4130 can't be OA welded?

While browsing a bit more of that "good 'ole internet wizdom", I ran
accross this page:

http://www.ihpva.org/com/PracticalIn...materials.html

Its a human-powered vehicle website, but on this page, the author
seems to think that 4130 cro-mo steel can't be welded with an oxy-
acetylene torch. Does this sound right? It was always my belief that
we've been OA welding airplanes out of the stuff for decades. Who is
wrong on this point?

Harry "I'm still stuck in the wood-age" Frey

"wright1902glider" wrote in message
...
While browsing a bit more of that "good 'ole internet wizdom", I ran
accross this page:

http://www.ihpva.org/com/PracticalIn...materials.html

Its a human-powered vehicle website, but on this page, the author
seems to think that 4130 cro-mo steel can't be welded with an oxy-
acetylene torch. Does this sound right? It was always my belief that
we've been OA welding airplanes out of the stuff for decades. Who is
wrong on this point?

Harry "I'm still stuck in the wood-age" Frey


It's BS

IMHO 4130 is easier to weld with OA than mild steel.

"wright1902glider" wrote in message
...
While browsing a bit more of that "good 'ole internet wizdom", I ran
accross this page:

http://www.ihpva.org/com/PracticalIn...materials.html

Its a human-powered vehicle website, but on this page, the author
seems to think that 4130 cro-mo steel can't be welded with an oxy-
acetylene torch. Does this sound right? It was always my belief that
we've been OA welding airplanes out of the stuff for decades. Who is
wrong on this point?



Last airplane I rode in was Oxyen Acetylene welded 4130...

--
Geoff
The Sea Hawk at Wow Way d0t Com
remove spaces and make the obvious substitutions to reply by mail
When immigration is outlawed, only outlaws will immigrate.

"wright1902glider" wrote in message
...
| While browsing a bit more of that "good 'ole internet wizdom", I ran
| accross this page:
|
| http://www.ihpva.org/com/PracticalIn...materials.html
|
| Its a human-powered vehicle website, but on this page, the author
| seems to think that 4130 cro-mo steel can't be welded with an oxy-
| acetylene torch. Does this sound right? It was always my belief that
| we've been OA welding airplanes out of the stuff for decades. Who is
| wrong on this point?
|
| Harry "I'm still stuck in the wood-age" Frey
|
|

For many years that was the only approved method. Then along came TIG
welding.

--
Anyolmouse

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On Dec 28, 6:28 pm, "Anyolmouse" wrote:

For many years that was the only approved method. Then along came TIG
welding.

American Champion has been using MIG for years now. Quicker
and easier than TIG. But their tubing tends to be heavier, too, which
makes MIG an easy option.

Dan

wrote in message
...
| On Dec 28, 6:28 pm, "Anyolmouse" wrote:
|
| For many years that was the only approved method. Then along came
TIG
| welding.
|
| American Champion has been using MIG for years now. Quicker
| and easier than TIG. But their tubing tends to be heavier, too, which
| makes MIG an easy option.
|
| Dan
|

I didn't know that it was approved for aircraft.

--
Anyolmouse

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On Dec 29, 8:09 am, "Anyolmouse" wrote:
wrote in message

...
| On Dec 28, 6:28 pm, "Anyolmouse" wrote:
|
| For many years that was the only approved method. Then along came
TIG
| welding.
|
| American Champion has been using MIG for years now. Quicker
| and easier than TIG. But their tubing tends to be heavier, too, which
| makes MIG an easy option.
|
| Dan
|

I didn't know that it was approved for aircraft.

It's approved by manufacturer's drawings. The manufacturer
will call for welds as per their own welding specs, and those specs
plus the airframe drawings are approved by the FAA. We sometimes find
industrial hardware or other "uncertified" parts on airplanes, and
they're approved by their presence on the drawings. For example,
American Champion uses a cheap industrial clip nut on their cowling
installations that has no locking feature and it's really soft so it
cross-threads easily. And is forever falling off or sliding out of
place. This is fixed using the minor modification provisions of the
applicable country's aircraft maintenance laws, replacing those stupid
things with real aircraft hardware.

Dan

wrote in message
...
| On Dec 29, 8:09 am, "Anyolmouse" wrote:
| wrote in message
|
|
...
| | On Dec 28, 6:28 pm, "Anyolmouse"
wrote:
| |
| | For many years that was the only approved method. Then along
came
| TIG
| | welding.
| |
| | American Champion has been using MIG for years now.
Quicker
| | and easier than TIG. But their tubing tends to be heavier, too,
which
| | makes MIG an easy option.
| |
| | Dan
| |
|
| I didn't know that it was approved for aircraft.
|
| It's approved by manufacturer's drawings. The manufacturer
| will call for welds as per their own welding specs, and those specs
| plus the airframe drawings are approved by the FAA. We sometimes find
| industrial hardware or other "uncertified" parts on airplanes, and
| they're approved by their presence on the drawings. For example,
| American Champion uses a cheap industrial clip nut on their cowling
| installations that has no locking feature and it's really soft so it
| cross-threads easily. And is forever falling off or sliding out of
| place. This is fixed using the minor modification provisions of the
| applicable country's aircraft maintenance laws, replacing those stupid
| things with real aircraft hardware.
|
| Dan
|
|

Thanks,

--
Anyolmouse

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On Dec 28, 2:57 pm, wright1902glider wrote:
the author
seems to think that 4130 cro-mo steel can't be welded with an oxy-
acetylene torch.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Pure bull****. Indeed, for the stresses encountered in bicycles
(which is what he's talking about) there are any number of BRAZING
compounds that yield joints stronger than than normalized 4130.

O/A does just fine airframes... and for bike frames.

Several years ago a EAA member was building a four place experimental with
4130 as the airframe , the gentleman either couldn't or wouldn't learn to do
GAS welding and he ask the FAA if he could braze the structure together ,
FAA said that as it was under the experimental category and they could not
prevent him from brazing his four place bird together but they would like
him to make some samples to proof test his idea , samples proved his concept
and FAA gave him a green light , I think the filler rod was Eutectic FC16 ,
I did get a couple samples of the filler and made my own samples of 5/8 X
..035 4130 , tubing bent and finally broke after great load was applied , no
failure in the filler , only adjacent to it , the problem with this material
is that it uses a Flux coating and some of it is going to get inside the
tube and the stuff will corrode.
Phil
wrote in message
...
On Dec 28, 2:57 pm, wright1902glider wrote:
the author
seems to think that 4130 cro-mo steel can't be welded with an oxy-
acetylene torch.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Pure bull****. Indeed, for the stresses encountered in bicycles
(which is what he's talking about) there are any number of BRAZING
compounds that yield joints stronger than than normalized 4130.

O/A does just fine airframes... and for bike frames.