IFR GNS 430 with expired database

I have been told that it is illegal to fly IFR in an aircraft that has
an operating IFR rated GNS 430, whose database is out of date, =even= if
it is placarded INOP, placed in the OFF position, and the airplane, even
without the 430, is otherwise legal for IFR.

True?

Jose
--
Get high on gasoline: fly an airplane.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

If the database has expired you can still use the 430 for enroute
IFR provided you manually verify the fixes you use. So what you were
told was rubbish. It neither has to be placarded nor turned off and
you can even use it - but not for approaches.

Ed


On Apr 15, 8:18 pm, Jose wrote:
I have been told that it is illegal to fly IFR in an aircraft that has
an operating IFR rated GNS 430, whose database is out of date, =even= if
it is placarded INOP, placed in the OFF position, and the airplane, even
without the 430, is otherwise legal for IFR.

True?

Jose
--
Get high on gasoline: fly an airplane.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

Jose wrote:
I have been told that it is illegal to fly IFR in an aircraft that has
an operating IFR rated GNS 430, whose database is out of date, =even= if
it is placarded INOP, placed in the OFF position, and the airplane, even
without the 430, is otherwise legal for IFR.

True?

Jose


You've been told wrong. You can still fly ILS, LOC and VOR approaches
without regard to the status of the GPS database. You can even use the
out of date database for situational awareness. You just cant file /G,
since you are not capable of legally accepting or executing an IFR GPS
approach, assuming that the out of date box is the sole source of IFR
GPS certification.


Dave

"Dave S" wrote in message
k.net...
Jose wrote:
I have been told that it is illegal to fly IFR in an aircraft that has an
operating IFR rated GNS 430, whose database is out of date, =even= if it
is placarded INOP, placed in the OFF position, and the airplane, even
without the 430, is otherwise legal for IFR.

True?

Jose


You've been told wrong. You can still fly ILS, LOC and VOR approaches
without regard to the status of the GPS database. You can even use the out
of date database for situational awareness. You just cant file /G, since
you are not capable of legally accepting or executing an IFR GPS approach,
assuming that the out of date box is the sole source of IFR GPS
certification.


Dave

That's how I understand it, and how it is explained by Jeppesen. You
can't file /G with an expired database.

Al G

\

That's how I understand it, and how it is explained by Jeppesen. You
can't file /G with an expired database.

Jepp has no say in the matter.

"Ron Natalie" wrote in message
m...
\

That's how I understand it, and how it is explained by Jeppesen. You
can't file /G with an expired database.

Jepp has no say in the matter.


I didn't say that it was their decision, merely their explanation.

The Pilot in command is the final authority, and bears final
responsibility. It is
one of the few things our government got right.

Al G

Al G wrote:



Jepp has no say in the matter.



I didn't say that it was their decision, merely their explanation.

The Pilot in command is the final authority, and bears final
responsibility.


Well, no. The manufacturer of the GPS will tell you what, if any,
operations you can use your GPS for with an expired database.

"Dave S" wrote in message
k.net...

You've been told wrong. You can still fly ILS, LOC and VOR approaches
without regard to the status of the GPS database. You can even use the out
of date database for situational awareness. You just cant file /G, since
you are not capable of legally accepting or executing an IFR GPS approach,
assuming that the out of date box is the sole source of IFR GPS
certification.


Dave

It seems that you just said that you can't legally use the GPS with an
expired database. Using the unit to receive a ground-based navaid such as an
ILS, LOC or VOR doesn't really depend on the database at all - other than
grabbing the frequency to tune.

/G does not just mean that you are capable of flying GPS approaches. "/G -
Global Navigation Satellite System (GNSS), including GPS or Wide Area
Augmentation System (WAAS), with en route and terminal capability."

If I had an expired database, I don't think I would file /G. But, I would
accept a direct clearance. If I can find an airport that hasn't moved in 50
years or a FAF, ATC doesn't care how I do it. Of course, if I screw it up,
I'll have some 'splainin to do.
-------------------------------
Travis
Lake N3094P
PWK

Travis Marlatte wrote:


If I had an expired database, I don't think I would file /G.



No reason not to, it's perfectly legal.




But, I would
accept a direct clearance.


Irrelevant.



If I can find an airport that hasn't moved in 50
years


Or even the last few days since the database was current.



or a FAF, ATC doesn't care how I do it. Of course, if I screw it up,
I'll have some 'splainin to do.

You would anyways.

On 4/15/2007 11:18:31 PM, Jose wrote:

I have been told that it is illegal to fly IFR in an aircraft that has
an operating IFR rated GNS 430, whose database is out of date, =even= if
it is placarded INOP, placed in the OFF position, and the airplane, even
without the 430, is otherwise legal for IFR.

Check the GPS's supplement in the back of the POH. From what I remember (it
has been a couple years since I read my 430 supplement) there is a sentence
or two about expired databases.

--
Peter