Why are multiple engines different?

new_CFI wrote:
"Bob Gardner" wrote in news:Y6-dnRIj-
:

Another aspect of the question...the requirements for the basic license
require a certain amount of solo flight, and it is hard to imagine any
insurance carrier covering solo flight in a twin by a student pilot. Not
impossible, just unlikely.

Bob Gardner



Isnt there a supervised solo for situations like this? An instructor is
onbord to supervise the solo flight, but it still counts as solo? I think
the school I went to did this, ill have to look it up.

I believe that only works for balloons which require two crew members.

Greg B wrote:
"Mxsmanic" wrote in message
...
The only thing that would keep you from getting your initial certificate
in a multi would be money. (insurance and the nerve of your CFI may
factor into this also)
So someone will do it if you put the money down?

Would learning and getting a license for a multiengine aircraft also
implicitly allow one to fly single-engine aircraft?

I have heard of a few people that took their training in twins and have
never flown a single. They cannot fly a single without the rating.


I posted a few weeks back about an ATP friend of mine in that situation.
He trained in the military, only in twins, and does not have a single
engine rating (making him a really bad potential safety pilot!)

Mxsmanic wrote:
Dale writes:


Perhaps it's because if you screw the pooch on those "few procedures for
the failure of an engine" you will be dead.


But a lot of procedures can result in death if they are improperly
executed. It's not clear to me what the key distinction of multiple
engines might be that would justify a separate certificate.

That distinction has been written in blood over the decades, as have
most of the regulations in aviation... they are the result of bad outcomes.

They can do the pilot operations and get an endorsement and
solo, just no passengers.
61.31 (3) Have received training required by this part that
is appropriate to the aircraft category, class, and type
rating (if a class or type rating is required) for the
aircraft to be flown, and have received the required
endorsements from an instructor who is authorized to provide
the required endorsements for solo flight in that aircraft.



"Greg B" wrote in message
...
| "Mxsmanic" wrote in message
| ...
| The only thing that would keep you from getting your
initial certificate
| in a multi would be money. (insurance and the nerve of
your CFI may
| factor into this also)
|
| So someone will do it if you put the money down?
|
| Would learning and getting a license for a multiengine
aircraft also
| implicitly allow one to fly single-engine aircraft?
|
| I have heard of a few people that took their training in
twins and have
| never flown a single. They cannot fly a single without the
rating.
|
|

Look up Champion Lancer
http://www.bellanca-championclub.com/ scroll down middle of
page

O-200, fixed gear and props, Vyse is down at 200 fpm







"Sylvain" wrote in message
t...
| Mxsmanic wrote:
| Don't you adjust props and deal with landing gear in
single-engine
| aircraft, too? Or do I need a multiengine certification
just to have
| retractable gear??
|
| depends. Basic trainers (single engine) have fixed
landing gear,
| fixed pitch props. It makes them cheaper and simpler for
initial
| training (there is enough already to worry about before
adding
| extra goodies); to add retractable gear / variable pitch
props
| you need a 'complex' endorsement; it is not a license or
certificate
| or rating; it consists in additional training from an
instructor (see
| 14 CFR 61.31(e) for details) who then endorses the
logbook, it's a
| one time thing. There are similar endorsements required
to fly
| 'high performance' aircraft (engine with more than 200hp),
| tailwheels aircraft and for some high altitude operations.
|
| Now a multi- can be complex or not (rare but it exists),
| high performance or not (note that it is not the sum of
the
| power of the engines that count, whether or not it has
any
| engine with more than 200hp -- i.e., you could have an
| aicraft with ten 200hp engines which would still not
qualify
| as 'high performance' :-) ), tailwheel or not,
pressurised
| or not, so do single engines. It is orthogonal if you
| like.
|
| --Sylvain

61.31 (2) Be receiving training for the purpose of obtaining
an additional pilot certificate and rating that are
appropriate to that aircraft, and be under the supervision
of an authorized instructor; or



"new_CFI" wrote in message
news:N61Wg.6139$eZ4.1024@dukeread06...
| "Bob Gardner" wrote in news:Y6-dnRIj-
| :
|
| Another aspect of the question...the requirements for
the basic license
| require a certain amount of solo flight, and it is hard
to imagine any
| insurance carrier covering solo flight in a twin by a
student pilot. Not
| impossible, just unlikely.
|
| Bob Gardner
|
|
|
| Isnt there a supervised solo for situations like this? An
instructor is
| onbord to supervise the solo flight, but it still counts
as solo? I think
| the school I went to did this, ill have to look it up.

61.31 (d)(2) Be receiving training for the purpose of
obtaining an additional pilot certificate and rating that
are appropriate to that aircraft, and be under the
supervision of an authorized instructor; or


"Emily" wrote in message
news | new_CFI wrote:
| "Bob Gardner" wrote in
news:Y6-dnRIj-
| :
|
| Another aspect of the question...the requirements for
the basic license
| require a certain amount of solo flight, and it is hard
to imagine any
| insurance carrier covering solo flight in a twin by a
student pilot. Not
| impossible, just unlikely.
|
| Bob Gardner
|
|
|
| Isnt there a supervised solo for situations like this?
An instructor is
| onbord to supervise the solo flight, but it still counts
as solo? I think
| the school I went to did this, ill have to look it up.
|
| I believe that only works for balloons which require two
crew members.

Emily wrote:
Even with a multi- rating it is not easy to find a twin that you
can rent on your own.

Really? I've never had a problem.

So far, the one I am renting (a Duchess) also happens to be
the aircraft with which I did my rating, which simplifies a
lot my complying with the insurance requirements. Actually
I did the long cross country (did my initial commercial in
a multi-) with a 310 -- but this aircraft -- or anything more
ambitious than the Duchess -- is now out of my reach in terms
of number of hours required by the insurances. For some
reasons insurances seem to keep moving the bar as I am
progressing along :-)

By renting I mean flying it solo or with passengers; some
places are happy to let you fly their multi- but only with
one of their instructors (e.g., to complete a rating), a
bit like what seems to happen with floatplanes.

Where are you flying if I may ask?

--Sylvain

A light twin on FAR 135 IFR w/o an autopilot




"Sylvain" wrote in message
t...
| Mxsmanic wrote:
| What happens in aircraft that require a crew of two?
|
| The FAA in its infinite wisdom, has it covered; airplane
| that require more than one pilot tend not to be used
| as primary trainers though.
|
| Question: is there any aircraft out there that require
| more than one pilot but does not require a type
certificate?
|
| --Sylvain
|

new_CFI wrote:

Isnt there a supervised solo for situations like this? An instructor is
onbord to supervise the solo flight, but it still counts as solo? I think
the school I went to did this, ill have to look it up.

solo is defined in the regs, and that means noone else on
board (the only exceptions I can recall concerns airships);
Now, the British on the other hand have some weird logging
regulations that include a Pu/s (pilot under supervision)
different from instruction; is this what you had in mind?

--Sylvain