Gloom

Jay Honeck wrote:

Then things went downhill.

Not to start a Cessna vs. Piper debate(!), but I have to contrast your report on Piper's strategy with the
reports from the Cessna Pilots Association fly-in held in Wichita a few weeks ago. I wasn't there
personally, so this is just second-hand, but the reports have been very positive, with Cessna hosting
factory tours, demonstrations, and seminars, both at Wichita and at their single engine manufacturing
facility in Independence. There was also lots of positive buzz about their LSA and NGP prototypes and
business plans. So, is Piper's strategy really indicative of the industry as a whole, or just one company's
direction?

Mike

Not to start a Cessna vs. Piper debate(!), but I have to contrast your report on Piper's strategy with the
reports from the Cessna Pilots Association fly-in held in Wichita a few weeks ago. I wasn't there
personally, so this is just second-hand, but the reports have been very positive, with Cessna hosting
factory tours, demonstrations, and seminars, both at Wichita and at their single engine manufacturing
facility in Independence. There was also lots of positive buzz about their LSA and NGP prototypes and
business plans. So, is Piper's strategy really indicative of the industry as a whole, or just one company's
direction?

Oh, there's no doubt that Cessna is in GA for the long haul -- but
they *already have* their jet(s). They probably make more profit on
a single Citation than on ten (or more?) Skyhawks, and that's what
Piper is aiming at.

Difference is (as has been the case since the 1940s), Piper is way
behind the marketing curve. They needed to have a light jet 25 years
ago.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

On 2007-06-18, Mike Adams wrote:
Jay Honeck wrote:

Then things went downhill.

Not to start a Cessna vs. Piper debate(!)

I've always heard this about Piper - giving pilots interested in the
company the cold shoulder, but if you go to the Cessna factory they'll
give you a tour. Indeed, we did just that - we happened to be passing
the area in a pair of (ancient) Cessnas (a 1951 C170, and a 1946 C140),
and we turned up un-announced - they were very pleased to see us at the
factory and gave us a tour. After all, we could one day be future
customers. So out of Piper and Cessna, who's selling all the light GA
stuff? Not hard to guess.

--
Yes, the Reply-To email address is valid.
Oolite-Linux: an Elite tribute: http://oolite-linux.berlios.de

I've always heard this about Piper - giving pilots interested in the
company the cold shoulder

Actually, Bass made a point of mentioning that he tries to meet each
and every Piper customer on the factory floor.

He is *very* focused on employee and customer relations -- he's just
taking the company in a direction that I won't be able to follow.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
ps.com...
I've always heard this about Piper - giving pilots interested in the
company the cold shoulder

Actually, Bass made a point of mentioning that he tries to meet each
and every Piper customer on the factory floor.

He is *very* focused on employee and customer relations -- he's just
taking the company in a direction that I won't be able to follow.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

The problem is that he is taking his company in a direction that very few
existing customers, and still fewer new customers can follow.

It's not a Cessna vs Piper debate, it's Cessna vs All-Those-Schmucks!

There really is a lot more to the entry level through executive jet concept
than brand loyalty. There is also service center loyalty, which I suspect
is much stronger.

I really think that it's a shame, since I prefer low wing aircraft

Peter

On Jun 18, 1:06 pm, Jay Honeck wrote:
He then drove the stake in further by stating unequivocably that Piper
would NOT be entering the Light Sport market, thus confirming (to most
attendees) that Piper was on the verge of completely abandoning their
piston single line.

Seems to me that Piper is Piper in name only, it's a brand with
recognition and that's what the company is going to trade on. By
showing distinct disinterest in the LSA market they have, whether they
wanted to or not, basically written themselves out of piston single
GA.

LSA (and the equivalents in other countries) is, without any shadow of
a doubt, the way that GA for recreational flyers (and flying school
fleets) is going, any company that doesn't see that is going to be
left behind.

10 years from now, I expect that the large majority of recreational
and student pilots will behind the stick of an LSA, traditional GA
isn't going to be cost effective for too much longer.

On Sun, 17 Jun 2007 22:49:49 -0700, James Sleeman
wrote in
.com:

10 years from now, I expect that the large majority of recreational
and student pilots will behind the stick of an LSA,

Or a sailplane.

Larry Dighera writes:

On Sun, 17 Jun 2007 22:49:49 -0700, James Sleeman
wrote:

10 years from now, I expect that the large majority of recreational
and student pilots will behind the stick of an LSA,

Or a sailplane.

Or a simulator. No, I'm not joking.

On Jun 18, 3:06 pm, Mxsmanic wrote:
10 years from now, I expect that the large majority of recreational
and student pilots will behind the stick of an LSA,

Or a simulator. No, I'm not joking.

Joking, no. Wrong, yes.

Gary writes:

Joking, no. Wrong, yes.

I hope I'm wrong. But remember that a key driver of serious simulation is a
lack of resources needed to fly for real, and so the more people who cannot
fly for real, the more who will resort to simulators. And simulation is doing
very well, even if real GA is not.