Cost of gas is beginning to hurt

"Matt Barrow" wrote in message
...

"Chris" wrote in message
...

"Matt Barrow" wrote in message
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wrote in message
oups.com...
On Apr 18, 12:45 pm, "Peter R." wrote:
On 4/18/2007 1:12:25 PM, wrote:

Just wait until they jack up the fuel tax to $0.70 a gallon and then
listen to the complaints! There will be a lot more planes parked on
the ramp and fewer in the air once this tax increase goes through.

If this tax does go through, expect the number of unfilled Angel
Flight
missions (failure of a volunteer pilot to accept the flight) to
sharply
increase.

--
Peter

Saudi Arabia must have some nice GA fields funded by the "tax" they
impose on us.

Tax??? It's their oil and I suppose in a free market you can charge what
you like -

The open market determines the price and that's where everyone sells.

when you use more the price goes up and when you use less the price goes
down.

Supply is the big determination, and the demand part is being outstripped
by China and India.

Start using less.

Start producing more. Something like 75% of US capacity is "off limits"
thanks to Congress (who will always have all THEY need).


It is the oil companies that are doing the stiffing.

Bull **** in spades.

Oil Companies have averaged 12-15 cents profit on each gallon; government,
state and federal, gets 24 cents up to 60 cents for doing absolutly
NOTHING by signing papers.


You are utterly and totally clueless.

redneck ****!

"Matt Barrow" wrote in message
...

It is the oil companies that are doing the stiffing.

Bull **** in spades.

Oil Companies have averaged 12-15 cents profit on each gallon;

Meanwhile, quarter after quarter they're making the highest profits in the
history of human civilization, while the national economy--not to mention GA
itself--slowly bleed out due to high costs of transportation.

-c

The national economy is booming. Anybody with a 401k can tell you that.
April has so far been one of the best months in a long time.



gatt wrote:

"Matt Barrow" wrote in message
...


It is the oil companies that are doing the stiffing.

Bull **** in spades.

Oil Companies have averaged 12-15 cents profit on each gallon;


Meanwhile, quarter after quarter they're making the highest profits in the
history of human civilization, while the national economy--not to mention GA
itself--slowly bleed out due to high costs of transportation.

-c

In article ,
"Blueskies" wrote:

"Justin Gombos" wrote in message
news:f3hWh.756$dM1.354@trndny07...
: On 2007-04-20, ArtP wrote:
: On 19 Apr 2007 17:38:00 -0700, M wrote:
:
: I suspect for aviation diesel will be the solution for a while.
:
: Exactly. Leaving 100LL for unleaded is half-assed. When fuel prices
: match the prices in Europe, consumers will be going straight to
: diesel, and Jet A will supply them.
:
: I also agree w/ M. Aircraft makers are short-sighted. Consider the
: small fraction of single engine diesels available. More manufacturers
: should have already been on that by now.

Ain't gonna happen, since most GA aircraft have gasoline engines, which
will puke their guts out on biodiesel (or any other Diesel, for that
matter.

: Out of curiosity, what's to stop the GA pilot (in terms of FAA law)
: from making their own batch of biodiesel from waste oil to get rock
: bottom prices, and sidestep the avgas tax entirely?

Engine compatability -- 99.% of GA engines are piston engines designed
for gasoline. turbine engines, theoretically, will burn anything that
can be metered. They would have to be recalibrated for biodiesel, due to
viscosity/density differences; additives would have to be added to
prevent water and other contamination; they might freeze up at altitude
(-60F for some jets).


: Accounting for the cost of raw material, the yield would be ~$1/gal,
: which would make the fuel costs of flying cheaper than that of driving
: a typical car. And (IRS aside) what kind of FAA approval process
: would enable a GA pilot to do that? Or is that scenario pure fiction?
:
: --


Diesel or Jet fuel will cost us the same a 100LL if the switch over occurs.
BioDiesel will also become unobtanium
when/if the demand shifts; there is not enough bio stuff to make it with to
go around.

In article ,
"gatt" wrote:

Oil Companies have averaged 12-15 cents profit on each gallon;

Meanwhile, quarter after quarter they're making the highest profits in the
history of human civilization, while the national economy--not to mention GA
itself--slowly bleed out due to high costs of transportation.

If they only get around $0.12 to $0.15 profit per gallon, and they still get
higher and higher profits, maybe it's because they keep selling more and
more of the stuff.

duh

--
Bob Noel
(goodness, please trim replies!!!)

On 2007-04-23, Orval Fairbairn wrote:
In article ,
"Blueskies" wrote:

Ain't gonna happen, since most GA aircraft have gasoline engines,
which will puke their guts out on biodiesel (or any other Diesel,
for that matter.

You misunderstood me. I wasn't suggesting that a pilot put biodiesel
in a non-diesel engine.

But since you bring it up, a gasoline engine can actually burn
(bio)diesel safely, as long as it's mixed with at least 90% gasoline.
It would essentially be the equivelent of very high octane gasoline.
Are you familiar with those "octane boosters" sold in 8 dollar retail
bottles with all the fancy graphics? Lookup the MSDS on it - it's
only kerosene (iow, fuel oil)

In article HDcXh.4499$0d2.3629@trndny02,
Justin Gombos wrote:

On 2007-04-23, Orval Fairbairn wrote:
In article ,
"Blueskies" wrote:

Ain't gonna happen, since most GA aircraft have gasoline engines,
which will puke their guts out on biodiesel (or any other Diesel,
for that matter.

You misunderstood me. I wasn't suggesting that a pilot put biodiesel
in a non-diesel engine.

But since you bring it up, a gasoline engine can actually burn
(bio)diesel safely, as long as it's mixed with at least 90% gasoline.
It would essentially be the equivelent of very high octane gasoline.
Are you familiar with those "octane boosters" sold in 8 dollar retail
bottles with all the fancy graphics? Lookup the MSDS on it - it's
only kerosene (iow, fuel oil)

Kerosene is very LOW octane!

Orval Fairbairn wrote:

Kerosene is very LOW octane!

But, doncha see! Just pour a bit in with your regular fuel, and once the
seals fail completely, you'll have near infinite octane!

:P

TheSmokingGnu

"gatt" wrote in message
...

"Matt Barrow" wrote in message
...

It is the oil companies that are doing the stiffing.

Bull **** in spades.

Oil Companies have averaged 12-15 cents profit on each gallon;

Meanwhile, quarter after quarter they're making the highest profits in the
history of human civilization, while the national economy--not to mention
GA itself--slowly bleed out due to high costs of transportation.

There are several industries with higher profit margins; they just don't
have the volume or the breath of market. Exxon pumped something like 250
billion gallons last year.

BTW, while the oil companies make 12-15 cents, take a look at the government
take:

Federal rate of 18.4 cents/gallon and the states (Excise & Other) at 18
(Montana) to
64 cents (NY), 60.1 (Hawaii), California (60.0) per gallon.

The average tax on gas is 45.9 cent/gallon (Federal & State) as of last fall
(2005).

And don't give that BS about government using it for infrastructure; our
roads are deteriorating since half goes into the general funds and the
remainder goes largerly to politically connected pork projects.

So who is doing the bleeding?

Here's a dollar: buy a clue.
--
Matt Barrow
Performace Homes, LLC.
Colorado Springs, CO

Matt Barrow wrote:
"gatt" wrote in message
...
"Matt Barrow" wrote in message
...

It is the oil companies that are doing the stiffing.
Bull **** in spades.

Oil Companies have averaged 12-15 cents profit on each gallon;
Meanwhile, quarter after quarter they're making the highest profits in the
history of human civilization, while the national economy--not to mention
GA itself--slowly bleed out due to high costs of transportation.

There are several industries with higher profit margins; they just don't
have the volume or the breath of market. Exxon pumped something like 250
billion gallons last year.

BTW, while the oil companies make 12-15 cents, take a look at the government
take:

Federal rate of 18.4 cents/gallon and the states (Excise & Other) at 18
(Montana) to
64 cents (NY), 60.1 (Hawaii), California (60.0) per gallon.

The average tax on gas is 45.9 cent/gallon (Federal & State) as of last fall
(2005).

And don't give that BS about government using it for infrastructure; our
roads are deteriorating since half goes into the general funds and the
remainder goes largerly to politically connected pork projects.

So who is doing the bleeding?

Here's a dollar: buy a clue.

I think the future of general aviation belongs to diesel. I've been
doing a little research on the Thielert 172/182 and the economics of it
are compelling. You're talking about the difference between ~17.5 gph
and ~11.5 gph on a 182...and the diesel has seventy percent fewer moving
parts in it.

There's also significant concern about the ongoing availability of 100LL.

So...all I have to do is sell my wife on the idea of buying a Thielert
172 with a glass panel.

Fat chance.