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Christmas Annual - long drivel



 
 
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  #11  
Old December 26th 04, 03:36 PM
Denny
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As the inititator of this thread, just thought I would update... Fat
Albert still sits lacking a carburetor on the port engine... I sent the
new, but very defective, remanufactured carb back to Kelly Aerospace on
Monday, via next day air... They promised to do the same the day they
had their carb in hand... At worst it should have arrived by noon on
Thursday... Of course it is now a week later and I have no carb... Of
course, Kelly Aerospace is not answering the phone from Thursday on...
It is now a month since the annual commenced... Steve may have to
start charging me hangar rent...

Denny

  #12  
Old December 28th 04, 12:08 AM
Denny
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Just got off the phone with Steve... The replacement carburetor from
Kelly Aerospace came late Friday, so being Christmas Eve he hung it on
the plane and went home without calling me.. Today he finished the hook
up and pushed the plane out to start it.. The bottom line is the
replacement, zero timed, CERTIFIED, carburetor leaks even worse than
the one we sent back as defective - dumped fuel all over the ground the
instant he hit the boost pump, and he aborted the start... He called
Kelly Aerospace and they told him to open the carburetor and see what
the problem is... Jeez, the original, worn out carb didn't dump fuel
on the ground and was flyable as long as you paid attention to the
EGT... The only thing I can do is laugh as the labor bill keeps going
up...

I asked Steve how long he has been wrenching on airplanes... He said
more than 40 years... I asked him if he had ever had two zero timed,
carburetors in a row be defective... He said no... I'm waiting for a
call back on what he found but it's after 6PM and I'm going home, so
thought I would post this update...
Denny

  #13  
Old December 28th 04, 02:30 AM
JDupre5762
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In my recent experience Kelly products are not holding up as well as the
original manufacturers stuff did. I don't have anything concrete to point to
but I have sent back more Kelly accessories than anything else.

John Dupre'

The replacement carburetor from
Kelly Aerospace came late Friday,


snip

The bottom line is the
replacement, zero timed, CERTIFIED, carburetor leaks even worse than
the one we sent back as defective -



  #14  
Old December 28th 04, 03:39 PM
Jim Burns
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Gees!!! When will this nitemare end! That royally SUCKS! Let us know where
exactly it is leaking from... truly weird.

We've been having ongoing problems with our autopilot, an S-Tec 60-2. First
a runaway trim so they pulled the pitch computer, sent it to S-Tec and for
$150 the told us it was A-OK. Now we pulled the pitch servo and sent it in
for diagnostics and possible new switches. We've been flying in without
pitch or altitude hold and it seems to work fine until last night when one
of the other partners said that in HDG mode it oscillates about 10 degrees
one way and then corrects back 10 degrees the other way. NAV mode works
perfect other than it tracks with the cdi needle 2 1/2 degrees left.

Good luck with the carb, I feel for you.

Jim

"Denny" wrote in message
ups.com...
Just got off the phone with Steve... The replacement carburetor from
Kelly Aerospace came late Friday, so being Christmas Eve he hung it on
the plane and went home without calling me.. Today he finished the hook
up and pushed the plane out to start it.. The bottom line is the
replacement, zero timed, CERTIFIED, carburetor leaks even worse than
the one we sent back as defective - dumped fuel all over the ground the
instant he hit the boost pump, and he aborted the start... He called
Kelly Aerospace and they told him to open the carburetor and see what
the problem is... Jeez, the original, worn out carb didn't dump fuel
on the ground and was flyable as long as you paid attention to the
EGT... The only thing I can do is laugh as the labor bill keeps going
up...

I asked Steve how long he has been wrenching on airplanes... He said
more than 40 years... I asked him if he had ever had two zero timed,
carburetors in a row be defective... He said no... I'm waiting for a
call back on what he found but it's after 6PM and I'm going home, so
thought I would post this update...
Denny



  #15  
Old December 28th 04, 11:03 PM
Denny
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Well, it's Tuesday... Steve called back and says the carb is on, the
engine has been extensively ground run, the cowl is on, and the
airplane is ready for flight testing... I'm trapped here at the office
and there is freezing rain outside and more predicted for the night...
Maybe I'll be able to test fly it tomorrow, and maybe I won't...

The bottom line is that the guy at Kelly Aerospace did not replace my
remanufactured carburetor as promised, but 'overhauled' and returned
the carburetor to me... He stated to Steve that he personally stood
there and watched the work being done (the point of this will be clear
in a minute)... Anyway, Steve disassembled the
overhauled-remanufactured carb at the direction of Kelly Aerospace and
found that the the pivot pin for the float was missing the cotter key
that keeps the pin from sliding out and jamming the float... He put in
a new cotter pin, verified that the float height is correct set, (it
was) and the bench repaired carb now works perfectly...

When Steve called Kelly Aerospace back with the news, the guy's comment
was, "That's interesting." When Steve called me I asked him if the
guy's seeing-eye dog needed glasses... Now the "interesting" part will
come when Steve and I discuss the bill... It seems to me that Kelly
Aerospace has some responsibility for the labor to remove the carb, the
shipping costs, the labor to reinstall it, the labor to remove it a
second time, the bench time to fix it, and the labor to reinstall it a
second time... Once I am presented with Steve's bill I will be calling
Kelly Aerospace to enquire as to how they see their responsibility
here...

Denny

  #16  
Old December 29th 04, 03:14 PM
Jim Burns
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I would have a product liability lawyer send Kelly your bill. Missing
cotter pin that holds the pivot pin for the float?! Float drops to the
bottom of the bowl calling for more fuel flow and spilling fuel
everywhere.... sounds like a good start to an engine fire. I wouldn't pay
them a dime, I'd tell them to sue me. Order a few more things from Kelly,
then deduct Steve's labor invoice from Kelly's statement. How can they
expect that you should pay for finishing their work and for all the problems
and costs you had to incur from it?

Glad to hear it's ready for some air time!

Jim

"Denny" wrote in message
ups.com...
Well, it's Tuesday... Steve called back and says the carb is on, the
engine has been extensively ground run, the cowl is on, and the
airplane is ready for flight testing... I'm trapped here at the office
and there is freezing rain outside and more predicted for the night...
Maybe I'll be able to test fly it tomorrow, and maybe I won't...

The bottom line is that the guy at Kelly Aerospace did not replace my
remanufactured carburetor as promised, but 'overhauled' and returned
the carburetor to me... He stated to Steve that he personally stood
there and watched the work being done (the point of this will be clear
in a minute)... Anyway, Steve disassembled the
overhauled-remanufactured carb at the direction of Kelly Aerospace and
found that the the pivot pin for the float was missing the cotter key
that keeps the pin from sliding out and jamming the float... He put in
a new cotter pin, verified that the float height is correct set, (it
was) and the bench repaired carb now works perfectly...

When Steve called Kelly Aerospace back with the news, the guy's comment
was, "That's interesting." When Steve called me I asked him if the
guy's seeing-eye dog needed glasses... Now the "interesting" part will
come when Steve and I discuss the bill... It seems to me that Kelly
Aerospace has some responsibility for the labor to remove the carb, the
shipping costs, the labor to reinstall it, the labor to remove it a
second time, the bench time to fix it, and the labor to reinstall it a
second time... Once I am presented with Steve's bill I will be calling
Kelly Aerospace to enquire as to how they see their responsibility
here...

Denny



  #17  
Old December 30th 04, 02:50 PM
Denny
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Gawd, I'm begining to feel like I'm writing episodes for a soap opera,
or something... But, here we go with the next installment...

I hurried through my work Wednesday as best I could and got the the
airport at 3 PM... Steve was all smiles, glad to finally have this
annual finished (6 weeks now)... The cowls were on and the airplane
ready to fly... So, out Doug (another guy that hangs around the shop)
and I went into the mist and haze of an indefinite ceiling... At least
we taxied to the end of the runway this time without fuel running on
the ground... Took off and climbed to a thousand feet... The starboard
engine does not run as lean as it did with the original carb that
started this whole thing going, but it is still showing significantly
higher EGT as compared to the (assumed) normal port engine at full
rich, and still over an inch of displacement between the knobs when
leaned to the same EGT, and the same when leaned further to just a
trace of roughness on each side (never blindly trust electronics)...

"Well, it's some better." - I say... The ceiling is dropping and ten
miles out we are forced down to 800 feet to stay out of the clag... We
go back and land and taxi in... Steve is out on the ramp, still all
smiles... I pull the mixture to cut off - and the engine continues to
run - and run, and run, shaking and wallowing like a wet dog - Steve
is not smiling... I goose the throttle to break the vacuum that is
pulling fuel through the carb, and it winds down... "Well, that's not
better." - I say... Back to square one!

We call Kelly Aerospace... He is just as unhappy as we are.. He tells
me to have Aircraft Spruce do a warranty exchange on his nickle, gives
me an RMA number for them so I can get another carb next day air... It
takes 40 minutes to get through to Aircraft Spruce... They flat refuse
to do a warranty exchange, stating that all warranty work has to go
directly through "Jerry" at Kelly Aerospace... Tim at Kelly, sighs,
and says he replaced "Jerry" three years ago... Never the less, the
little girl at Aircraft Spruce says she just works there and that is
what her computer screen says - no jerry, no carb... But if I give her
a credit card she can ship me a carb next day... Being that is a
thousand dollar bill that I 'know' will never get straightened out, I
decline... Tim sighs, says he has another core in house and has all
the parts needed, and he will have his guys stay late tonite
(Wednesday) to get it remanufactured and out the door Thursday so we
will get it Friday by next day air...

Now Steve sighs, and says that Friday is his wife's birthday and the
shop is closed, as well as the airport is unattended that day so no one
will be there to take a delivery, being both her birthday and New Years
Eve that night... For the first time in the decades that Steve has
been wrenching on my airplanes and for the first time in this entire
carburetor fiasco, I lost my smile...
In roughly ten seconds I explained that I was no longer a happy
camper... The cowl came off, the carb came off, and I am assured that
someone will be there to take delivery on Friday and that the airplane
will be ready before dark... We shall see...

Denny

  #18  
Old December 30th 04, 07:36 PM
Denny
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I hope you fly it the same day he finishes it. Otherwise, he isn't
likely to be too happy, either.... although I feel your pain.
************************************************** ********************

Well, no pain, though some annoyance... Yeah, Steve is unhappy... Says
he has never had a thrash like this in 40 years of wrenching on
airplanes... I can't blame him, he is sick of putting the cowls on so I
can fly it, only to have to take them off again - which is a two man
job taking a good 30 minutes each way, though they seem to be getting
faster...With any luck, the next carburetor will have all of it's parts
and will actually shut off the fuel flow when the mixture is pulled to
cut off...
I will be over there Friday afternoon to baby sit the install job and
test fly it... That's assuming that Kelly Aerospace keeps it's word and
gets it here on time, they didn't the first time around..

Denny

  #19  
Old December 30th 04, 07:58 PM
Jim Burns
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Denny,
Is there an STC for a Split Lower Cowl modification for the Apache?
Something makes me think it was an option on Geronimo conversions.
Hopefully it will be too late to implement the STC (hoping that only one
more cowl off/cowl on round trip will be required of you!) but maybe an
option to think about in the future There are a couple outfits working on
an STC for the Aztec and we may look into it this summer during our annual.
A field approval for the cowl mod would also be an option. Either way it
should pay for itself in reduced labor costs.
Good luck!
Jim

"Denny" wrote in message
ups.com...
I hope you fly it the same day he finishes it. Otherwise, he isn't
likely to be too happy, either.... although I feel your pain.
************************************************** ********************

Well, no pain, though some annoyance... Yeah, Steve is unhappy... Says
he has never had a thrash like this in 40 years of wrenching on
airplanes... I can't blame him, he is sick of putting the cowls on so I
can fly it, only to have to take them off again - which is a two man
job taking a good 30 minutes each way, though they seem to be getting
faster...With any luck, the next carburetor will have all of it's parts
and will actually shut off the fuel flow when the mixture is pulled to
cut off...
I will be over there Friday afternoon to baby sit the install job and
test fly it... That's assuming that Kelly Aerospace keeps it's word and
gets it here on time, they didn't the first time around..

Denny



  #20  
Old December 30th 04, 08:02 PM
Louis L. Perley III
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"Jim Burns" wrote in message
...
Denny,
Is there an STC for a Split Lower Cowl modification for the Apache?
Something makes me think it was an option on Geronimo conversions.
Hopefully it will be too late to implement the STC (hoping that only one
more cowl off/cowl on round trip will be required of you!) but maybe an
option to think about in the future There are a couple outfits working on
an STC for the Aztec and we may look into it this summer during our

annual.
A field approval for the cowl mod would also be an option. Either way it
should pay for itself in reduced labor costs.
Good luck!
Jim


I have this on my Aztec, makes life a lot better overall (and you no longer
need two people to remove the cowls). I don't have an STC for it, as it was
done with a field approval.

--
Louis L. Perley III
N46000 - C152
N370 - PA-23-250


 




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