Talk me out of this...

"Jim Weir" wrote in message ...

In a 152 you have to burn 100(LL) at $2.50 a gallon for a total cost of $7500.

I believe both the EAA and Petersen have the STC for the 152/O-235. I believe
Petersen requires 91 Octane in this application.

You seem to have tunnel vision on this particular bird. That's normal
considering you did your training there. We believe that the people that
trained us and gave us our start will look out for us. Don't count on it.

The voice of experience in the group says buy a faster four seater, but how
do you explain all the homebuilts that are 80% two seaters, being the
fastest growing segment of GA? Statistics show that most flying is done
solo. Yes, solo. Ask the four seat owners how often they have people in the
back. Extra cargo is nice, but how much more are you willing to pay for it?
For once or twice a year, you could rent something bigger. There are a lot
of us that have no intention of getting an instrument rating or commercial
ticket, and couldn't give a rat's ass about an IFR stack. We just want to
fly on the cheap while looking out the windows, and sometimes a two seat
trainer fits that mission.

If we compare a 152 to a 150, the 152 has a better engine (Lycoming) and
slightly better performance. However, the 150 has cheaper parts cost and a
lower purchase price giving a lower TCO. I find 152's overpriced at the
best of times and usually in worse shape than the 150's. Advantage, 150.

Other under-valued planes to look at would be the Grumman AA1, Beech
Musketeer (parts are expensive but rarely needed), Piper Tri-Pacer or Colt
(fabric so hangar recommended), Cherokee (even a two seater), or even a low
time Tomahawk (bad rep by people who've never flown them). Good examples of
all of these can be found for under 25K.

My advise would be to sit back, let this one go, leave the nest (FBO), and
check the classifieds. Not just the web based ones either. A lot of
aviation is still run by old timers that have no interest in computers at
all, so you'd be missing a large portion of possible deals. So when you go
for that next $100 hamburger, ask around about what's for sale.

4-seat, 150 hp Warrior which we dearly loved, but my kids rapidly
outgrew
its useful load. It was also a high-hour trainer, and we ended up
fixing
virtually everything on that plane, from stem to stern, at great
expense.

but what a learning experience. You were in a much better position
to buy that 235! you knew what to look for, and you knew you really
wanted to own an airplane.

True. I suppose, if it had gone the other way, and I had decided that I
HATED owning my own plane (or couldn't afford it), it would have been good
to just quit after the Warrior and move on...

So, there are always two sides to every coin.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"
"Bob Noel" wrote in message
...
In article sprVb.252862$na.415521@attbi_s04, "Jay Honeck"
wrote:

Paul, buying a run-out, warhorse, 2-seat trainer doesn't sound like
something anyone here can recommend.

I went through a similar experience back in '98, only less so. I bought
a

--
Bob Noel

it's a gas... really.. on turbulent days you have to pull the power way back
to keep the cruise speed out of the yellow..

but on hot days 90F and up.. you appreciate the available power to get up
and out and high..

BT

"Paul Folbrecht" wrote in message
hlink.net...
Really? 150 hp in a 152- that must be a fun airplane!

BTIZ wrote:

I am no expert but i belive the 0-235 in a 152 is a 2,400 TBO



you could be right... it's been so long since I've flown a straight
152...

most around here have been upgraded to 150HP conversions..

BT

To all of you who were touting this feller into a four-place...

Three or four gallons an hour more..
Annuals on four seats instead of two...
Two more jugs to get parts for at overhaul...
Tires wear out faster landing at 2300# than at 1650#..
Prop is about $2k more...
Nowhere NEAR as cozy as a two-seater...
And folks at Oshkosh say, "You came across country in THAT???"

(P.S. If you find a REALLY OLD 150 you get to park in classic parking at
Oshkosh...Margie, what's this year's cutoff date of manufacture?

Jim



Jim Weir (A&P/IA, CFI, & other good alphabet soup)
VP Eng RST Pres. Cyberchapter EAA Tech. Counselor
http://www.rst-engr.com

So that $15.2K is for a remanufactured engine or to remanufacture _your_
engine?? Cause I thought doing the latter (tearing it down and
replacing most of the parts) was the 'usual' method, and I thought (had
been told) that around $10K for everything for a 235 was about right.
(No, not told by the FBO that's selling the plane.)

Factoryengines.com lists O-235s for 15.2k, 17.9k, and 22.5k (overhaul,
remanufactured, and new respectively). Plus, you will have install
costs and have accessories to overhaul or replace. You could hit $20k
easily for an installed overhauled engine.

-Nathan

Wow, Chris, we could've ended up there together. :-) MTW is where we
went for lunch yesterday. And, as for the weather, I can't say you were
being overly cautious, cause it was indeed MVFR at times. Well,
ATW-MTW turned out to be not bad (around 6 miles in haze most of the
way, cig about 2500agl), but back to MKE I hit several bad spots. I had
to go to 1500agl over OSH and considered landing right there for a
moment, but it got better shortly thereafter. (This was about 4PM.)

Do run up there sometime and visit Joe's, across from the airport. Well
worth it.

~Paul

Chris Hoffmann wrote:

This was sort of a "refresher" - I did both duals back in October, so we're
just catching up a bit before I take the phase check. Planned out a flight
to Manitowoc, but we didn't go much past West Bend. With the low ceilings
and winds, I was just fine with that.
Heh, SVFR practice? Not quite...

I bet most here were well aware of that, but I think I just learned
something important. Why the hell isn't that pointed out in the PPL
study materials? The implication from what I'd read is definitely that
you can only PERFORM "basic maintenance" as a PP.

Jim Weir wrote:

About To Be New Plane Owner:

HEAR THIS. HEAR THIS if I have to repeat it ten thousand times. You can
legally DO ANYTHING yourself. **ANYTHING**. You just can't sign it off. If
you can find a mechanic willing to oversee your work, you can do ANYTHING.

Got it?

Jim

Ah. Talked to a gent about your age who had just bought a 150 for he &
the wife. First name was Bob and if the last wasn't Barker it was
something close to that.

Robert A. Barker wrote:

"Paul Folbrecht" wrote in message
hlink.net...

Bob.. did I by any chance chat w/you at the EAA museum a couple months

ago??


Nope I wasn't there.

Bob

But I can't seem to get autogas at most airports.

Jim Weir wrote:

If fuel economy is your goal, then let me do some math for you.

Let's presume you want to put, oh, say 500 hours on this rascal before you trade
up. Let's also presume you go at 6 gallons/hour. This means that in 500 hours
you will burn about 3000 gallons of fuel.

In a 150, you can burn autogas at $1.50 a gallon for a total cost of $4500.

In a 152 you have to burn 100(LL) at $2.50 a gallon for a total cost of $7500.

Factor the extra $3 grand into your equation.

Jim


Paul Folbrecht
shared these priceless pearls of wisdom:

I had actually been drawn to
-150s/152s because of the fuel economy

Jim Weir (A&P/IA, CFI, & other good alphabet soup)
VP Eng RST Pres. Cyberchapter EAA Tech. Counselor
http://www.rst-engr.com