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#1
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Fly the aircraft
Modern gliders give very little indications of a stall (another reason
why training in old clunkers like the 2-33 is counterproductive). Add a little distraction or a higher priority task (Bee in the cockpit!) Is a bee in the cockpit enough of a distraction or a higher priority task than flying the aircraft. If you think so you should reread "Fate is the Hunter". Carl B |
#2
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On Sep 8, 7:41*pm, Carl B wrote:
Modern gliders give very little indications of a stall (another reason why training in old clunkers like the 2-33 is counterproductive). *Add a little distraction or a higher priority task (Bee in the cockpit!) Is a bee in the cockpit enough of a distraction or a higher priority task than flying the aircraft. *If you think so you should reread "Fate is the Hunter". Carl B I have a severe reaction to bee stings. I'm pretty careful about it and haven't been stung in over 30 years. I carried an "EpiPen" with me to contests or anywhere where I was traveling away from prompt medical attention. But I didn't carry it in the cockpit back then. A sting to the neck or upper torso would probably give me an hour or less to live without medical attention. I had a mad bee enter the cockpit while I was at 9K feet on task at a regional contest near Colorado Springs about 10 years ago back. It might has well been a live hand grenade in the cockpit as far as I was concerned. I was in contact with the C/S tower (10 miles east) and was close to calliing an inflight emergency with request for emergency landing with standby medical attention just before I managed to kill the bee. During that time I also considered bailing out of the aircraft to get away from the bee. Yes, I was flying the sailplane the whole time (not very coordinated though) but that bee had my full attention. After that happened one of my EpiPen is always in my car when I drive and in my aircraft when I fly. A mad bee in the cockpit is a different kind of event for those of us for whom a sting could be a fatal event. Al T |
#3
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On 9/9/11 8:12 AM, Albert Thomas wrote:
On Sep 8, 7:41 pm, Carl wrote: Modern gliders give very little indications of a stall (another reason why training in old clunkers like the 2-33 is counterproductive). Add a little distraction or a higher priority task (Bee in the cockpit!) Is a bee in the cockpit enough of a distraction or a higher priority task than flying the aircraft. If you think so you should reread "Fate is the Hunter". Carl B I have a severe reaction to bee stings. I'm pretty careful about it and haven't been stung in over 30 years. I carried an "EpiPen" with me to contests or anywhere where I was traveling away from prompt medical attention. But I didn't carry it in the cockpit back then. A sting to the neck or upper torso would probably give me an hour or less to live without medical attention. I had a mad bee enter the cockpit while I was at 9K feet on task at a regional contest near Colorado Springs about 10 years ago back. It might has well been a live hand grenade in the cockpit as far as I was concerned. I was in contact with the C/S tower (10 miles east) and was close to calliing an inflight emergency with request for emergency landing with standby medical attention just before I managed to kill the bee. During that time I also considered bailing out of the aircraft to get away from the bee. Yes, I was flying the sailplane the whole time (not very coordinated though) but that bee had my full attention. After that happened one of my EpiPen is always in my car when I drive and in my aircraft when I fly. A mad bee in the cockpit is a different kind of event for those of us for whom a sting could be a fatal event. Al T I also thought about a bee allergy when this was mentioned. Many people with severe bee allergies would succumb in less than an hour to a well placed sting. I'm severely allergic to several things but luckily not bee stings. I have ended up in the ER several times, and needed the full on treatment with epinepherin/IV saline+Bendryl+Zantac/oxygen. That epinepherin rush is something I'll never forget. The poster above probably already does all this, but just to state it here. For folks with severe allergies to stuff, I would carry more than one epipen and they are available packaged in pairs -- the effects of the initial injection can wear off and you'll end up back in anaphylaxis. Epinepherin also does not like being exposed to heat, so keep the pens cool and replace as needed, especially if the liquid get dark/cloudy. Also you should carry a antihistamine/H1 blocker ideally benadryl/diphenhydramine because its fairly quickly acting and a H2 blocking antihistamine like Zantac or Tagamet (yes the indigestion/ulcer etc. medications). Please talk to your allergist about all this, the different meds and possible side effects and what doses to take of these etc. in an emergency. BTW a good paper on emergency treatment that pretty much discusses the current treatment "gold standard" is at http://www.aafp.org/afp/2003/1001/p1325.html. Good reading for those with severe allergies and those who may have to deal with this. Not all ambulance/fire/rescue organizations carry or are trained to use epinephrin and some also won't administer a H2 blocker. So its always a good idea to carry your own and tell your crew etc. about your conditions, where medications are stored, have them practice with a training epipen etc. Darryl |
#4
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On Sep 8, 7:41*pm, Carl B wrote:
Modern gliders give very little indications of a stall (another reason why training in old clunkers like the 2-33 is counterproductive). *Add a little distraction or a higher priority task (Bee in the cockpit!) Is a bee in the cockpit enough of a distraction or a higher priority task than flying the aircraft. *If you think so you should reread "Fate is the Hunter". Carl B my first flight in the LS-7WL I had to deal with a bee in the cockpit, I did fly the airplane, and I did get it squashed against the canopy frame............what worried me most was loosing sight of it and having it get behind me or down my shirt collar. I've had stinging insects hit the window pillar of my car before and then lodge between my back and the seat................. unfortunately the impact with the car didn't kill them, I got stung but I also ground them to paste between my back and the seat..........yeah, it hurt a lot..............would not want to deal with that in the cockpit in the air. Brad |
#5
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On 9/9/2011 9:12 AM, Albert Thomas wrote:
On Sep 8, 7:41 pm, Carl wrote: Modern gliders give very little indications of a stall (another reason why training in old clunkers like the 2-33 is counterproductive). Add a little distraction or a higher priority task (Bee in the cockpit!) Is a bee in the cockpit enough of a distraction or a higher priority task than flying the aircraft. If you think so you should reread "Fate is the Hunter". Carl B I have a severe reaction to bee stings. I'm pretty careful about it and haven't been stung in over 30 years. I carried an "EpiPen" with me to contests or anywhere where I was traveling away from prompt medical attention. But I didn't carry it in the cockpit back then. A sting to the neck or upper torso would probably give me an hour or less to live without medical attention. I had a mad bee enter the cockpit while I was at 9K feet on task at a regional contest near Colorado Springs about 10 years ago back. It might has well been a live hand grenade in the cockpit as far as I was concerned. I was in contact with the C/S tower (10 miles east) and was close to calliing an inflight emergency with request for emergency landing with standby medical attention just before I managed to kill the bee. During that time I also considered bailing out of the aircraft to get away from the bee. Yes, I was flying the sailplane the whole time (not very coordinated though) but that bee had my full attention. After that happened one of my EpiPen is always in my car when I drive and in my aircraft when I fly. A mad bee in the cockpit is a different kind of event for those of us for whom a sting could be a fatal event. Al T In no way intending to minimize the serious realities associated with having a known life-threatening allergy to bee/wasp stings, a mis-spent youth included several summers catching by the wings, using index finger and thumb, 'inspecting' (just to give the activity a veneer of 'scientific justification'), then releasing bees (and the occasional yellow jackets and - toughest to catch - paper wasps) led to what may have been my very first 'scientific hypothesis,' to wit: stinging insects - even the barbless ones - generally don't want to sting you as much as you don't want to be stung. (They also don't remain angry 'too long,' bald-faced hornets having the longest group memories in my experience.) This came in useful the one time an agitated paper wasp entered my HP-14 cockpit via the nose air tube, an event first detected on takeoff roll as something yellow and brown thrummed past my right ear at about 20 knots. Mama wasp was probably assessing a potential homesite. What a great situation for testing a youthful theory! Being a cheap (rhymes with 'dastard'), I 'instantaneously' decided that ignoring mama, in the hope she would ignore me, was an acceptable decision (vs. pulling the plug). And so it proved to be. Key is simply remaining still. (Hand waving - and finger-catching, too, ha ha - definitely 'insect agitational.') I eventually encouraged/enabled mama to exit via the canopy (no side window) once I'd gained some altitude, and she had recovered from her startlement as concluded by her showing continuing interest in what lay beyond the canopy. In any event... Fly the aircraft, Bob W. |
#6
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There is a well documented, and true story where I fly of a female pilot who found a small snake in the cockpit after she took off. She remained calm, flew the tow, released and having grabbed the snake, opened the window and ejected same. I'm sure that was one confused snake on the way to the ground.
Now what city boys out there would have messed their pants and screamed like a little girl had the same thing happened to them? Walt |
#7
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On Sep 9, 10:15*am, Brad wrote:
On Sep 8, 7:41*pm, Carl B wrote: Modern gliders give very little indications of a stall (another reason why training in old clunkers like the 2-33 is counterproductive). *Add a little distraction or a higher priority task (Bee in the cockpit!) Is a bee in the cockpit enough of a distraction or a higher priority task than flying the aircraft. *If you think so you should reread "Fate is the Hunter".. Carl B my first flight in the LS-7WL I had to deal with a bee in the cockpit, I did fly the airplane, and I did get it squashed against the canopy frame............what worried me most was loosing sight of it and having it get behind me or down my shirt collar. I've had stinging insects hit the window pillar of my car before and then lodge between my back and the seat................. unfortunately the impact with the car didn't kill them, I got stung but I also ground them to paste between my back and the seat..........yeah, it hurt a lot..............would not want to deal with that in the cockpit in the air. Brad I wonder if some of the many unexplained fatal accidents can be attributed to bees/snakes/spiders/mice etc. No need to be alergic, panic may be sufficient to incapacitate... Ramy |
#8
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On 9/9/11 3:49 PM, Ramy wrote:
On Sep 9, 10:15 am, wrote: On Sep 8, 7:41 pm, Carl wrote: Modern gliders give very little indications of a stall (another reason why training in old clunkers like the 2-33 is counterproductive). Add a little distraction or a higher priority task (Bee in the cockpit!) Is a bee in the cockpit enough of a distraction or a higher priority task than flying the aircraft. If you think so you should reread "Fate is the Hunter". Carl B my first flight in the LS-7WL I had to deal with a bee in the cockpit, I did fly the airplane, and I did get it squashed against the canopy frame............what worried me most was loosing sight of it and having it get behind me or down my shirt collar. I've had stinging insects hit the window pillar of my car before and then lodge between my back and the seat................. unfortunately the impact with the car didn't kill them, I got stung but I also ground them to paste between my back and the seat..........yeah, it hurt a lot..............would not want to deal with that in the cockpit in the air. Brad I wonder if some of the many unexplained fatal accidents can be attributed to bees/snakes/spiders/mice etc. No need to be alergic, panic may be sufficient to incapacitate... Ramy Your probably thinking of the snake found in a glider undercarriage recently in Nevada (any idea what type of snake it was?). There is also the (true) story of hypoxic mice staggering out into a glider cockpit as the pilot calmly picked them up and tossed them out the vent window. Those mice, besides filling up the glider with mice crap (and maybe Hantavirus), maybe fleas, nesting material etc., tend to chew on things and may also attack those snakes.... Darryl |
#9
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On Sep 9, 4:17*pm, Darryl Ramm wrote:
On 9/9/11 3:49 PM, Ramy wrote: On Sep 9, 10:15 am, *wrote: On Sep 8, 7:41 pm, Carl *wrote: Modern gliders give very little indications of a stall (another reason why training in old clunkers like the 2-33 is counterproductive). *Add a little distraction or a higher priority task (Bee in the cockpit!) Is a bee in the cockpit enough of a distraction or a higher priority task than flying the aircraft. *If you think so you should reread "Fate is the Hunter". Carl B my first flight in the LS-7WL I had to deal with a bee in the cockpit, I did fly the airplane, and I did get it squashed against the canopy frame............what worried me most was loosing sight of it and having it get behind me or down my shirt collar. I've had stinging insects hit the window pillar of my car before and then lodge between my back and the seat................. unfortunately the impact with the car didn't kill them, I got stung but I also ground them to paste between my back and the seat..........yeah, it hurt a lot..............would not want to deal with that in the cockpit in the air. Brad I wonder if some of the many unexplained fatal accidents can be attributed to bees/snakes/spiders/mice etc. No need to be alergic, panic may be sufficient to incapacitate... Ramy Your probably thinking of the snake found in a glider undercarriage recently in Nevada (any idea what type of snake it was?). There is also the (true) story of hypoxic mice staggering out into a glider cockpit as the pilot calmly picked them up and tossed them out the vent window. Those mice, besides filling up the glider with mice crap (and maybe Hantavirus), maybe fleas, nesting material etc., tend to chew on things and may also attack those snakes.... Darryl years ago when I recovered the wings on my ASK-14 I discovered about 5 mummified baby mice strung out along the spar, it looked like they were trying to get out of the wing. the wings hung in the corner of the shop long enough for a mouse to move in and have a family, not wanting to have them destroy my wood wings I placed a few containers of mouse-b-gone inside at the root................mama mouse left for good even tho she had little ones..................I even felt kinda sad when I ripped off the fabric and discovered this.......... Brad |
#10
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On 9-9-2011 21:53, Walt Connelly wrote:
There is a well documented, and true story where I fly of a female pilot who found a small snake in the cockpit after she took off. She remained calm, flew the tow, released and having grabbed the snake, opened the window and ejected same. I'm sure that was one confused snake on the way to the ground. Now what city boys out there would have messed their pants and screamed like a little girl had the same thing happened to them? Walt Depends on the snake variety |
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