New Check Law

Jay Honeck wrote:

My bank has changed hands FOUR times since 1997. Each time, their check
handling has gotten ever slower. It is at the point now where deposits take
up to 7 days to "hit" my account -- which I find to be totally unacceptable.

If this law changes that, it is an excellent change.

Your bank is already in violation. Since 1990 the rule has been five days
for non-local checks, two days for local checks, and the next day for certain
other checks (like cashiers, certified, and government checks) for funds to
be available plus another day for cash withdrawl.

While check21 doesn't necessarily shorten these time limits, most banks make
the funds available as they are cleared, and shortened clearing times will
result in an improvement in the accessibility.

Of course, my bank (as many do) will compute interest on the date of actual
deposit, even if the funds aren't available. Of course I'm getting less than
a percent on my checking account these days anyhow.

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 14:12:04 -0500, Gary G
wrote:

I've heard that it will impact it.
However, much like having a job in textiles or
other commodity manufactured goods, times change
and people lost their jobs to overseas.

This new one is due to technology.
There are very talented software people losing there
jobs to South Asia.

This is a strange one. I know of people losing jobs to South Asia, yet
we have shortages of programmers in some areas.

Having retired from the industry not all that long ago, we were
running up against the inability to bring in enough qualified
programmers to fill spots.

Programming is a highly mobile job and the programmers have to be
willing to relocate. Not only relocate, but to do it quite often.

On top of that, programming is "grunt work". In *most* cases you work
to a specification, in a team with your work assigned. It is very
long hours of tedious work.

Been there, done that, got paid, but they didn't even give me a
t-shirt.

I see the check hauling in pretty much the same light. With progress
it falls by the wayside. Hopefully there will be something else. I
could not understand why they kept doing it for the last 10 to 15
years.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

I hate to see folks lose their jobs!
But people do have to read the tea leaves and
prepare for the future.
My coal-mining/textile manufacturing parents prepared me by insuring I went
to school.
Sometimes the window seems like only months or a few years!

On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 12:19:39 -0400, Ron Natalie
wrote:

John E. Carty wrote:

Yep, the days of being able to 'float' a check are almost gone. This new
process debits your account immediately and will prevent future losses to
businesses from bad checks :-)

On the other hand any checks YOU received have immediate funds availability
as well. The gov't has been tightening up the time it takes to clear checks
over the past couple of decades.

I still find having at least the substitute paper reassuring to me (and
my horrendous filing system). Of course, I do find it handy to be able
to call up images of my checks that haven't been mailed back to me on
my bank's web site.

I have not received a canceled paper check, or the image of one in
over 20 years. I can bring up my account and view the account
activity. I also receive a summary at the end of each month, but I
never see the check again after it leaves my hands.

Electronic transfers have been available for quite a few years and
that made me wonder about the route of the canceled checks.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 11:20:46 -0700, "Peter Duniho"
wrote:

"William W. Plummer" wrote in message
news:11ebd.234388$MQ5.433@attbi_s52...
[...] once you permit a digitized version of your signature to exist, you
can never refute you signature.

Of course you can. If anything, the presence of digital signatures makes it
*easier* to refute your signature, not harder.

Personally, I find it amazing that a signature has remained such a
well-respected standard of authentication for so long. But the requirement
for witnesses (notary or otherwise) for certain kinds of signatures is proof
enough that the law understands that signatures are not a "gold standard".

Ultimately, any disagreement will come down to whether it's believable that
you did or not not sign a particular document that you claim to or claim not
to have signed. The presence of a signature does not in and of itself
constitute proof, nor does the existence of a digitized version of your
signature affect that.

It amazes me that an MIT graduate would claim that it does.

The only problem with that logic is once your written checks go
through the system and are scanned you digital signature already
exists. It is virtually impossible to prevent your signature from
being digitized. If you signed to get a credit card it is in the
system even if you have never used one.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

Pete

I have not received a canceled paper check, or the image of one in
over 20 years


I get them every month (but my bank is changing over). When I get cancelled
checks, I HAVE THEM. Nobody can charge me for the privilege of looking at them
or using them as evidence. It's not something I want to give up.

Jose

--
(for Email, make the obvious changes in my address)

Thought of y'all when I saw this today.
Mary Ann Francis, National City senior vice
president and manager of global trade and
treasury, will discuss Check 21 which was
signed into law by President Bush last
October. Check 21 is short for the "Check
Clearing for the 21st Century Act. "Simply
put, beginning on October 28 of this year,
banks may begin to replace the original
check with a substitute check after it has
been cleared using image exchange.
I didn't attend the teleseminar.

Of course I saw this when I was checking on some money that I
had *electronically* tranferred to my brokerage account. It
takes a *week* to do that! (OTOH, my credit union does not
issue any holds for checks deposited into my account.)

Three Aztecs moved to our field not long ago to haul checks.
I feel sorry for the pilots/owners but I think hauling checks
is a horrible use of resources. (It's a notch below flying
to lunch.) Maybe there will be some spare parts available
for me soon...

--kyler

I feel sorry for the pilots/owners but I think hauling checks
is a horrible use of resources. (It's a notch below flying
to lunch.)

Guess the banks who pay interest on those checks didnt think so.

"BTIZ" wrote in message
news:L92bd.29581$_a3.5508@fed1read05...
Stores have been doing that around here for a few years.. works like a
debit card at that point.. instantly removed from your account.. no
float..

BT


Not totally true. It's just submitted as an ACH (Automated Clearing House)
transaction
and not a paper one. Only a debit card can access your account real time.
You could
have nothing in your account and the ACH would be accepted at the store. And
the
transaction would then bounce when posted.

Here's more on Check 21:

http://www.consumersunion.org/finance/ckclear1002.htm

"G.R. Patterson III" wrote in message ...
Ron Natalie wrote:

I still find having at least the substitute paper reassuring to me (and
my horrendous filing system). Of course, I do find it handy to be able
to call up images of my checks that haven't been mailed back to me on
my bank's web site.

I need a change. I don't get *either* with my Credit Union account. If I need a copy
of the actual check, they charge me $5 and have to mail or FAX it to me. (Of course,
I've only needed that once in the many years I've had the account.)

Most banks now will let you download the scanned copy on line. The $5
charge is usually only if you need a certified copy for court.

-robert

Kyler Laird wrote in message ...

Of course I saw this when I was checking on some money that I
had *electronically* tranferred to my brokerage account. It
takes a *week* to do that! (OTOH, my credit union does not
issue any holds for checks deposited into my account.)
=
My broker is the same way. Transfers take forever and getting a check
from a stock sale takes weeks. I'm sure they are just making money on
the float. What in the world would they be waiting for after selling
stocks that they hold the certs for?
-Robert