Osprey tested in air, at sea, but not in vortex ring state.

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/m...cnsosprey.html
"They decided not to finish a second phase of vortex ring state testing."

-HJC

That (your subject line claim) is not what it says. You are mistaking the
questionable claim from a former OT&E guru as meaning that the aircraft was
not tested in vortex ring state conditions, which just ain't the case.

"...has proven its ability to function safely in potentially deadly rapid
descent conditions, the government's top test pilot said...Gross said they
have completed the tests necessary to document the tilt-rotor's response to
the dangerous vortex ring state condition that rotary wing aircraft
encounter when descending too quickly at low airspeed...Gross and other
members of the Osprey test team have said the tilt-rotor encounters vortex
ring state at much higher rates of descent than helicopters and recovers
better because it can move the rotors forward to quickly gain airspeed..."We
believe we have explored this enough," Gross said.

If you are going to try to summarize the gist of the article in your header,
at least get it right.

Brooks


"Henry J. Cobb" wrote in message
om...
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/m...cnsosprey.html
"They decided not to finish a second phase of vortex ring state testing."

-HJC

"Kevin Brooks" wrote in message t...
That (your subject line claim) is not what it says. You are mistaking the
questionable claim from a former OT&E guru as meaning that the aircraft was
not tested in vortex ring state conditions, which just ain't the case.

I don't see any mention that they ever actually went into full vortex
ring state.

What they need to do is send an unmanned Osprey up to say 10k feet,
put it into VRS and have it automatically recover until the software
is solid.

Then you don't have to worry about the pilot reacting in time, the
aircraft will rotate the engines forward and scoot out of trouble on
it's own.

-HJC

In article ,
(Henry J. Cobb) wrote:

I don't see any mention that they ever actually went into full vortex
ring state.

What they need to do is send an unmanned Osprey up to say 10k feet,
put it into VRS and have it automatically recover until the software
is solid.

Then you don't have to worry about the pilot reacting in time, the
aircraft will rotate the engines forward and scoot out of trouble on
it's own.

....and it will be the only rotary wing aircraft on the planet with the
capability to get out of VRS on its own...

....except for the occasional tendency to suddenly fly straight forward
and into whatver obstacles are in front of it...

Of course, you really have to drop the Osprey down fast, under very
specific conditions, to get into VRS to begin with, and the easy way to
not get into it is to not drop the thing to the ground quite as fast.

--
cirby at cfl.rr.com

Remember: Objects in rearview mirror may be hallucinations.
Slam on brakes accordingly.

"Henry J. Cobb" wrote in message
om...
"Kevin Brooks" wrote in message
t...
That (your subject line claim) is not what it says. You are mistaking
the
questionable claim from a former OT&E guru as meaning that the aircraft
was
not tested in vortex ring state conditions, which just ain't the case.

I don't see any mention that they ever actually went into full vortex
ring state.

You should reread your article, then.


What they need to do is send an unmanned Osprey up to say 10k feet,
put it into VRS and have it automatically recover until the software
is solid.

Then you don't have to worry about the pilot reacting in time, the
aircraft will rotate the engines forward and scoot out of trouble on
it's own.

Why? Other (conventional) rotary aircraft currently within operating
inventopries are susceptable to VRS and manage to handle it by knowing the
limits--why do you think the V-22 should somehow be different? Illogical.

Brooks


-HJC

"Kevin Brooks" wrote in message et...
Why? Other (conventional) rotary aircraft currently within operating
inventopries are susceptable to VRS and manage to handle it by knowing the
limits--why do you think the V-22 should somehow be different? Illogical.

http://198.65.138.161/military/syste...t/v-22-vrs.htm
"This asymmetrical VRS phenomenon, which is unique to side-by-side
rotor configurations, will have the initial resultant effect of
inducing a large rolling moment in the yaw direction."

That's what's different about it.

-HJC

In article ,
(Henry J. Cobb) wrote:

"Kevin Brooks" wrote in message
et...
Why? Other (conventional) rotary aircraft currently within operating
inventopries are susceptable to VRS and manage to handle it by knowing the
limits--why do you think the V-22 should somehow be different? Illogical.

http://198.65.138.161/military/syste...t/v-22-vrs.htm
"This asymmetrical VRS phenomenon, which is unique to side-by-side
rotor configurations, will have the initial resultant effect of
inducing a large rolling moment in the yaw direction."

That's what's different about it.

You missed a quote:

"Vortex Ring State can occur in all rotary-wing aircraft under similar
conditions of low airspeed and high sink rate."

The article also doesn't mention that front/back twin-rotor copters can
have similar issues (one in, one out of VRS).

Then there's this:

"When flown in compliance with NATOPS WARNING limits and with adequate
training, susceptibility to VRS is nil."

In other words, don't drop faster than 800 feet per minute at speeds
less than 40 knots and this won't happen to you.

--
cirby at cfl.rr.com

Remember: Objects in rearview mirror may be hallucinations.
Slam on brakes accordingly.

"Henry J. Cobb" wrote in message
om...
"Kevin Brooks" wrote in message
et...
Why? Other (conventional) rotary aircraft currently within operating
inventopries are susceptable to VRS and manage to handle it by knowing
the
limits--why do you think the V-22 should somehow be different?
Illogical.

http://198.65.138.161/military/syste...t/v-22-vrs.htm
"This asymmetrical VRS phenomenon, which is unique to side-by-side
rotor configurations, will have the initial resultant effect of
inducing a large rolling moment in the yaw direction."

That's what's different about it.

So what? The chief test pilot said that after the latest flight tests they
feel comfortable with thier procedures to handle it--that carries a heck of
a lot more water than what either you or that "former" OT&E guy have to say
about the matter.

Brooks


-HJC

On 10 Dec 2003 17:29:16 -0800, (Henry J. Cobb) wrote:

"Kevin Brooks" wrote in message et...
Why? Other (conventional) rotary aircraft currently within operating
inventopries are susceptable to VRS and manage to handle it by knowing the
limits--why do you think the V-22 should somehow be different? Illogical.

http://198.65.138.161/military/syste...t/v-22-vrs.htm
"This asymmetrical VRS phenomenon, which is unique to side-by-side
rotor configurations, will have the initial resultant effect of
inducing a large rolling moment in the yaw direction."

That's what's different about it.

-HJC

A "rolling moment in the yaw direction"????? Is it just me, or does that
make no sense at all??

Al Minyard