Which post-WW2 combat aircraft have not been used in combat?

"R" wrote in message
news

"Kirk Stant" wrote in message
om...
Just for fun, off the top of your heads, which post-WW2 combat
aircraft (any country) have NOT been used in their intended roles in
an actual shooting war (or police action, or soccer riot, or whatever
it's called these days)?

SNIP

Someone else said the B-45/RB-45. But the B-45 saw action in Vietnam
dropping bombs.

Red Rider

(When) did this happen? The B-45 Tornado was out of service before the
Vietnam War began....

Nick

"Nick Pedley" wrote in message
...

(When) did this happen? The B-45 Tornado was out of service before the
Vietnam War began....

Nick



Indeed but the RB-45C served with the 91st Strategic Reconnaissance
Squadron and saw some action in Korea.

Keith

ANDREW ROBERT BREEN wrote:

In article ,
Mike Marron wrote:

snip

Sea Fury saw action over Korea - including a MiG 15 downed. Attacker
and IIRC Vampire samw action over Suez in '57.

I forgot, Indian AF Vampires saw action briefly in 1965. A flight of four
was shot down (at least one by friendly fire after they'd attacked their own
ground troops) and they were removed from combat subsequent to that.

Guy

"tw" skrev i meddelandet
...

"Kirk Stant" wrote in message
om...
Just for fun, off the top of your heads, which post-WW2 combat
aircraft (any country) have NOT been used in their intended roles in
an actual shooting war (or police action, or soccer riot, or whatever
it's called these days)?

And why?

Some ROE:

1. Combat aircraft means it was designed or modified to employ
air-to-air or air-to-ground/ship/boat weapons.

2. Combat means someone was activily shooting back (or really wanted
to) while the aircraft was performing it's mission.

3. Let's leave out recce, that just gets too complicated!

Any Swedish aircraft after the Tunnan I think.. i.e. Draken, Viggen,

A SH-37 Viggen was once most likely fired at by a Soviet frigate during a photo
reconnaissance mission over the Baltic. It is not known however if it was a
deliberate shooting or if it was an accidental shooting, but photos from the
mission anyway showed two SA-N-4 Gecko (Soviet/Russian designation 9M33) missiles
being launched from the ship. Urban are you here? Can you help me with the year
for this incident? Was it late 70's?

In another Cold War incident over the Baltic a Soviet Su-15 Flagon crashed into
the sea when two examples were harassing a Swedish SH 37 Viggen over international
waters. The other Soviet pilot apparently though that his comrade was shot down by
the Swedish aircraft (the SH-37 actually did carry two Sidewinders for self
defense) because he chased the SH-37 Viggen for a long time (almost back to
Swedish waters) at very low altitude over the sea. The SH-37 Viggen pilot had a
tough ride because he was all the time hearing the alarm signals in his hearphones
when the Soviet pilot tried to lock his missiles on him, and he had repeatedly to
perform evasive manoeuvres.

The first incident above is official, but I'm not sure about the other. I heard
about it once from a man whose brother was a Viggen pilot (hope this is barred
under the statute of limitations now .

Assuming the above incidents have happened - would it be enough to remove the
Viggen from the above list?


Regards,

Per Nordenberg

My guess is that the only British type to see no combat is the
Lightning -

Hi

You can add the Supermarine Swift and Gloster Javelin to that list.

Cheers...Chris

"Mike Marron" wrote in message
...
(Kirk Stant) wrote:

Just for fun, off the top of your heads, which post-WW2 combat
aircraft (any country) have NOT been used in their intended roles in
an actual shooting war (or police action, or soccer riot, or whatever
it's called these days)?

And why?

Some ROE:

1. Combat aircraft means it was designed or modified to employ
air-to-air or air-to-ground/ship/boat weapons.

2. Combat means someone was activily shooting back (or really wanted
to) while the aircraft was performing it's mission.

3. Let's leave out recce, that just gets too complicated!

I have trimmed the list according to my own research and the ideas of others
in this thread... feel free to amend this further!

B-36, B-47, F-89, F-106, F-101, F-86D, Saab Draken, F-4D Skyray, F7U
Cutlass, Handley Page Victor, Supermarine Scimitar, Fiat G.91, English
Electric Lightning, Saab Viggen, Sukhoi Su-15, Shin Meiwa, Alpha Jet, Fuji
T1F2, Supermarine Swift, Tupulov Tu-26, B-58 Hustler, North American B-45,
Hawker Firebrand, Tupolov Tu-20, Hawker Sea Vixen, McDonnell F2H-4 Banshee,
North American FJ-4B Fury, Yakolev Yak-25A, McDonnell FH-1 Phantom,
McDonnell F3H Demon, Supermarine Attacker...


HTH,
Nick

Mike Marron wrote in message . ..
(Kirk Stant) wrote:

Just for fun, off the top of your heads, which post-WW2 combat
aircraft (any country) have NOT been used in their intended roles in
an actual shooting war (or police action, or soccer riot, or whatever
it's called these days)?

And why?

Some ROE:

1. Combat aircraft means it was designed or modified to employ
air-to-air or air-to-ground/ship/boat weapons.

2. Combat means someone was activily shooting back (or really wanted
to) while the aircraft was performing it's mission.

3. Let's leave out recce, that just gets too complicated!

To start things off, here are my USAF candidates:

B-36 - Held back from Korea for Nuke mission.
B-47 - Too early for Korea, too late for Vietnam (remember, no recce).
F-84F - Too early for Korea (ef considered a separate aircraft from
straight-wing F-84s), too late for Vietnam. Combat use by other
countries?
F-89 - Too late for Korea (?), not needed (no bomber threat).
F-106 - Not needed in Vietnam - F-102s deployed instead.
F-101 (Yeah, I know about the RF-101 in Cuba and Vietnam). Don't know
why F-101Cs weren't used early in Vietnam. Being phased out by then?

Could be wrong, but here goes:

B-36, B-47, F-84F, F-89, F-106, F-101, F-86D, F-94C,

Correct as far as the F-94C is concerned, but the F-94, in the A
guise, did see service in Korea.

Saab Draken, Saab
29,

The J29 did serve in combat; supported UN forces in Africa.

F-4D Skyray, F7U Cutlass, F9F (swept-wing) Cougar, Gloster
Javelin, Avro Vulcan,

Vulcan flew the "Black Bart" conventional attacks against the
Falklands.

Handley Page Victor,

Depends on how you look at it--the tanker version operated during the
Falklands conflict, IIRC.

Supermarine Scimitar, Fiat
G.91,

Maybe, but didn't the Portugese operate the G.91, and if so, did it
ever see action during their colonial conflict in Africa?

English Electric Lightning,

I believe the saudis used the Lightning against Yemenese elements?

Dassault Mirage IV, Saab Viggen,
Sukhoi Su-15,

Well, the Flagon *did* kill a couple of KAL airliners...

Shin Meiwa, Alpha Jet,

ISTR some African user might have used the Alpha Jet in ground attack?

Folland Gnat,

Nope, Gnats were even credited with sabre kills when used by Idia
against Pakistan in 65.

BAe Hawk, Fuji
T1F2, Supermarine Swift, Tupolov Tu-22,

Not sure about that--ISTR some use by the Libyans in Afica (Chad?)?

Tupulov Tu-26, B-58 Hustler,

B-58 as a bomber, correct. But I do recall an account of its use with
a rec pod around Cuba during the missile crisis.

Tupolov Tu-16,

Nope, the Tu-16 has been used by the Egyptians, including missions in
Yemen IIRC.

North American B-45,

The B-45 was more often used in its rec guise than it ever was as a
light bomber, and in that role it did see use over Korea, not to
mention reported penetrations into Soviet airspce (flown by RAF crew
IIRC).

Hawker Firebrand, Tupolov Tu-20,
Hawker Siddeley Buccaneer,

Buccaneer flew combat missions during ODS.

Hawker Sea Vixen, deHavilland Venom,

Venom saw action in 56 Suez operation against Egypt.

McDonnell F2H-4 Banshee, North American FJ-4B Fury, deHavilland
Vampire,

I believe vampire saw combat use by Rhodesia and South Africa.

Yakolev Yak-25A, Dassault Ouragen,

India, Israel, and (I think) El Salvadore all used the Ouragen in the
ground attack role during combat operations.

McDonnell FH-1
Phantom, Hawker Sea Fury,

What? Sea Fury was even credited with a kill over Korea IIRC, not to
mention use by the Cubans later.

Grumman F7F Tigercat,

Tigercat saw action in Korea.

Brooks


McDonnell
F3H Demon, Supermarine Attacker...

Everything else got lots of chances to do their thing.

At first glance, looks like the US taxpayer is getting a pretty good
deal for his money!

Kirk
(tired of all the non-mil av bull**** on this group)

Same.

Mike Marron wrote in message . ..
"Alex A" wrote:
Mike Marron wrote:

B-36, B-47, F-84F, F-89, F-106, F-101, F-86D, F-94C, Saab Draken, Saab

I have read that F106 was used in used in Vietnam for few monthes but not
with the
expected results (1 shot down)

I'm afraid you're confusing the F-106 with its delta-wing F-102
predecessor. A quick visual to differentiate between the two
is the clipped vertical fin on the Six and the air-intakes are also
behind the canopy (not to mention the Six blows the Duece away
in terms of takeoff/climbout performance when watching from the
ground). But the -102 was in 'Nam and the -106 wasn't.

29, F-4D Skyray, F7U Cutlass, F9F (swept-wing) Cougar, Gloster
Javelin, Avro Vulcan, Handley Page Victor, Supermarine Scimitar, Fiat
G.91, English Electric Lightning,

I think Vulcan was used for Malouines Airfield bombing... scimitar by indian
in Pakistan/India war (not sure, sea vixen?)

OK?

Vampire was used by India, as was Gnat. The war he was referring to
was probably the 65 conflict.


Dassault Mirage IV, Saab Viggen,
Sukhoi Su-15, Shin Meiwa, Alpha Jet, Folland Gnat,

Gnat was used by India in India vs Pakistan ?

?

See above. It killed F-86's during that conflict.


BAe Hawk, Fuji T1F2, Supermarine Swift, Tupolov Tu-22, Tupulov Tu-26,
B-58 Hustler,
Tupolov Tu-16, North American B-45, Hawker Firebrand, Tupolov Tu-20,
Hawker Siddeley Buccaneer, Hawker Sea Vixen, deHavilland Venom,
McDonnell F2H-4 Banshee, North American FJ-4B Fury, deHavilland
Vampire, Yakolev Yak-25A,

Dassault Ouragen, by IAF

OK.

McDonnell FH-1 Phantom, Hawker Sea Fury, Grumman F7F Tigercat, McDonnell
F3H Demon, Supermarine Attacker...

A+

Heh.

Don't get too smug; by my count, you are more in the "C" range--the
Tu-16 was used in combat (see Egyptian use), as was the Tigercat (in
Korea) Sea Fury, etc...

Brooks

Guy Alcala wrote in message ...
Keith Willshaw wrote:

"Mike Marron" wrote in message
...

snip

Buccaneers were operational in the Gulf War and I believe Venoms did
ground attack in Malaya and Sea Venoms operated in Korea

No Sea venoms that I'm aware of. Only the Colossus-class light fleets were
deployed to Korea, and they had air groups of Seafires or Sea Furies and
Fireflies.

Venoms saw action in Suez 56.




McDonnell F2H-4 Banshee, North American FJ-4B Fury, deHavilland
Vampire, Yakolev Yak-25A, Dassault Ouragen, McDonnell FH-1

Vampires saw service in Korea I think

Meteor.

I believe Vamps were used in combat by Rhodesia and South Africa, and
(possibly) by Jordan , India, and Egypt.

Brooks


Phantom, Hawker Sea Fury, Grumman F7F Tigercat, McDonnell
F3H Demon, Supermarine Attacker...

Sea Furies were used off RN carriers in Korea I think.

Yes, see above.

The Indians have used the attacker against Pakistan I believe

If it happened it was the other way around.

Guy

"Paul J. Adam" wrote in message ...
In message , Mike Marron
writes
Could be wrong, but here goes:

F-101,

Did recce over Vietnam, didn't it?

The original poster discounted that use, but you are correct--it also
collected bullet holes over Cuba.


Gloster
Javelin,

Indonesian Confrontation, 1960s

Did it shoot at anybody, or get shot at?


Avro Vulcan,

Black Buck raids, Falklands

Ooops! I think I called them "Black Bart"! Too much time wasted
watching "The Simpsons", I guess...


Handley Page Victor

Tanking in the Falklands and IIRC the Gulf, plus some "small war"
bombing IIRC.

Correct on the first two, but I don't think so on the
bombing--confusing it with Valiant, perhaps?


Fiat
G.91,

English Electric Lightning,

Folland Gnat,

Used in combat by the Indians.

BAe Hawk,

Used by several buyers for COIN against terrorists / ruthless repression
of noble dissidents.

Tupolov Tu-22

Libyan bombing raids vs. Chad, IIRC.

I believe you are right--I had the same general recollection.


Tupolov Tu-16,

Egyptian raids vs. Israel, and I think Iranian Badgers saw some combat
in the Iran-Iraq war.

I believe the Egyptians also used them in Yemen.


Hawker Siddeley Buccaneer

South Africans used them in Namibia, and they also flew combat in Gulf
War '91.

Dassault Ouragen

Used by the Israelis in 1967.

Amongst others, IIRC.


Hawker Sea Fury

Korea.

And Cuba.

Brooks