The Apology

This thread absolutely boggles my mind. Many on here use a response that sounds a lot like "I have a black friend". As men, we have to accept the fact that until we walk a mile in the shoes of someone who has "Been there, done that" we will NEVER "get it". So, when someone finds something like that advertisement offensive, what we do is look at it from the best angle we can, try to understand, and accept that maybe it is. There is a reason that you can no longer find Br'er Rabbit, Tom and Jerry, or Dukes of Hazard on TV. My generation may have loved them as kids, however, looking back in hindsight, they are incredibly offensive and have no place in society any more. Just like this advertisement.

I can remember being at a national contest, and someone walking up to some very good friends of mine and asking "Do you ladies work"? I turned around and walked away because I knew this person was about to get destroyed by two extreemly accomplished women who had achieved more in their lives than anyone standing there at that moment. I wish I would have heard the rest of the conversation, but these ladies didn't need me to stand up for them.


Gregg, based on your comments, I can tell you that you, sir, are welcome to leave our community. I don't care how much you have done for it, this thread just set you back 60 years in time and showed you do not have the capability to learn. As a pilot, always being willing to learn something is paramont to safety, no matter what your experience. You have not shown this. Additionally, I will do everything in my power to make sure that you are never welcome at any contest I host, any club or flying location that I fly at, or a part of any orginization that I am also a member of. I may not be able to stop any of this, but I'll sure give it my best attempt to try. Your lack of capability to learn and general attitude cause the label of "Crappy pilot" let alone the comments about "Corperate whore" and "Feminazi" which just lable you as generally ignorant. I can only take solace in the fact that I am young enough I will probobly outlive you, and you will take your miserable attitude to the grave with you where it belongs.

That is a lot of words Mike, now try again and explain what is chauvinistic about the ad in Soaring magazine. Anyone? Not my responses, the original ad, what was chauvinistic about the original Soaring ad that set these women off? Spell it out. Since the ad was outrageous enough to generate multiple complaints it should be easy to explain. Even if I am unable to get it you may enlighten some other RAS readers and win new allies.


From the link that someone posted very early in this thread, which contained one of the letters to Soaring: "that ad brought back memories of days when women were supposed to be worshipping pilots instead of being pilots."

That's one thing that's chauvinistic about it. I'll go out on a limb and admit that I read right by the ad the first time. It wasn't nearly as outrageous as some things I've seen. I missed it, as did many others, including some women.

But I understand why it resonated the wrong way with other women. As Dale said, it was tone deaf. So I think the SSA was right in acknowledging the mistake and promising to do better. End of story until Bob launched this thread with his tirade about Feminazis undermining everything the SSA stands for.

Greg, there was a full page in Soaring explaining the issue along with an apology. There have been several on here offering an explanation to those who asked. If you don't get it yet... I'm now positive you won't just because others say it again and again. I'd say that's fine if you don't see something deeper in an ad. Everyone has a different experience and world-view, so in that case I'd expect someone mature would move on and say, "I don't get it but whatever, lets go fly gliders".

The bigger problem is that yourself and others who didn't read anything into an advertisement, do think that its ok to call women "childless whores", "Feminazis"and that they "would be more attractive if they kept their mouth shut". So right now, the problem isn't Soaring magazine that offered an explanation and apology. It's you.

Exactly, Mike. Well said. Also, Chip, thanks so much for your great perspective. A true gentleman. Donation to WSPA, who helped my mom as well as many of my friends with getting involved in soaring forthcoming from me as well.

-Mitch Hudson

If you want to see more of the old pictures and read stories which start: “There I was, thought I was going to die.� I recommend the book: Naomi the Aviatrix. https://www.amazon.com/Naomi-Aviatri.../dp/1453883851

Her diary covers parachuting in Sir Alan Cobham's Air Circus, soaring prewar England and Germany, and ferrying warbirds around barrage balloons with no radio in English weather.

Sexism is not mentioned much in her diary of 1935 to 1945. However when put in contrast to the feminist she became in the 1950's and on, it speaks volumes to the fact sexism became harder to endure.

Naomi and Rosy the Riveter found themselves out of work because of sentiments suggested in the advertisements of the time. The 1950's represents an enormous setback for women.

In later life Naomi felt equal pay the most important cause. Imagine going to work and accepting your co-worker makes more money because of his or her genitalia.

However, during the war, when she became the first woman on the planet to receive equal pay, she thought other's were more important.

Monday, 24 May 1943. Saw in the papers that as from the 1st of next month women pilots are to get the same pay as the men. Hurray! Sent Mum and Kitty 5 pounds each on the strength of it, but postdated as I won’t have the money till June 1st. Naturally I am pleased to be getting more pay, but I would be still more pleased if instead of paying us more, they were to bring single men down to our level and give the balance to married men with families according to the number of their children.

It is still legal to pay women less. I tried, but HR is run by women. My life was hell for years after that.

Amazon has the book at only five bucks. They screwed me again. All proceeds go to a bald old man with nothing to show for his life except milk crates full of soaring magazines.

On Monday, October 26, 2020 at 1:32:12 PM UTC-4, xcnick wrote:
If you want to see more of the old pictures and read stories which start: “There I was, thought I was going to die.� I recommend the book: Naomi the Aviatrix. https://www.amazon.com/Naomi-Aviatri.../dp/1453883851

Her diary covers parachuting in Sir Alan Cobham's Air Circus, soaring prewar England and Germany, and ferrying warbirds around barrage balloons with no radio in English weather.

Sexism is not mentioned much in her diary of 1935 to 1945. However when put in contrast to the feminist she became in the 1950's and on, it speaks volumes to the fact sexism became harder to endure.

Naomi and Rosy the Riveter found themselves out of work because of sentiments suggested in the advertisements of the time. The 1950's represents an enormous setback for women.

In later life Naomi felt equal pay the most important cause. Imagine going to work and accepting your co-worker makes more money because of his or her genitalia.

However, during the war, when she became the first woman on the planet to receive equal pay, she thought other's were more important.

Monday, 24 May 1943. Saw in the papers that as from the 1st of next month women pilots are to get the same pay as the men. Hurray! Sent Mum and Kitty 5 pounds each on the strength of it, but postdated as I won’t have the money till June 1st. Naturally I am pleased to be getting more pay, but I would be still more pleased if instead of paying us more, they were to bring single men down to our level and give the balance to married men with families according to the number of their children.

It is still legal to pay women less. I tried, but HR is run by women. My life was hell for years after that.

Amazon has the book at only five bucks. They screwed me again. All proceeds go to a bald old man with nothing to show for his life except milk crates full of soaring magazines.
Exactly I pointed out earlier in this thread that women have been flying since the beginning. Pioneering balloon flying and parachute jumps(from balloons and later airplanes) were made by women there is female aviation history going back hundreds of years. So if the complaint is that a circa 1950's ad "... brought back memories of days when women were supposed to be worshipping pilots instead of being pilots." That is patently false, plenty of female flyers since the beginning of flying, and no their history isn't a secret, the outrage is wrong and ridiculous.

Exactly I pointed out earlier in this thread that women have been flying since the beginning. Pioneering balloon flying and parachute jumps(from balloons and later airplanes) were made by women there is female aviation history going back hundreds of years. So if the complaint is that a circa 1950's ad "... brought back memories of days when women were supposed to be worshipping pilots instead of being pilots." That is patently false, plenty of female flyers since the beginning of flying, and no their history isn't a secret, the outrage is wrong and ridiculous.

Did you point that out before or after you referred to professional women as childless corporate whores and said that the woman in the ad would be more attractive with their mouth shut?

Just wanted to make sure you get credit for pointing out that stuff too, Gregg.

It is not my position to decide how someone else feels.

I too am married to a female glider pilot. Leah is also a "Childless Corporate Whore" and WSPA member (former board member). She benefitted immensely in her early flying career by attending a seminar at Air Saililng. I didn't ask her how she felt about the ad. Her feelings about the ad do not change the fact that many people who wrote in to Soaring did not appreciate it. I thought SSA & SSF did a very good job of addressing the problem. I hope that the letter writers feel the same way.

I hope that WSPA is selling "Childless Corporate Whore" T-shirts soon. That's gold.

RAS holds a special place in my heart as it was my primary outlet for soaring reporting and information during my early days as a glider pilot. Many long time contributors probably are happy that I've moved on LOL. Every now and then there's a nasty thread like this that makes me sad. Remember folks.. If you can't say something nice don't say anything at all. It's not that hard. Be Nice.

Sign the petition. http://chng.it/2qk7Cwq64Y

Yours truly,
Cumungus

On Monday, October 26, 2020 at 5:22:40 PM UTC-4, Cumungus wrote:
Sign the petition. http://chng.it/2qk7Cwq64Y

Yours truly,
Cumungus
Comungus, I was in court all morning taking care of business, when all was said and done the local glider club will benefit from my directed donation of all funds collected. Let me ask you, what have you done.