Another Cirrus BRS deployment:

The problem with the report I read is that the cause of the "out of
control" situation was not apparent. Was it a gust of wind?
Turbulence? Pilot error? Did a wing fall off?

If someone uses a parachute to save a plane when the mixture was
pulled out or a tank ran dry, then the parachute is a crutch for pilot
error.

Get the facts on this incident and we can discuss it better.

Ron Lee


You are correct that the parachute SHOULD only be used in those situations;
whether that turns out to be so in practice is unknown at present.


I don't understand this. We're talking about a life-saving device, people
start using it and some here actually suggest those pilots weren't macho
enough to try to get out of their emergency without being a sissy and pulling
the chute? This is unbelievable. "Real men don't use chutes"? What BS!

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

"Dave Stadt" wrote in message
...

"Tom Sixkiller" wrote in message
...

"Dave Stadt" wrote in message news:_HEec.1395.

Traffic fatalities have been in the 40,000+ range since the 1940s.
Many
more automobiles and many more miles driven but at the end of the year
the
number of dead people has been the same for over 50 years.

Actually, TF's peaked in the 1980's at about 52,000 (??) and are now
down
to
the low 40K's.


Actually, far as I know 52,000 is 40,000+.

True..but you also said "but at the end of the year the number of dead
people has been the same for over 50 years". So, yes...but the pattern is
what we're taking here, aren't we? Or are we just playing "Fun with
Numbers"?

"Michael" wrote in message
om...
Thomas Borchert wrote
Both car and GA accident rates have dramatically declined with technical
improvements to safety over the last decades. This expert is simply not
supported
by the numbers.

Actually, that's not true at all. FATALITY rates have improved
dramatically; accident rates are actually up.

Serious accident rates (IB) are down...minor accident rates are up.


Technology has indeed made cars safer; it has also made them more
expensive in constant dollars.

As well as several others factors outside of technology. Technology should
make them _cheaper_.

I'd say "crowded cities" is the biggest factor, or at least one of the
biggest. Add to all that the fact that there is far more widespread drivers
training, crackdowns on DUI, better road design and paving...those will
pare the rates.

OTOH, way back years ago (the late 70's or early 80's) a school of Highway
Engineering (U of Houston rings a bell) announced that bad traffic controls
were a major factor in a very high percentage of accidents. Something like
2/3rds.

When was the last time you ever hit more than two green lights in a row?

"Ron Lee" wrote in message
...
The problem with the report I read is that the cause of the "out of
control" situation was not apparent. Was it a gust of wind?
Turbulence? Pilot error? Did a wing fall off?

If someone uses a parachute to save a plane when the mixture was
pulled out or a tank ran dry, then the parachute is a crutch for pilot
error.

A crutch (or a safety net) that leads to complacency and inordinante
risk-taking.

On Mon, 12 Apr 2004 22:08:04 GMT, David Reinhart
wrote:

It's my understanding that ejection seats aren't allowed on civil aircraft
because the pyrotechnics used are illegal for civillians to own. They're
considered controlled military munitions.

Can the fact that ejection seats weigh something like 600 lb each have
anything to do with their not being used in GA aircraft?

Privately owned aircraft can have working ejection seats, though.

Mary

--
Mary Shafer Retired aerospace research engineer

Michael,

Actually, that's not true at all. FATALITY rates have improved
dramatically; accident rates are actually up.


Huh? You're saying there are more fatalities per miles driven, persons
transported, cars in the system or whatever other meaningful rate you
like to chose? It ain't so.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

Tom,

A crutch (or a safety net) that leads to complacency and inordinante
risk-taking.


And I'm sure this bold statement can be supported by the numbers, can
it?

Jeeze, what is it with pilots and change? Anything new in GA is
bad-mouthed here - while at the same time everybody and his brother
complains about the old technology we have to use. You can't have it
both ways.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

When was the last time you ever hit more than two green lights in a row?

I don't know how common this is in other places, but when I learned to drive
in downtown Des Moines, Iowa, where the speed limit is the standard 20 miles
per hour business district limit, you can go through all of downtown
(guessing 6 to 10 lights) with a green light, by going exactly 18 miles per
hour. I always thought it was pretty cool, and pretty funny how people that
didn't know about this would accelerate as hard as they could at each green
light, go well over the speed limit, only to get to a red light at the next
intersection and lose all their efforts at going faster by waiting at the
light. They made their own stop and go traffic instead of riding the green
light "wave"...

-Aviv Hod

Thomas, I love GPS. No way will VOR navigation be my primary method.
But let's get the facts about this parachute deployment and assess
whether it really saved four people from an otherwise certain
death...or was just a crutch for pilot error.

Ron Lee


Thomas Borchert wrote:

Jeeze, what is it with pilots and change? Anything new in GA is
bad-mouthed here - while at the same time everybody and his brother
complains about the old technology we have to use. You can't have it
both ways.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

"Thomas Borchert" wrote in message
...

Jeeze, what is it with pilots and change? Anything new in GA is
bad-mouthed here - while at the same time everybody and his brother

No, "new" things are not bad-mouthed here; they are simply analyzed
critically, as they should be.

Technology is not "bad" just because it is "old".

Neither is technology "better" just because it is "new."

Analysis of the facts is helpful in all situations.


--------------------
Richard Kaplan, CFII

www.flyimc.com