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#21
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Ed Rasimus wrote in message . ..
"Kilroy" wrote: "Ed Rasimus" wrote in message Didn't take long to lower the level of discourse. Are eee esss pee eee cee tee--just a little bit.... It is a two way street, buddy. He needs a Valium. Let's start out by acknowledging that WW II was a long time ago and fortunately for most of us we haven't again seen a conflict of that magnitude. That result may be partly attributable to the sacrifices made by that generation. It's difficult to comprehend the involvement of all aspects of society and the impact on folks who were involved. We can be grateful that Art participates in the group, that he shares his memories of his experiences and that he freely expresses his opinions. I don't agree with everything he says and will confess that occasionally I express that disagreement. But, I do it with an explanation of my position and a respect for his. Respect is definitely a two-way street and demonstrating respect isn't just for the other guy, it reflects favorably on the respecter. This ****ing contests regarding whose is bigger don't do much but waste bandwidth. And, in short order we have a collection of anonymous twits sharing their ignorance. Frankly that doesn't appeal to me. Ed, most of the "anonymous twits" are none too anonymous, and I have yet to read of where any of Art's recent detractors have expressed anything but the utmost respect for *all* of those who served during WWII, or for that matter at any other time. The only disrespect I have readily observed is that on the part of Art himself, who continues to denigrate the service of not only the millions of his fellow service members from WWII who performed their duties, no matter how seemingly trivial, with honor equal to (or exceeding) his own, but also that of the countless other allied forces who were fighting long before we even entered the war, not to mention his numerous attacks on those who served during other periods. That Art has already taken your more equitable comments as some kind of personal endorsement on your part of his comments in these regards is evident from his response to this same message; I'd hope that was not your intent. Brooks Ed Rasimus Fighter Pilot (ret) ***"When Thunder Rolled: *** An F-105 Pilot Over N. Vietnam" *** from Smithsonian Books ISBN: 1588341038 |
#23
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#24
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Subject: If you are looking for a fight...
From: "Billy Beck Date: 7/8/03 8:22 AM Pacific Daylight Time Message-id: (ArtKramr) wrote: I draw the line when someone who was never in the military, has no combat expxerence, no hours on the air tells me what war was :"really like". Can I see a citation for that, Art? Who's doing that? Billy If you don't know you haven't been paying attention. And your attempt to have me name the obvious names is nothing more than a weak attempt on your part to rekindle the same flame wars again. You have failed again .. Arthur Kramer Visit my WW II B-26 website at: http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer |
#25
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"ArtKramr" wrote in message ... If you don't know you haven't been paying attention. And your attempt to have me name the obvious names is nothing more than a weak attempt on your part to rekindle the same flame wars again. You have failed again I have been paying attention. Nobody's been doing that, there are no obvious names. It's all in your head. |
#26
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BUFDRVR wrote: snip Art, you really need to step out of the 1940's and into the 1960's (at least). Every guy I know that has missed out on operations has done everything in their power to get into the fight. Combat operations today is not World War Two, 1943. Not every B-52 crew was deployed for operations in Iraq, in fact some were deployed to keep an eye on North Korea (no combat ensued there so their service is not noteworthy or honorable by your standard). Not ever F-16CG unit was deployed and the list goes on. Its all timing, luck and some skill to get deployed for real world ops now a days. If it only took a request, you couldn't meet a B-52 crewmember today with out combat time. "They also serve, who only stand and wait." The important thing is not who served in combat. What is important the willingness to serve in combat. As long as there is conflict, we will need people willing to fight. David |
#27
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Subject: If you are looking for a fight...
From: David Lentz "They also serve, who only stand and wait." I don't think the company clerk equals a squadron commander. I don't think that a mess hall orderly equals a Navigator. I don't think the corporal of the guard equals a wing commander. I don't think that the morale, VD and entertainment officer equals a bombardier. Are they all important? Sure. But some are easily and instantly replaceable others are not. And some go out knowng they may never come back, and others are comfortable on the surety of the safety they enjoy. Your mileage may vary. Arthur Kramer Visit my WW II B-26 website at: http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer |
#28
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wrote in message ... On 8 Jul 2003 10:42:21 -0700, (buf3) wrote: Back in the middle to late 60s there was a document you cold sign and have enclosed in your personnel records that indicated that you were a volunteer for a Viet Nam assignment. For enlisted it was the basic dream sheet in 1966 and 1968 when I filled them out. Orders would show volunteer or not. The dream sheet still exists. At least it did in '97, when I got out. But it only kicks in when you are eligible for an assignment. If you're in the states, after the prescribed minimum time on station. Which may be 2 or 3 years, whatever the current thought processes are. Overseas, about 6-7 months before your current tour is up. 1, 2, 3, 4 years, whatever you agreed to when you went over there. Trying to get a running overseas assignment curtailed takes an act of god. Out of 8 different bases, only once did I not get one of my 1st 3 choices. Pete |
#29
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"ArtKramr" wrote I don't think the company clerk equals a squadron commander. I don't think that a mess hall orderly equals a Navigator. I don't think the corporal of the guard equals a wing commander. I don't think that the morale, VD and entertainment officer equals a bombardier. Are they all important? Sure. But some are easily and instantly replaceable others are not. And some go out knowng they may never come back, and others are comfortable on the surety of the safety they enjoy. Your mileage may vary. In today's tactics of random S-S missiles, grenades, ambushes of rear echelon troops, dormitory bombings, suicide bombers in Zodiac boats, erzatz pregnant women filled with explosives, embassy bombings, RPG's launched from civilian cars....there is no more "surety of safety" for anyone in the military. Pete |
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