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#41
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Wind/Solar Electrics ???
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 10:04:21 -0500, Steve Spence
wrote: wmbjk wrote: On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 16:35:16 +1100, George Ghio wrote: wmbjk wrote: On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 14:05:32 +1100, George Ghio wrote: When a lie becomes industry-accepted terminology then the industry is in deep ****. It was never a "lie" except in your ignorant vernacular. And for an industry in "deep ****" it seems to be doing rather well overall. "Modified Sq. Wave" is just that. Sine Wave is not stepped. sigh You might correct your error by listing some popular "sine" wave inverters, and the number of steps in their "not stepped" waveforms. Yes Mildred there really are true sine wave inverters that are not just a sq. wave with many, many steps. Another unsupported claim by Mr. Hole Digger. But at least you've admitted in weasel-speak that some snorf "sine" wave inverters *do* have stepped waveforms. Would you say that they're manufactured and sold by liars? Do your own ****ing search. I take that to mean that you won't be providing any examples of sine wave inverters with stepless waveforms. What a shocker. Wayne although I find myself in agreement with george (very scary, especially after his recent voltage driven LED faux pas) that the moniker "Modified Sine Wave" is a misleading term, and should be changed to "Modified Square Wave" in order to more accurately reflect the technology, If only he'd stopped at making that point. But Judge Ghio had to pontificate about liars, ignorance, and shysters. He just never knows when to shut up. Anyway, the term is unlikely to ever be changed, and it's a pretty minor issue IMO. you seemed to have gotten under his skin a bit. Congrats. It's sooooo easy, since he *always* defends his mistakes with more mistakes. The topper was "never wrong mate". Now *that's* funny. Apparently the weasel definition of "never" is "most of the time". Wayne |
#42
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Wind/Solar Electrics ???
the moniker "Modified Sine Wave" is a misleading term, and should be
changed to "Modified Square Wave" I would prefer "stepped sine wave". But I can accept the term "modified sine wave" as marketing speak that has been on lots of UPS boxes for 20 years. (UPS itself being inaccurate for a standby power source.) -- --- Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley (Lake County) CA USA 38.8,-122.5 |
#43
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Wind/Solar Electrics ???
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#44
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Wind/Solar Electrics ???
Plonk!
Jim "George Ghio" wrote in message ... Do your own ****ing search. |
#45
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Wind/Solar Electrics ???
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:51:30 -0800, John Larkin wrote:
wrote: the moniker "Modified Sine Wave" is a misleading term, and should be changed to "Modified Square Wave" I would prefer "stepped sine wave". But I can accept the term "modified sine wave" as marketing speak that has been on lots of UPS boxes for 20 years. (UPS itself being inaccurate for a standby power source.) A chirped-frequency, nanosecond-wide, random-amplitude pulse train is a modified sine wave. John ;-) Thanks! Rich |
#46
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Wind/Solar Electrics ???
In alt.solar.photovoltaic John Larkin wrote:
A chirped-frequency, nanosecond-wide, random-amplitude pulse train is a modified sine wave. I will accept that definition as offered. Does that preclude having any other valid definitions? -- --- Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley (Lake County) CA USA 38.8,-122.5 |
#48
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Wind/Solar Electrics ???
Steve - How many equal "steps" are necessary for the MSW inverter to be
a sufficiently close approximation to a "rotary" sine wave? |
#49
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Wind/Solar Electrics ???
On Wed, 14 Dec 2005 15:33:27 -0800, "RST Engineering"
wrote: With a small solar panel to keep the continuous load going, not a bad way to go. I recently talked to a guy down in Florida, where the sun is more direct and shows up much more often than here in Michigan. He said a decent solar powered system to run a medium size (what's medium size?) house was about $20,000 for the installation. You can plan on replacing lead acid batteries about every 3 years or so. Nickel Metal Hydride (NiMH) are about the same, except the car manufacturers are claiming much longer life using computer controlled charging. Time will tell. Solar panels are still darned expensive. Using a mix of solar and wind you charge different banks with solid state regulators and switches. The inverter only needs to be sized large enough to handle the expected load. As long as you are not running electronics the wave form is not much of a problem...except... for radio interference. Some switching supplies (which are very efficient) are very noisy. You can get one whale of a nice liquid cooled Honda Generator that runs quiet and will supply enough juice to run a good size house continuously. I have a 9,500 Watt continuous generator that will power our whole house on about a gallon an hour. Maybe a tad less. It burns way less than the little 4400 watt portable I used to have and it is *much* quieter. Unfortunately I spend $1,200 and it's not a quiet Honda. OTOH fortunately I purchased it from Lowe's a couple of weeks after the Y2K fiasco. People had cleaned them out and were then returning the "unused" generators. They finally said "No more". Some of those "unused" generators looked like they'd been sitting out in salt spray for a couple of months. Mine was more than 50% off and it was still in the box. It was one of the few that they hadn't sold. They had a lot of them cheap for a few months. The one store here in town must have had 50 or more although most of them weren't 9500 watt units. Currently Home Depot has some 15KW "home generators" complete with transfer switch that will do an automatic transfer, as well as exercising once a week. They'll run on Gas, Natural Gas, or LP gas and come in a small enclosure that looks like a whole house air conditioner. I'd like to try one of those, but my wife says I spent more than enough on what we have and we can drag that heavy cable out to the generator shed for a lot less than $2,200 :-)) Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member) (N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair) www.rogerhalstead.com Jim Seems running a generator would be simpler and cheaper. Roger |
#50
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Wind/Solar Electrics ???
On Thu, 15 Dec 2005 05:00:15 GMT, Don Tuite
wrote: On Thu, 15 Dec 2005 04:34:35 GMT, "Mike Rapoport" wrote: Jim, Check out http://www.realgoods.com/renew/index.cfm They have a store near you and also catalog that is very informative on sustainable, off-grid living and systems. I've had my reservations about RG ever since they endorsed those piezoelectric washing-machine tablets. More than anything though, CE/UL-approved grid-connect inverters (ok AND EU subsidies, especially in Germany) are helping to increase cell and panel manufacturing capacity. Which is essential to driving down There have been several "breakthroughs" that could *potentially* cut the cost of the solar cells to less than half of current and at the same time increase the efficiency by a substantial margin. There were a lot of weasel words in the press release so ... who knows. IF, how soon, and how much. Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member) (N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair) www.rogerhalstead.com cost. I think off-the-grid is fine for hangars and folks in Idaho with acres and acres of acres, but grid-connect is where the volume is. Don |
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