question on student taxi practice

Has anybody ever heard of an instructor turning a pre-solo student loose in
an airplane alone for taxi practice around an airport without supervision ?
It was basically "go taxi the airplane around the airport and taxiways but
don't go on the runway and don't take off, I'll come back to check on you in
30 minutes" Is this a normal thing ?

On 04/06/06 10:44, Mark wrote:
Has anybody ever heard of an instructor turning a pre-solo student loose in
an airplane alone for taxi practice around an airport without supervision ?
It was basically "go taxi the airplane around the airport and taxiways but
don't go on the runway and don't take off, I'll come back to check on you in
30 minutes" Is this a normal thing ?




Did your instructor give you a solo endorsement?

I'm not sure if the FAA recognizes ground-only operations as a separate
type of solo.

--
Mark Hansen, PP-ASEL, Instrument Airplane
Cal Aggie Flying Farmers
Sacramento, CA

I'm not sure if the FAA recognizes ground-only operations as a separate
type of solo.

The FAA doesn't but sometimes the question comes down to insurance.
Your post got me interested so I checked my AIG policy. It only limits
what pilots (and qualifications) can fly the plane. For helicpoters
they define flight as many self-propelled movement, but for fixed wing
they define it as leaving the ground. I know the airlines have training
they require of employees before they can move a plane, something
probably directed by insurance. If you ever watch the reality show
"Airline" there was an 18 year old guy working on getting his
certification to pull 737's with the tug. We got to see his first
"supervised solo" as he pulled a Southwest plane into a tight gate.

-Robert

Robert M. Gary wrote:
I'm not sure if the FAA recognizes ground-only operations as a separate
type of solo.

The FAA doesn't but sometimes the question comes down to insurance.

The insurance companies are the de-facto regulatory agency these days.

Your post got me interested so I checked my AIG policy. It only limits
what pilots (and qualifications) can fly the plane. For helicpoters
they define flight as many self-propelled movement, but for fixed wing
they define it as leaving the ground. I know the airlines have training
they require of employees before they can move a plane, something
probably directed by insurance.

Heck, I don't care if the FAA *and* the insurance company allows it.
If I owned something worth the better part of $100 Million, I sure
would want anybody moving the thing to have some sort of training.
Hangar rash gets real expensive real quick when you're talking 777's.

"Roy Smith" wrote in message
...
[...]
Heck, I don't care if the FAA *and* the insurance company allows it.
If I owned something worth the better part of $100 Million, I sure
would want anybody moving the thing to have some sort of training.
Hangar rash gets real expensive real quick when you're talking 777's.

Well, ignoring for the moment that I don't think anyone here was "talking
777's"...

....of course some kind of training is required. Transport aircraft aren't
typically taxied under their own power in and around other airplanes; they
use tugs for that, and the operators of the tugs require training as well
(as Robert's post did point out). When they are taxied under their own
power, it's only with a properly trained person at the controls (even if
that person isn't a pilot).

Likewise, no one is suggesting student pilots just be handed the keys and
told to go play around. An instructor wouldn't have them practice taxiing
until the student had already been given some instruction.

As far as the practicality of it goes, I'm not sure I see the point of
having a student practice taxiing solo. Often, the trickiest part about
taxiing an airplane is out of and back into parking. Even if the airplane
is pulled by hand out of and back into the parking space proper, taxiing
near the space can be tight quarters. Once you get out onto the taxiway,
you usually have a lot of leeway (though at smaller airports this isn't
always the case). If you can get to the taxiway, you probably are already
plenty competent in taxiing.

Pete

As far as the practicality of it goes, I'm not sure I see the point of
having a student practice taxiing solo.

Taildragger?

Jose
--
Nothing takes longer than a shortcut.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

On 04/06/06 12:41, Robert M. Gary wrote:
I'm not sure if the FAA recognizes ground-only operations as a separate
type of solo.

The FAA doesn't but sometimes the question comes down to insurance.
Your post got me interested so I checked my AIG policy. It only limits
what pilots (and qualifications) can fly the plane. For helicpoters
they define flight as many self-propelled movement, but for fixed wing
they define it as leaving the ground. I know the airlines have training
they require of employees before they can move a plane, something
probably directed by insurance. If you ever watch the reality show
"Airline" there was an 18 year old guy working on getting his
certification to pull 737's with the tug. We got to see his first
"supervised solo" as he pulled a Southwest plane into a tight gate.

-Robert


That was the line of thinking I had. My assumption was that prior to
being a certificated pilot, you would need some time of supervision to
move the airplane under it's own power (in effect, to run the engine),
and that would normally come in the form of a logbook endorsement.

After all, if the student didn't know what he was doing, he could cause
all kinds of havoc.

However, I know that pretty early in my flight training, I was taxiing
the airplane solo, and I didn't have a logbook endorsement, just the
CFI's verbal authorization.

There may be a good reason why the CFI allowed the low-time student to
practice taxiing around. Without knowing all the details, I would assume
the CFI has a good reason, and found it to be within acceptable safety
margins, etc.


--
Mark Hansen, PP-ASEL, Instrument Airplane
Cal Aggie Flying Farmers
Sacramento, CA

"Mark" wrote in message
...
Has anybody ever heard of an instructor turning a pre-solo student loose
in
an airplane alone for taxi practice around an airport without supervision
?
It was basically "go taxi the airplane around the airport and taxiways but
don't go on the runway and don't take off, I'll come back to check on you
in
30 minutes" Is this a normal thing ?


Far as I know anybody can taxi a GA training type airplane.

Does not sound legal in the USA for the average student
pilot. Aircraft mechanics often get a "taxi approval" from
their employer to cover insurance requirements. Just
taxiing may not require a solo endorsement, but it sure
raises some issues of liability and insurance coverage.


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm
See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and duties.


"Mark" wrote in message
...
| Has anybody ever heard of an instructor turning a pre-solo
student loose in
| an airplane alone for taxi practice around an airport
without supervision ?
| It was basically "go taxi the airplane around the airport
and taxiways but
| don't go on the runway and don't take off, I'll come back
to check on you in
| 30 minutes" Is this a normal thing ?
|
|

Has anybody ever heard of an instructor turning a pre-solo student loose
in
an airplane alone for taxi practice around an airport without supervision
?
It was basically "go taxi the airplane around the airport and taxiways but
don't go on the runway and don't take off, I'll come back to check on you
in
30 minutes" Is this a normal thing ?

It wasn't me, and I don't care what the FAA thinks. I'll rephrase my
question. Is it a usual and accepted practice for a CFI to let a 2 hour
time, pre solo student taxi around unsupervised solo ?