Wind limits - small single engine aircraft

On 6 Feb 2007 08:19:04 -0800, "Tony" wrote:

I had a cross wind experience some years ago that might be worth
describing. I don't remember the airport -- somewhere in IL, I think.
I was flying my Mooney in a fairly strong crosswind at this single
runway airport. I didn't pay attention to the large barn near the
approach end of the runway on the upwind side. It was my first time
into this field,and it took an impressive crab angle to fly along the
extended centerline on approach.


Something similar, but with different results.
Like a good little pilot as I started the flare I shoved in rudder to
get aimed down the centerline, cranked in some opposite yoke to keep
me over it, and some feet above the runway the wind just stopped! It
eddied around that damn barn, changed from a crosswind with a headwind
component to a tail wind -- we dropped out of the sky. There was no
damage to the airplane (to my surprise). Guys at the FBO told me that
was a common experience there, they like to watch first timers land.
You'd think they'd have said something on UNICOM.

Lesson learned -- the next time in I landed long. Second lesson
learned. If you're a fraction of a mile from touchdown and the nose of
the airplane is pointing somewhere well to the side of the runway, in
addition to looking at the runway, look at where the nose is pointing.
If there's something big there, near the approach end, think about
what the wind might be doing, and plan your touchdown accordingly. An
effective wind change of 10 or so knots can change a well planned
landing into something not quite so nice. I don't know it for a fact,
but I'd suspect a dense corpse of tall trees could have the same
effect.

They can, however under the right conditions both can have the
opposite effect.

Landing at Midland Barstow (3BS) quite a few years back after a really
rough ride coming back from spending a night in TVC due to weather. I
had quite a cross wind, but the old Cherokee 180 behaved well. I was
down and on all three at probably less than 30 MPH when all of a
sudden the Cherokee started sliding sideways. I was able to keep it
pointed straight but the wind was so strong it pushed me clear to the
edge of the runway by which time I was probably doing less than 20
MPH.
The wind was rolling over the buildings at the fair grounds just to
the south of 24 creating a much stronger wind at the surface than just
10 or 20 feet up.

A guy was loading a bunch of passengers into a Cherokee 6. I asked
where they were headed and he said he was just going to take some
family members around the area. At this point I mentioned how rough
it was and the wind conditions down by the fair grounds. I said if I
came in again I'd land clear over on the south side of the runway. He
said the 6 would have no problems and not knowing the capabilities of
the 6 I didn't argue. He took off and I could see the wind push that
6 right up to the edge of the runway as it had done to me. He went
around the pattern, came in and landed on the south edge of the
runway. The wind blew him all the way across that time.

As to the trees: Houghton Lake KHTL has a 4000 foot paved 09/27 and a
short 18/36 sod strip with the north end at the south side of 09/27.
There is a tree line parallel to the full length of the 09/27 and
about 100 yards north. When the wind is out of the north you can
expect to find a north correction at pattern altitude. Maybe a 100
feet above the runway the wind will suddenly shift 180 to the south.
About the time you are going into the round out it abruptly shifts
back to the north along with a lot of turbulence. "I think" the wind
spills over the trees and blows across the runway and ends up rolling
back to the north. I'm not sure what causes it, but it can sure add a
dose of humility when we think we have the cross wind landings down
pat.

You have to forget about everything except what the plane is doing and
keep it straight.


, . (, becauOn Jan 20, 1:53 am, wrote:
I was wondering what people view as their limitations in terms of wind.
I'm talking 172 / Warrior territory here.

Clearly this is a personal decision, based on your perceptions of your
own skills, the aircraft you are flying, the specific conditions on the
day (E.g. how gusty, reports of LLWS & turbulence), your risk
tolerance,

But I'm interested in what the various opinions are. How much wind is
too much to fly, for you? And how much crosswind component? Does your
max crosswind component vary with windspeed? And how about how gusty it
is? Clearly if it's more gusty that's a bad thing, but how gusty is too
gusty?

Of course I have my own views on this but I'm wondering what others
think. And by the way the context is that I have decided to cancel my
flight tomorrow (Boston area) due to winds, but I'm still hoping to fly
on Sunday.

I guess as an aside, what are the scariest windy conditions you've ever
flown in? Would you do it again?

Thanks

Tom

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com