, the actual drum is not substantially (if any
at all) larger than that of the 4" wheel, but the larger tire OD
(14.5" vs 11") gives it more leverage over the brake and makes the
brake that much less effective.

Thanks, Bob K.

On Apr 26, 3:38*pm, glider wrote:
* *I seem to recall that DG has the larger 5" wheel. I know the
mechanism on both are equally poor and like to fold when they
shouldn't. Not so bad on the DG 300 but earlier designs were prone to
collapse. Same as the LS-4. I think Dirks and Lemke were is same gear
class at the university.
GA

Yes, the DG has the larger gear (but for the record the LS-3 - and I
think the 4 as well - has rubber "donuts" that act as minor shock-
absorbers).

Both the DG-300 and LS-4 have factory mods that prevent the gear
collapse that plagued early units. Don't know what the LS "fix" is;
but on the DG it was simply a spacer and a spring to keep the gear-
handle torqued over - so its locking "tab" doesn't bounce out of the
associated notch in turbulence or upon touchdown. My DG has over 1500
hours on it, without a single gear collapse!

--Noel
(who accidentally load-tested the gear mechanism on his DG on Sunday,
keeping too much spoiler out in the flare)

On Mon, 26 Apr 2010 16:05:51 -0700 (PDT), "noel.wade"
wrote:


--Noel
(who accidentally load-tested the gear mechanism on his DG on Sunday,
keeping too much spoiler out in the flare)

.... not keeping too much spoiler out in the flare, but rather being a
tad too slow on final approach...


Andreas

On Apr 26, 5:02*pm, Andreas Maurer wrote:
On Mon, 26 Apr 2010 16:05:51 -0700 (PDT), "noel.wade"

wrote:
--Noel
(who accidentally load-tested the gear mechanism on his DG on Sunday,
keeping too much spoiler out in the flare)

... not keeping too much spoiler out in the flare, but rather being a
tad too slow on final approach... *

Andreas

Nomex for sale................anybody want some
Nomex?..................

Brad

On Apr 26, 7:01*pm, Bob Kuykendall wrote:
On Apr 26, 3:38*pm, glider wrote:

* *I seem to recall that DG has the larger 5" wheel...

Yes, and that makes the glider a lot easier to push around, especially
on soft ground. However, the actual drum is not substantially (if any
at all) larger than that of the 4" wheel, but the larger tire OD
(14.5" vs 11") gives it more leverage over the brake and makes the
brake that much less effective.

Thanks, Bob K.

Sounds like a job for... The Tillmann Steckner mod!

Regards,

-Doug

On Apr 26, 10:22*pm, Doug Hoffman wrote:
On Apr 26, 7:01*pm, Bob Kuykendall wrote:

On Apr 26, 3:38*pm, glider wrote:

* *I seem to recall that DG has the larger 5" wheel...

Yes, and that makes the glider a lot easier to push around, especially
on soft ground. However, the actual drum is not substantially (if any
at all) larger than that of the 4" wheel, but the larger tire OD
(14.5" vs 11") gives it more leverage over the brake and makes the
brake that much less effective.

Thanks, Bob K.

Sounds like a job for... *The Tillmann Steckner mod!

Regards,

-Doug

Which improved the braking in MY glider somewhat, but not enough that
I consider it adequate.

On Apr 26, 10:22*pm, Doug Hoffman wrote:
On Apr 26, 7:01*pm, Bob Kuykendall wrote:

On Apr 26, 3:38*pm, glider wrote:

* *I seem to recall that DG has the larger 5" wheel...

Yes, and that makes the glider a lot easier to push around, especially
on soft ground. However, the actual drum is not substantially (if any
at all) larger than that of the 4" wheel, but the larger tire OD
(14.5" vs 11") gives it more leverage over the brake and makes the
brake that much less effective.

Thanks, Bob K.

Sounds like a job for... *The Tillmann Steckner mod!

Regards,

-Doug

Actually sounds like a job for the Tost disk brake kit. The "DG-100"
kit fits the DG-30x. An obvious serious improvement in braking
performance and no more dealing with cable adjustments. Doing that was
a kind of obvious upgrade to improve the glider for XC/safety.

On the handle mod that keeps the U.C handle from popping out--I'm
amazed when I keep seeing DG-30x without this mod. It is a very easy
fix and cheap insurance especially when landing out on a rough
surface. I brought a used DG-303 which turned out to have had a gear
collapse on a (not rough) grass runway, it did not have the spring mod
installed. Maybe the reason it had 15 hours on it and was then put
away in a hangar for a few years. I really liked that glider.

The DG-30x and LS-4 (and presumably LS3?) require proper inspection
the gas strut in the U.C. mechanism as well, I think covered in past
posts on r.a.s.


Darryl

You mean Andy climbs very well with his LS3. How well a glider climbs
in a thermal (assuming we compare modern 15 m ships) is 90% pilot and
10% glider.

Ramy

AK wrote:
On Apr 23, 3:54*pm, "noel.wade" wrote:
Hello all - I've got a question for the competition pilots out the

Imagine you're a budding competition pilot with about 300 hours in
your logbook. *You've done a couple of Sports-class competitions and
find them highly enjoyable. *You begin to make plans to buy a partial
share in a high-end machine in 2010/2011; but then have to change
gears financially and keep costs in check.

Now imagine you've standing in front of two aircraft:
1) A near-mint-condition DG-300 (with auto-hookups, great
instrumentation, and DG's ergonomics and visibility). *The ship has
spent its life in the desert southwest of the USA.

2) A recently-refinished LS-3 (_not_ an "a" model) with good equipment
- but an airframe that's a full 10 years older than the DG. *The ship
has spent its life on the East coast of the USA. *Assume that it is
only $3000 cheaper than the DG-300.

According to some old Idaflieg data, the LS-3 is significantly better
above 60 knots while the DG-300 has a noticeable climb-rate advantage
at slower speeds. *Not sure how accurate the Idaflieg data is, though..

What would _you_ consider to be the better ship to own? *If you owned
one of them, would you sell it to get the other?

Thanks for the assistance,

--Noel

If you are talking about Andy's LS-3 then I can tell you his glider
climbs really well. I used to fly a very good climber SZD-55-1 and I
climbed with Andy in the same thermal a few times. I was surprised
how
well he climbed. It is also an excellent runner. I would choose the
LS-3 if performance was what I were after. Plus paint finish is ever
lasting.