PowerFlarm BRICK range issues - are we alone????

On Friday, October 5, 2012 10:59:34 AM UTC-7, John Cochrane wrote:
Is there no provision for an external speaker? If not, Paul, I hope you'll lobby flarm to provide it. There are enough wires dangling out of this thing to assign two of them to audio out. Many people will use PNAs, PDAs or clearnav for display. Do we have then no audio at all? John Cochrane

The brick has no audio output and no internal audio circuits. The alarms are indicated to an external device by setting the appropriate values in the serial digital output data.

GY

On Oct 5, 10:59*am, John Cochrane wrote:
of this thing to assign two of them to audio out. Many people will use
PNAs, PDAs or clearnav for display. Do we have then no audio at all?
John Cochrane

John - Not sure about the external speaker (and like you, I think
there ought to be an option). But here's an alternative: You can
shove the FLARM data out to your PDA/PNA (along with GPS info). Then
the PDA can provide the audio (if your PNA/PDA program of choice
supports FLARM - many of them do). I'm not making excuses here, just
trying to provide solutions...

Greg - I have. And while there were a rash of early problems and
complaints, lately I've only seen a couple of people expressing
serious concerns. I see a lot of whining about wanting the system to
be better; but very few legitimate instances where the system did not
alert the user to traffic at a range sufficient to prevent a
collision.

Again, I return to my earlier points about restaurants and cars: Go
do an internet search for your favorite model of car and you will find
people posting about problems with it, accidents, breakdowns, etc.
That doesn't mean the car is necessarily horrible and you should never
buy one. The key is to think about how many people _aren't_
complaining, because things are working just fine for them. You will
always find more complaints than endorsements about a product because
complaining is so easy (especially in the internet age), and people
are more motivated when things are going wrong. When things are
working well, people use something and get on with their life.

--Noel

Mark and everybody,

sorry for the inconvenience!

To help us track down the problem, would you be able to
create a flarmcfg.txt with the following line,
put it on the root directory of a USB stick and connect it to your brick
before switching on power:

$adsb,configure,mtlac,300
$pflac,s,pcasrange,9000

ATTENTION: The mtlac setting is non-permanent, so you'll
have to connect the USB stick every time the core starts up.
(Settings using $PFLAC are permanent).

If this improves the PCAS range then it's a software problem
and will be fixed in the upcoming firmware release.

The LED should flash green to confirm the setting.

You write your antenna installation is good. Do you get a display for
ADS-B targets?

Thanks for your help and sorry again for the inconvenience.

FYI: IGC format logging is under internal testing, a beta release
is upcoming.

Best
--Gerhard




Am Montag, 1. Oktober 2012 17:56:14 UTC+2 schrieb Mark:
Three members at my club (self included) have installed PowerFlarm bricks recently. We carefully read and have complied with the antenna separation requirements in the manual. As is stands currently, the maximum xperienced communication range (Flarm to Flarm) is about 2.2 miles and it frequently drops out around 1.3-1.5 miles. Regarding PCAS operation, the only alert I have received using the PowerFlarm Brick has been the towplane at a distance of about 1000-1500 feet lateraly, same altitude. At the same time my Zaon PCAS alerted to the same towplane at a range of 2+ miles and 1000 feet below.



The three gliders are a Ventus 1, Discus 2, and a PIK. All three seem to be experiencing the same issues with very poor range. Emails to FLARM have seemed to fall on deaf ears. We're curious if we're the only ones or if others are also seeing the same issues with BRICKS. We've heard plenty from portable users who are reporting 6+ miles Flarm to Flarm and PCAS alerts approaching 5 miles. If changes to the installation will fix this, great! We just need to know what to change. The US dealer has seen pics of our installation and says the antenna installations look good. They are all on the top of the glare shields so should be excellent visibility. We'd like this to work, but if there is no option to improve the performance then sending the stuff back is certainly on the table. More testing this weekend, but at the moment it's not looking good.

On Friday, October 5, 2012 1:35:50 PM UTC-7, wrote:

$adsb,configure,mtlac,300 $pflac,s,pcasrange,9000


From the ADS-B module data port specification:

MTLAC 64 to 800 Mode-A/C minimum triggering level.


A continous stream of airliners passes over my house. What I normally see is that PF PCAS function does not detect them until the range is about 2 statute miles. However, after they have first been detected, they remain displayed until the range reaches 6 statute miles or more.

I'll try changing MTLAC and report if it makes any difference.


Andy GY

On Friday, October 5, 2012 2:22:04 PM UTC-7, Andy wrote:


On second thoughts, since airliners will be mode S equipped, isn't varying MTLS more likely to change the behavior?

MTLS 64 to 800 Mode-S and ADS-B minimum triggering level (sensitivity) of the TRX in ADC units. The higher, the less sensitive.

Andy

On Friday, October 5, 2012 4:22:04 PM UTC-5, Andy wrote:
On Friday, October 5, 2012 1:35:50 PM UTC-7, wrote:



$adsb,configure,mtlac,300 $pflac,s,pcasrange,9000





From the ADS-B module data port specification:



MTLAC 64 to 800 Mode-A/C minimum triggering level.





A continous stream of airliners passes over my house. What I normally see is that PF PCAS function does not detect them until the range is about 2 statute miles. However, after they have first been detected, they remain displayed until the range reaches 6 statute miles or more.



I'll try changing MTLAC and report if it makes any difference.





Andy GY

Andy, I noticed the same behaviour when ground testing my PFB: many of the PCAS targets would appear at short range, then stay on the display out to the full 5 miles.

ADSB tracks seemed to not have the same problem; however, they are still fairly infrequent so hard to make a valid comparison.

My ground settings a

################################################## ######################
# Set ADS-B horizontal and vertical range in meters.
# horizontal range: max: 65535m For gliders recommended: 9000m
# vertical range: For gliders recommended: 500m
# Testing max range
################################################## ######################
$pflac,s,adsbrange,23000
$pflac,s,adsbvrange,3000

################################################## ######################
# Set PCAS horizontal and vertical range in meters.
# horizontal range: max: 9250m For gliders recommended: 9250m
# vertical range: For gliders recommended: 500m
# Testing max range
################################################## ######################
$pflac,s,pcasrange,9250
$pflac,s,pcasvrange,3000

################################################## ######################

Kirk
66

http://flarm.invisionzone.com/index....indpost&p=1389

We are planning to have a beta v2.60 release before November 2012.
That release should also improve PCAS range.
It will be a joint release for both 'Brick' and 'Portable'

The release will also include obstacle warning functionality.
If you know of any dangerous obstacles (especially non-AIP), please let us know.
Check out Obstacle Submission Manual:
http://www.flarm.com/support/manual/...ual_v5.00E.pdf

On Friday, October 5, 2012 3:55:28 PM UTC-7, FLARM wrote:
http://flarm.invisionzone.com/index....indpost&p=1389



We are planning to have a beta v2.60 release before November 2012.

That release should also improve PCAS range.

It will be a joint release for both 'Brick' and 'Portable'



The release will also include obstacle warning functionality.

If you know of any dangerous obstacles (especially non-AIP), please let us know.

Check out Obstacle Submission Manual:

http://www.flarm.com/support/manual/...ual_v5.00E.pdf

Thanks Flarm. And it looks like we now have a dedicated forum at
http://flarm.invisionzone.com/index.php?showforum=6

To those claiming that powerflarm is not working as promissed, this is far from accurate. Powerflarm is doing well what it was mainly design to do, provide collision alert between flarm equipped aircrafts. Sure there are still some quirks, and fixes are coming. Worst case scenario you will need to send you unit back for free upgrade. You won't benefit from waiting, it will cost the same or more later, and in the meantime you will be missing a valuable protection for yourself and those who fly with you.

Ramy

Andy,


A continous stream of airliners passes over my house. What I normally see is that PF PCAS function does not detect them until the range is about 2 statute miles. However, after they have first been detected, they remain displayed until the range reaches 6 statute miles or more.

Is that with the device indoors? ADS-B targets (trianges) or Mode C/S (circles)?

I'll try changing MTLAC and report if it makes any difference.

I recommend to leave it above 250 (both Mode S and C). Please let me know how it goes.

FYI, Mode S XPDRs also reply to Mode C interrogations.

PCAS is limited to 5 NM (the configurator has this wrong unfortunately,
we'll fix that ASAP), trying to set a higher PCASRANGE is ignored.

Best
--Gerhard

--
Dr. Gerhard Wesp
Development Manager, Avionics
FLARM Technology GmbH
Switzerland
CH-020.4.033.059-8

Hi John,

The audio function is provided by the display device - either a remote FLARM
or Butterfly or LXNAV display or a PDA. The PowerFLARM Brick unit is
usually mounted in a "buried" location - inside the instrument panel. That
is why it made sense to put the speaker in the display. Rather than adding
an additional external speaker, I think the best approach is to improve the
loudness of the Butterfly Rectangular Display.

Best Regards,

Paul Remde
Cumulus Soaring, Inc.

"John Cochrane" wrote in message
...

On Oct 5, 12:02 pm, "Paul Remde" wrote:
Hi Mike,

OK. I may concede that the Butterfly rectangular remote display has a
speaker that is not as loud as we would hope. Fortunately, there are
alternatives. The Butterfly 57 mm round display is quite loud. So is the
new LXNAV FlarmView. I have one on my desk and it is very loud. I have
them in stock for $255 and will add them to my web site very soon. Until
then you can see details atwww.lxnav.com.

Paul Remde
Cumulus Soaring, Inc.
_______________________________________

Is there no provision for an external speaker? If not, Paul, I hope
you'll lobby flarm to provide it. There are enough wires dangling out
of this thing to assign two of them to audio out. Many people will use
PNAs, PDAs or clearnav for display. Do we have then no audio at all?
John Cochrane