Stemme S12 in Michigan this Saturday, May 20th (KOZW) @ 4 pm

Yes, the main gear track is wider in the 12 than the 10.

On 5/23/2017 6:47 PM, Dave Nadler wrote:
On Tuesday, May 23, 2017 at 8:18:42 PM UTC-4, Duster wrote:
I thought I read where the S-12 wheelbase was wider than the S-10,
so the rockinrollin might be less of an issue.
I don't know, but also span is bigger....

--
Dan, 5J

On 24/05/2017 09:28, Dave Nadler wrote:


Stemme has a different issue: it can get "rocking" (in roll) and hit a tip.
I know this has happened more than once (on grass fields) - damage results.

Always trade-offs!

See ya, Dave

I walked interestedly around the first Stemme I saw some years ago with
an aeronautical engineer friend. As we chatted about it he ran one hand
under the trailing edge of the wing tip and suggested I do the same.
The aileron bottom was heavily abraded for the outboard 4 feet or so.
Same on the other side.

'Every aeroplane touches the edge of the envelope somewhere' he said.

--
GC

I owned a Stemme S10-VT for 8 years. I never scraped a wing. Once I scraped a wing tip skid, while taxiing at well above walking speed, I allowed one main wheel to drop into a drainage grate depression in the tarmac. No damage to the wing finish. I have never experienced "rocking and rolling".

As to handling, I would compare the difference between the S10 and my current ASH26E as a bit like that between a sedan and a sports car. The Stemme deals with turbulence better and gives a smoother ride. Ailerons are heavier, but I would not characterize roll as sluggish, and the addition effort is mostly unnoticed after flying for a few minutes . . . until after 5 hours or so when I found myself using two hands on the stick sometimes. Once cranked over into a thermal, the Stemme is more "stable" in that it tracks well and does not need the many small corrections one uses on a lighter ship.

Stemme ground handling is in a class by itself, making operations at even busy towered airports the same as with a power plane - blends right in.

The Stemme will operate in conditions that would have other high performance gliders staying in their boxes. Four of us launched from Cedar City after winds stiffened up overnight, blowing 35 knots mostly steady when it came time to go. Our taxiing to the runway center intersection required four 90 degree turns, all to the left, so we were exposed to that wind from every angle during taxi. I went first, and told Marty Hellman to just "cover" my wing tip, not touch it, for the first two turns when I would then be on my own. Launch required something less 20 feet and levitation straight up like an elevator! All of us took of safely.

bumper

The 12 is 6 inches wider than the 10 and they say that makes a big difference. I was told that in certain circumstances the 10 could start a rolling motion in taxi that would not stop (or worsened) until the pilot slowed or stoped the glider and let it settle. At Howell airport (6/10 taxiway for smoothness) it was never that bad but there was only a 18 inch to 2 foot clearance on some taxi lights. A big roll at the wrong time and it might have been possible to get a light. Most thought I was being to cautious and it was almost impossible to hit a light if near the centerline while taxiing. This is no different than towing a pure glider down a taxiway with taxiway lighting I suppose except the trailing edge is exposed and damage is far more severe.

For what it's worth...

Sorry, I heard 6 inches wider gear. I'm not sure if that's each side from center or total increase. Again the taxi was amazingly easy in Howell, and it was windy, and the taxiways are not perfect by any means (lots of elevation change on the airport), and it was blowing 20 knots all day.

That said, I wasn't used to 82 foot wings. Few are. They were both well over the taxi lighting and it was a 3/4 mile taxi to the runway. So maybe 100 sets of taxi lights along the way. If it was my 369k on the line I would have be very cautious taxiing at first. I'm sure eventually I would get more comfortable. Even a slight dip in the pavement caused eye opening movement in each wingtip. I have witnessed 2 sailplanes towed into runway lights (trailing edge first) and it still makes me nervous. But in this case I think it was unnecessary.

After a weekend which saw a significant number of pilots with no experience in the Stemme taxi out to the runway themselves, roll was clearly not an issue. I think that point says great things about the stability of the glider with its new increased landing gear width.

Sean

I'm at Logan, UT right now and operating on RWY 28 which has a width of
60'. I find that if I get right to one edge of the runway, I can
complete a U-turn on the pavement and taxi to parking. If I'm the
slightest bit off, one wheel will go off onto the hard packed gravel
shoulder.

On 5/23/2017 9:06 PM, Dan Marotta wrote:
Yes, the main gear track is wider in the 12 than the 10.

On 5/23/2017 6:47 PM, Dave Nadler wrote:
On Tuesday, May 23, 2017 at 8:18:42 PM UTC-4, Duster wrote:
I thought I read where the S-12 wheelbase was wider than the S-10,
so the rockinrollin might be less of an issue.
I don't know, but also span is bigger....


--
Dan, 5J

On 5/24/2017 9:03 AM, bumper wrote:
snip

Stemme ground handling is in a class by itself, making operations at even busy towered airports the same as with a power plane - blends right in.

snip

bumper


Except in tight places. Taxiing in yesterday, I found the FBO had
parked a fuel truck about 77 feet (my span is 75') from the propeller
spinner of a Cessna. It was extremely slow taxiing between the two
using the shadows of my wing tips and the obstacles to maintain
separation. Of course, I could have folded the wings or taken an
alternate route.
--
Dan, 5J

On Wednesday, May 24, 2017 at 8:39:24 AM UTC-7, Dan Marotta wrote:


Except in tight places. Taxiing in yesterday, I found the FBO had
parked a fuel truck about 77 feet (my span is 75') from the propeller
spinner of a Cessna. It was extremely slow taxiing between the two
using the shadows of my wing tips and the obstacles to maintain
separation. Of course, I could have folded the wings or taken an
alternate route.
--
Dan, 5J

Dan,

There is that. Been a couple of airports, Once at an airshow due to close aircraft parking, and then at Pine Mountain Lake, CA with an embankment too close to the taxiway. Stopped and folded the wings. Didn't happen often. Much more difficult on some early S10's with no winglets - the winglets, like you shadow example, help with depth perception for clearance.

The opposite problem would occur too. Once parked IFO my hangar without the 90 degree turn, as the adjacent hangar at Napa was open and had a bunch of people milling about. A lady in an SUV comes driving up right towards me, I had shut down but not opened the canopy. She clearly was not slowing and had not seen my wing. People in the hangar were screaming at her to stop - - and she did, just feet away. I could've used a defibrillator on myself if I'da had one handy.

I always hung orange steamers on the wingtips when parked on the ramp. Cord, lead weight, fluorescent tapes.

bumper

On 5/24/2017 10:13 PM, bumper wrote:
snip
I always hung orange steamers on the wingtips when parked on the ramp. Cord, lead weight, fluorescent tapes.

bumper

Now THAT is a capital idea!

--
Dan, 5J

On Thursday, May 25, 2017 at 7:44:03 AM UTC-7, Dan Marotta wrote:
On 5/24/2017 10:13 PM, bumper wrote:
snip
I always hung orange steamers on the wingtips when parked on the ramp. Cord, lead weight, fluorescent tapes.

bumper

Now THAT is a capital idea!

--
Dan, 5J

Bumper, it could be proprietary Mk-V Kiddie Car Quiet Vent information, but....
How do you steam an orange?
Jim