Parachute 20 year limit

....if sport parachutists carry a reserve it is round canopy.

They do and they're not -
http://www.strongparachutes.com/page...ve_stellar.php

One bailout where the pilot fell out of his rig(unknown if unfastened it
during egress or never fastened it on the ground) was an acro accident in
the states early 90's in a Pitts if anyone want to look for the accident.

Rounds are not more reliable, do not open faster and don't necessarily
pack any smaller(depends on the size of the square). All sport
parachutists (BASE is an exception, different sport) carry reserves and
all of the ones in at least the last 15 years or so have been square
reserves. The misinformation about parachutes among glider pilots is
astounding. If it is this hard to get pilots to consider square
parachutes I can only imagine how hard it was to get them to fly
fiberglass sailplanes...


At 02:00 09 December 2008, Don Johnstone wrote:
At 15:52 08 December 2008, jcarlyle wrote: (snip)
I've read about
people who released their parachute straps before bailing out, simply
because they always get out of the plane that way...

-John

I think you will find that this is an aeronautical myth. I have heard
this
story as many others will have and it is often used as a reason not to
get
out of your glider on the ground without the parachute. I have never
seen
a proper account of any accident where it actually happened.

The square canopy v round canopy has been discussed on here before. As
far
as I am aware, certainly in the UK, all emergency chutes are round
canopy
for the very good reason that they open more reliable, faster opening
and
pack into a smaller container. A sport chute is a completely different
design and if sport parachutists carry a reserve it is round canopy.

Gregg Ballou wrote:
One bailout where the pilot fell out of his rig(unknown if unfastened it
during egress or never fastened it on the ground) was an acro accident in
the states early 90's in a Pitts if anyone want to look for the accident.

Rounds are not more reliable, do not open faster

That is not what I was told by the manufacturers and riggers I talked to
when I went looking for a new parachute in March. They all said a round
emergency parachute opens faster but more harshly. The "opens faster"
was definitely a factor in my choice of a round over a square.

Why do you think that's not true?

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA
* Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly

* Updated! "Transponders in Sailplanes" http://tinyurl.com/y739x4
* New Jan '08 - sections on Mode S, TPAS, ADS-B, Flarm, more

* "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation" at www.motorglider.org

Eric,

I don't know what manufacturers or resellers you've been talking too,
but anyone who says that round chutes open faster than squares, or are
more reliable, is FOS. They are trying to sell what they stock.
(Shocking, I know.)

Round chutes inherently do not want to open. That's why the military
has to put anti-inversion skirts on them. That's why they open
slower.

Square parachutes inherently *want* to be open. That's why they need
reefing systems (i.e. "sliders"). That's why skydivers use them for
reserves. (Okay, one reason.)

As for control -- 5mph under a round is wishful thinking (unless it's
an old ParaCommander). The wind is almost always much more than that.
If you're pointed into the wind, you still have to look over your
shoulder to see where you're going to land, instead of choosing where
you're going to land. (Have you ever tried to look over your shoulder
while landing your glider?)

2NO (~4500 parachute decents -- about 50 under round, been there, done
that, don't ever wanna go back)

On Dec 8, 9:38*pm, Tuno wrote:

I don't know what manufacturers or resellers you've been talking too,
but anyone who says that round chutes open faster than squares, or are
more reliable, is FOS.

There was a similar discussion on RAS probably between 5 and 10 years
ago. I remember at that time that Reeter (71) who was an experienced
jumper said he would not use a square as a glider emergency rig. I
don't remember all his arguments, and I don't have time now to search
for the thread, but I think he pointed out that smoke jumpers were
still using rounds at that time.

Anyone know what smoke jumpers are using now?

Andy

Smoke jumpers switched to squares. Technology marches on. Rounds are
still the best parachute for those little estes model rockets.

At 13:44 09 December 2008, Andy wrote:
On Dec 8, 9:38=A0pm, Tuno wrote:

I don't know what manufacturers or resellers you've been talking
too,
but anyone who says that round chutes open faster than squares, or are
more reliable, is FOS.

There was a similar discussion on RAS probably between 5 and 10 years
ago. I remember at that time that Reeter (71) who was an experienced
jumper said he would not use a square as a glider emergency rig. I
don't remember all his arguments, and I don't have time now to search
for the thread, but I think he pointed out that smoke jumpers were
still using rounds at that time.

Anyone know what smoke jumpers are using now?

Andy

On Dec 9, 9:30*am, Gregg Ballou wrote:
Smoke jumpers switched to squares. *Technology marches on. *Rounds are
still the best parachute for those little estes model rockets.


LOL, I gave up the rockets a long time ago.

Okay Gregg, I give, I goofed when I missed your last 'ground school'.
When's the next one?

-Evan Ludeman / T8

Hi Evan. Most anytime, just get me an audience. I believe Tim wants to
take the class as well. Let Rick know that I said I'd teach the class
again and all are welcome maybe some other clubs would be interested.
We're moving in Jan. So late winter/early spring perhaps. For the rest
of the world Evan is asking about this:
http://flypmsc.blogspot.com/2008/04/lookreachpull.html
Class is free, I don't sell parachutes, I've packed reserves under
supervision but I'm not a rigger. Just a public service, and I only
pick on round parachutes a little bit.
Gregg
At 15:27 09 December 2008, wrote:
On Dec 9, 9:30=A0am, Gregg Ballou wrote:
Smoke jumpers switched to squares. =A0Technology marches on. =A0Rounds
ar=
e
still the best parachute for those little estes model rockets.


LOL, I gave up the rockets a long time ago.

Okay Gregg, I give, I goofed when I missed your last 'ground school'.
When's the next one?

-Evan Ludeman / T8

Tuno wrote:
Eric,

I don't know what manufacturers or resellers you've been talking too,
but anyone who says that round chutes open faster than squares, or are
more reliable, is FOS. They are trying to sell what they stock.
(Shocking, I know.)

Are there published tests for opening times?

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA
* Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly

* Updated! "Transponders in Sailplanes" http://tinyurl.com/y739x4
* New Jan '08 - sections on Mode S, TPAS, ADS-B, Flarm, more

* "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation" at www.motorglider.org

http://books.google.com/books?id=2Po...sult#PPA235,M1
Hope the link works. Read pages 234 and 235. There is info on deployment
speed and reliability. I rest my case.
At 23:58 09 December 2008, Eric Greenwell wrote:
Tuno wrote:
Eric,

I don't know what manufacturers or resellers you've been talking
too,
but anyone who says that round chutes open faster than squares, or are
more reliable, is FOS. They are trying to sell what they stock.
(Shocking, I know.)

Are there published tests for opening times?

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA
* Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly

* Updated! "Transponders in Sailplanes" http://tinyurl.com/y739x4
* New Jan '08 - sections on Mode S, TPAS, ADS-B, Flarm, more

* "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation" at
www.motorglider.org