Questions for EDS D1a users...

I used the EDS D1a that came with my DG-600 for the first time,
yesterday. This was a 6 hour flight in the 15 to 17.9K range. Up to
this point, all of my gliders have been equipped with continuous flow
systems and Oxymizer cannulas. This EDS setup was using the standard
XCR regulator, supplied tubing, EDS cannula, and a fresh 9V battery
installed. I set (and verified several times during flight) D5, which
is supposed to be a fully automatic mode of operation. According to the
manual, it should sense the start of inhalation and send a shot of
oxygen at that point. Instead, it seemed to be sending oxygen at fixed
intervals of a few seconds, then sounding an alarm (I assume the apnea
alarm) if I didn't happen to inhale just before the next shot. To keep
the thing happy, I had to sync my breathing with its cycle, and make
sharper than normal inhalations (i.e snort). By the end of the flight,
I was feeling signs of being mildly hypoxic. Questions:

1. Is this the way an EDS is supposed to operate, operator error, or
possibly a defective unit?
2. Why do EDS buyers insist upon getting those puny carbon fiber
cylinders (I used more than half the capacity in that one flight)?
3. Does anyone really like these things?

Marc

Marc Ramsey wrote:

1. Is this the way an EDS is supposed to operate, operator error, or
possibly a defective unit?

No, maybe, maybe.

2. Why do EDS buyers insist upon getting those puny carbon fiber
cylinders (I used more than half the capacity in that one flight)?

I don't know.

3. Does anyone really like these things?

Yes, a lot.

Stefan

"Marc Ramsey" wrote in message
om...
I used the EDS D1a that came with my DG-600 for the first time, yesterday.
This was a 6 hour flight in the 15 to 17.9K range. Up to this point, all
of my gliders have been equipped with continuous flow systems and Oxymizer
cannulas. This EDS setup was using the standard XCR regulator, supplied
tubing, EDS cannula, and a fresh 9V battery installed. I set (and verified
several times during flight) D5, which is supposed to be a fully automatic
mode of operation. According to the manual, it should sense the start of
inhalation and send a shot of oxygen at that point. Instead, it seemed to
be sending oxygen at fixed intervals of a few seconds, then sounding an
alarm (I assume the apnea alarm) if I didn't happen to inhale just before
the next shot. To keep the thing happy, I had to sync my breathing with
its cycle, and make sharper than normal inhalations (i.e snort). By the
end of the flight, I was feeling signs of being mildly hypoxic. Questions:

1. Is this the way an EDS is supposed to operate, operator error, or
possibly a defective unit?
2. Why do EDS buyers insist upon getting those puny carbon fiber cylinders
(I used more than half the capacity in that one flight)?
3. Does anyone really like these things?

Marc

We just sent a couple of the older EDS A1 units back to the factory for
warranty service/recalibration. Several pilots had complained of hypoxia at
low-teen altitudes. When I tested these units on the ground, it seemed to
me that the pulse of O2 wasn't exactly synchronized with inhalation. In
fact it seemed to as much random as sychronized.

My own newer EDS D1 unit works just fine as determined by my pulse oxymeter.
I did have to learn to breathe slowly. Rapid, shallow breaths will deplete
the O2 supply much quicker than slow deep breathing. Breathing through your
mouth while wearing a cannula will get you hypoxic in a hurry.

I note with interest that Mountain High now offers a rubber mask for the EDS
systems. That might solve some problems for mouth breathers.

Bill Daniels

Mark,

This is not the way a EDS is supposed to work. Please call Mountain
High on Monday 800-468-8185 . They will fix or replace the EDS Unit.

Richard
www.craggyaero.com


Marc Ramsey wrote:
I used the EDS D1a that came with my DG-600 for the first time,
yesterday. This was a 6 hour flight in the 15 to 17.9K range. Up to
this point, all of my gliders have been equipped with continuous flow
systems and Oxymizer cannulas. This EDS setup was using the standard
XCR regulator, supplied tubing, EDS cannula, and a fresh 9V battery
installed. I set (and verified several times during flight) D5, which
is supposed to be a fully automatic mode of operation. According to the
manual, it should sense the start of inhalation and send a shot of
oxygen at that point. Instead, it seemed to be sending oxygen at fixed
intervals of a few seconds, then sounding an alarm (I assume the apnea
alarm) if I didn't happen to inhale just before the next shot. To keep
the thing happy, I had to sync my breathing with its cycle, and make
sharper than normal inhalations (i.e snort). By the end of the flight,
I was feeling signs of being mildly hypoxic. Questions:

1. Is this the way an EDS is supposed to operate, operator error, or
possibly a defective unit?
2. Why do EDS buyers insist upon getting those puny carbon fiber
cylinders (I used more than half the capacity in that one flight)?
3. Does anyone really like these things?

Marc

Thanks for the replies, I'll call Mountain High...

Marc Ramsey wrote:
1. Is this the way an EDS is supposed to operate, operator error, or
possibly a defective unit?
2. Why do EDS buyers insist upon getting those puny carbon fiber
cylinders (I used more than half the capacity in that one flight)?
3. Does anyone really like these things?

Marc

snip Why do EDS buyers insist upon getting those puny carbon fiber
cylinders (I used more than half the capacity in that one flight)?
/snip

Never seen anyone use an EDS with other than the largest bottle they
could fit in their glider. (I bought my EDS system without a bottle,
using the (large) bottles that came with the two gliders I've owned.)

A single fill of the tank lasts and lasts and lasts ...

~ted/2NO

Marc:

I'd strongly recommend that you install a bypass with a standard flow
meter so you can quickly change over if the unit fails. MH sells the
neccessary hardware to accomplish this. I change the 9 volt battery
every two months and put the old one in my alarm clock or garage door
opener. BTW, yours is the first failure report I've heard about.

The only way I know to accurately verify that ANY system is delivering
enough
O2 is to use a pulse-oximeter. They keep getting cheaper and all seem
reliable, as long as the batteries are good. Mine has an audible low
saturation alarm which is a useful feature. The only real problem with
them is that the sensor fits over a finger and. in a flapped ship,
tends to get in the way. At least one British pilot I've corresponded
with uses a BlueTooth-capable device and displays O2 saturation on his
PDA.

I fully agree that the carbon-fibre bottle is too damned small. It
helps a bit to have it filled at a facility that has a cooling tank and
is willing to take the time to let the temperature come down. I use
the MH on the night setting, which delivers O2 from the ground up and
get ~9 hours out of the small bottle as long as it's properly filled.
Used with the 10,000 foot setting it would probably last at least a
third longer. Age and conditioning also enter into the equation - I'm
an old fart and use much more O2 than you're likely to.

Ray Warshaw





Marc Ramsey wrote:
Thanks for the replies, I'll call Mountain High...

Marc Ramsey wrote:
1. Is this the way an EDS is supposed to operate, operator error, or
possibly a defective unit?
2. Why do EDS buyers insist upon getting those puny carbon fiber
cylinders (I used more than half the capacity in that one flight)?
3. Does anyone really like these things?

Marc

Hello Marc

Your EDS sounds faulty. I have just ordered another one myself - with the puny bottle. I did so as its literally half the empty weight of a corresponding aluminium tank. Every kg counts with our puny thermals here.

wrote:

............
I use
the MH on the night setting, which delivers O2 from the ground up and
get ~9 hours out of the small bottle as long as it's properly filled.

Hi Ray

What is the actual size of the "small bottle". I am considering buying
an oxygen system and would envisage using it as you do. So this would
give me a guide.

thanks

Paul

Paul

Please see my website http://www.craggyaero.com/edssystem1.htm
for bottle sizes and to purchase any EDS components. If you have any
questions please call.

Richard
www.craggyaero.com


PB wrote:
wrote:

...........
I use
the MH on the night setting, which delivers O2 from the ground up and
get ~9 hours out of the small bottle as long as it's properly filled.

Hi Ray

What is the actual size of the "small bottle". I am considering buying
an oxygen system and would envisage using it as you do. So this would
give me a guide.

thanks

Paul