SR-71

Bertie the Bunyip wrote:

Also hard to see what could be gained by keeping it secret at this
stage. If one exists, any opposition knows about it. It's been in the
UK and you know how crap they are at keeping secrets. (One of them
had a close encounter with a Brittania airlines 767 in Manchester
about ten yars ago, though it could have been an F-117, of course)
in this day and age when sattelites can read licence plates and
everyone knows it you'd wonder why they would bother keeping it
secret after all these years for any reason other than habit.


Bertie

A. If they make it public they are going to have to tell how much it costs.

B. Once public, sooner or later the specs on it will get out. The one
advantage a spy plane has over spy-sats is that you don't know when it is
going to be over you taking pictures. If it becomes known that the plane can
fly from Nevada to Iran in x hours they just have to have someone in Nevada
to tell them about the launch and then x hours later whatever they need to
hide will be hidden.

C. They would have to disclose the alien tech that is in the aircraft.

My money's on A. No matter what they will use B as the reason once they do
make it public. But I really wish C were the reason.

On Oct 30, 2:17 pm, "Gig 601XL Builder" wrDOTgiaconaATsuddenlink.net
wrote:

C. They would have to disclose the alien tech that is in the aircraft.


Once everyone sees that it's a saucer, the cat's out of the bag!

Ah yes, Bill Clinton, the Republican Party's favorite scapegoat. Well, if
you read the 1996 book "SR-71 Revealed" by former 9th Strategic
Reconnaissance Wing Commander Rich Graham, you'll find out that the demise
of the SR-71 was already being planned as early as 1986 if not before. He
writes on page 196 "The head of SAC intelligence favored satellites over the
SR-71 and wouldn't stand in the way of his boss, General Chain, who wanted
to terminate the program entirely."
On page 198: "A vocal DoD official who expressed displeasure with the
SR-71 was the Assistant Secretary for Defense for Command, Control and
Communications, Mr Duane Andrews. As his Pentagon title would suggest, he
was an avid supporter of increased reliance on satellites to gather
intelligence and used his Pentagon influence to keep the SR-71 from being
a viable reconnaissance aircraft. Whenever funding support for needed
upgrades to the aircraft were sought, he used his connections on the House
Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence (where he once served as a
staff member) to disapprove the request. Lieutenant Colonel "Geno" Quist
remembers briefing Mr Andrews when he was a Congressional staffer:
'One day in 1985, I was summoned over to the "Hill" to talk to some
Congressional staffers on the SR-71 program. The two that I talked to
eventually became"somebody" in the Bush administration.- Mr. Duane
Andrews and Mr. Marty Faga. In a closed room, these two advocates of
space-based assets tried to give me their solution to all of the problems
of military reconnaissance. Their idea was to "mothball" the entire SR-71
fleet but have it ready to respond to any needs the nation may see in the
future. I tried to explain in vain that you needed the SR-71 support,
aircrews, and infrastructure in existence before you could fly the
aircraft. The fact that I had experience flying the SR had no effect on
their ideas, and it soon became obvious that their only answer to future
reconnaissance systems was going to be space-based. It was just a matter
of time before they were in a position to make things happen. Mr. Faga
went on to become an Assistant Secretary of the Air Force (in fact he was
the head of the National Reconnaissance Office) and Mr. Andrews worked in
the Office of the Secretary of Defense.' "
"Two key Air Force players instrumental in retiring the SR-71 were
Generals Larry Welch and John Chain."... "When asked during a 12
September 1990 interview with ABC News about why he terminated the SR-71
program, General Welch stated it was "too expensive, vulnerable to enemy
air defenses, and duplicated overhead systems." Colonel Graham says all
of those charges were simply not true. Colonel Graham was removed from
command by General John Chain, who was commander of the Strategic Air
Command, in November of 1988 "because the SR-71 program phase-out was
proceeding too slowly and met resistance to SAC Headquarters plans every
step of the way."
So the program was closed down in 1990. Ten aircraft were given to
museums that year. Colonel Graham notes that when 61-7972 set four world
speed records while being delivered to the Smithsonian on March 6, 1990,
no senior USAF officers attended the event. General Welch had canceled
the record flight at least once before, "presumably because he didn't
want ANY favorable publicity concerning the SR-71. The flight was finally
pushed through by certain Lockheed executives, politicians supporting the
SR-71, and a small cadre of lower ranking but influential officers. Had
it not been for the initiative of those officers, the media would not
have been informed about the record breaking event, much to the wishes of
those who wanted no more publicity for the SR-71."
In September 1994 Congress put $72.5 million in the defense bill to
bring back three SR-71s. Rich Graham wrote on page 217: "The Air Force
wants nothing to do with the return of the SR-71s and consequently has
not budgeted for the aircraft. It will be up to congress to fund the
program each year, making it difficult to plan for the future." This
book was written before the final retirement of the aircraft, but it is
apparent that if Clinton did indeed kill the program off for good with a
line item veto, he had the wholehearted support of the USAF command
staff. I'd bet he did it at the urging of the command staff, though I
don't know if we'll ever know that for sure.
Col. Graham also describes the animosity the USAF had for the people
connected to the SR-71 program at the end. In 1989 ten Habu crew members
were up for promotion, but only one was promoted, the other nine were
passed over! Anyone who knows about the Blackbird program knows that
every officer chosen to be part of the program was an exceptional
performer, and it's obvious there was discrimination against the men
connected to the SR-71. Getting passed over for promotion is a very black
mark on an officer's record. It was outrageous, and there was nothing
anyone could do about it.
So scapegoat Mr Clinton if you must, but know it was a Republican
administration and the USAF command staff that really killed the
Blackbird.
Scott Wilson

wrote in
. net:

Ah yes, Bill Clinton, the Republican Party's favorite scapegoat. Well,
if you read the 1996 book "SR-71 Revealed" by former 9th Strategic
Reconnaissance Wing Commander Rich Graham, you'll find out that the
demise of the SR-71 was already being planned as early as 1986 if not
before. He writes on page 196 "The head of SAC intelligence favored
satellites over the SR-71 and wouldn't stand in the way of his boss,
General Chain, who wanted to terminate the program entirely."
On page 198: "A vocal DoD official who expressed displeasure with
the SR-71 was the Assistant Secretary for Defense for Command,
Control and Communications, Mr Duane Andrews. As his Pentagon title
would suggest, he was an avid supporter of increased reliance on
satellites to gather intelligence and used his Pentagon influence to
keep the SR-71 from being a viable reconnaissance aircraft. Whenever
funding support for needed upgrades to the aircraft were sought, he
used his connections on the House Permanent Select Committee on
Intelligence (where he once served as a staff member) to disapprove
the request. Lieutenant Colonel "Geno" Quist remembers briefing Mr
Andrews when he was a Congressional staffer:
'One day in 1985, I was summoned over to the "Hill" to talk to some
Congressional staffers on the SR-71 program. The two that I talked
to eventually became"somebody" in the Bush administration.- Mr.
Duane Andrews and Mr. Marty Faga. In a closed room, these two
advocates of space-based assets tried to give me their solution to
all of the problems of military reconnaissance. Their idea was to
"mothball" the entire SR-71 fleet but have it ready to respond to
any needs the nation may see in the future. I tried to explain in
vain that you needed the SR-71 support, aircrews, and
infrastructure in existence before you could fly the aircraft. The
fact that I had experience flying the SR had no effect on their
ideas, and it soon became obvious that their only answer to future
reconnaissance systems was going to be space-based. It was just a
matter of time before they were in a position to make things
happen. Mr. Faga went on to become an Assistant Secretary of the
Air Force (in fact he was the head of the National Reconnaissance
Office) and Mr. Andrews worked in the Office of the Secretary of
Defense.' "
"Two key Air Force players instrumental in retiring the SR-71 were
Generals Larry Welch and John Chain."... "When asked during a 12
September 1990 interview with ABC News about why he terminated the
SR-71 program, General Welch stated it was "too expensive,
vulnerable to enemy air defenses, and duplicated overhead systems."
Colonel Graham says all of those charges were simply not true.
Colonel Graham was removed from command by General John Chain, who
was commander of the Strategic Air Command, in November of 1988
"because the SR-71 program phase-out was proceeding too slowly and
met resistance to SAC Headquarters plans every step of the way."
So the program was closed down in 1990. Ten aircraft were given to
museums that year. Colonel Graham notes that when 61-7972 set four
world speed records while being delivered to the Smithsonian on
March 6, 1990, no senior USAF officers attended the event. General
Welch had canceled the record flight at least once before,
"presumably because he didn't want ANY favorable publicity
concerning the SR-71. The flight was finally pushed through by
certain Lockheed executives, politicians supporting the SR-71, and
a small cadre of lower ranking but influential officers. Had it not
been for the initiative of those officers, the media would not
have been informed about the record breaking event, much to the
wishes of those who wanted no more publicity for the SR-71."
In September 1994 Congress put $72.5 million in the defense bill
to bring back three SR-71s. Rich Graham wrote on page 217: "The
Air Force wants nothing to do with the return of the SR-71s and
consequently has not budgeted for the aircraft. It will be up to
congress to fund the program each year, making it difficult to plan
for the future." This book was written before the final retirement
of the aircraft, but it is apparent that if Clinton did indeed kill
the program off for good with a line item veto, he had the
wholehearted support of the USAF command staff. I'd bet he did it
at the urging of the command staff, though I don't know if we'll
ever know that for sure. Col. Graham also describes the animosity
the USAF had for the people connected to the SR-71 program at the
end. In 1989 ten Habu crew members were up for promotion, but only
one was promoted, the other nine were passed over! Anyone who
knows about the Blackbird program knows that every officer chosen
to be part of the program was an exceptional performer, and it's
obvious there was discrimination against the men connected to the
SR-71. Getting passed over for promotion is a very black mark on an
officer's record. It was outrageous, and there was nothing anyone
could do about it.
So scapegoat Mr Clinton if you must, but know it was a Republican
administration and the USAF command staff that really killed the
Blackbird.
Scott Wilson


Completely believable.

Why would Bill willingly scrap the best down blouse shot platform ever
made?


Bertie

I recall attending the Rancho Murietta Air Show several years ago. One
of the highlights of the show (for me, anyway) was the SR-71 from Beale
coming into to the field at about 1000 AGL. When he crossed the
runway, he went to full power and pulled up; fortunately I had my
camcorder running. I got to admit it was absolutely awsome.

--

"Gatt" wrote in message
...

"Big John" wrote in message
...

We lost three out of 50 due to accidents.

I heard 12, including the one that's on display at the Boeing Museum of
Flight. This very fascinating site seems to indicate 20:
http://www.wvi.com/~sr71webmaster/srloss~1.htm

Still....

If they recommissioned the remaining birds tomorrow I'd call it tax money
well-spent, if nothing but on the very principle of flying it over
people's heads for the simple psychological value. "We built this in
the '60s and you still can't do anything about it...look, it ****s pure
money. We can afford it..."

-c


I have a feeling that a lot of the spying we do now is with drones, stealth
and otherwise. Who cares if they crash or get shot down, no family to
notify. Slick Willy's selling out of America not withstanding, I think the
US military had other aircraft fill the SR71 spot even though the SR71 is an
amazing aircraft. Besides the B2 and F117 are incredible
aircraft...conceived 20 years ago, can you imagine the stuff they are
playing with now that we have not seen!

-------------------------------
DW

In article ,
"Darkwing" theducksmail"AT"yahoo.com wrote:

"Gatt" wrote in message
...


We lost three out of 50 due to accidents.

I heard 12, including the one that's on display at the Boeing Museum of
Flight. This very fascinating site seems to indicate 20:
http://www.wvi.com/~sr71webmaster/srloss~1.htm

Still....

I have a feeling that a lot of the spying we do now is with drones, stealth
and otherwise. Who cares if they crash or get shot down, no family to
notify. Slick Willy's selling out of America not withstanding, I think the
US military had other aircraft fill the SR71 spot even though the SR71 is an
amazing aircraft. Besides the B2 and F117 are incredible
aircraft...conceived 20 years ago, can you imagine the stuff they are
playing with now that we have not seen!


I can understand the AF program to retire the Blackbird. When it was
operational, IIRC, it was "the most expensive system in the AF
inventory." I can believe that -- just the support infrastructure
(tankers, special fuel, special maintenance, spares, training,
equipment, etc.) had to be exorbitant!

Then in AF thinking, it couldn't even deliver a weapon to a target!

Yes, I can believe that satellites, TR-2s and drones, etc. can perform
most of the recon mission, at much lower cost and exposure.

"John Godwin" wrote in message
...
I recall attending the Rancho Murietta Air Show several years ago. One
of the highlights of the show (for me, anyway) was the SR-71 from Beale
coming into to the field at about 1000 AGL. When he crossed the
runway, he went to full power and pulled up; fortunately I had my
camcorder running. I got to admit it was absolutely awsome.

Is there a way you could share that video with us?

I don't think I have ever seen a link with a video of a flying 71.

On the same subject, I remember reading that the huffer to start a 71 had a
Chevy 350 powering it, and that it took every bit of it.

Anyone? True, or not/details?
--
Jim in NC

"Morgans" wrote in
:

Is there a way you could share that video with us?

I'll try. You'll have to give me a little time.

--

"John Godwin" wrote in message
...
"Morgans" wrote in
:

Is there a way you could share that video with us?

I'll try. You'll have to give me a little time.

Great! Let me know, if/when you get it pulled together. I'm sure I am not
alone in saying I look forward to it!
--
Jim in NC