the trend is............

On Oct 19, 2:17*pm, Robert Danewid
wrote:
Since two years I own an ASW 28-18E and since May I have a share in an
ASH 26E.

My experience is that I get more pure gliding hours today than I did 2
years ago when I was flying my good old H304 (which I flew for 20 years).

If you can afford it, SSG/SLG will certainly give you more pure gliding
hours than a pure glider.

"Cheating"? Certainly, but it comes with age I think. When I was 20 I
could not belive that 30 years later I will be flying a glider with a
noisy engine on my back and that - most terrible of all - there will *be
a slight smell of gasoline in the cockpit. At that time it was quite
common to make 2 outlandings on teh same day.

SSG/SLG is a good thing for those of us that wants to glide more because
now we can afford it.

Certainly pure gliders is certainly not on the brink of extinction! But
for some of us fortunate guys who can afford it, today we have SSG and
SLG to make life easier.

Robert
ASW28-18E *RD
ASH 26E JA
(and former owner of a Jantar Std, ASW 19B and a beautiful Glasflügel 304)

Dan Silent skrev:



the trend is............MOTORGLIDERS

out of 100 ASG29 delivered 60 are motorgliders
90 pct of DG built are motorgliders
HPH Ltd will sell jets gliders to every lawyer and dentist!
Schempp-Hirth is doing nothing.....
Rolladen-Schneider out of business!
Lots of Sinuses, Tauruses, Apises all motorgliders.......
nothing else relevant worldwide!!!

ARE PURE GLIDERS ON THE BRINK OF EXTINCTION?

Daniel Scopel
Silent 2 Targa
C-GODY serial 2027
Volez souvent et soyez prudent.
http://pages. videotron. com/dscopel/- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

If I travel to the nearest gliderport it is 2+ hours in each direction
if I launch out of the local airport with my motor glider it is a 15
minute trip. If I am flying cross country with no crew (norm for me)
I can afford to go farther with a greater chance of getting home. A
motor glider is a wonderful thing if you can afford it. Still my hat
is off to the pure glider pilots who make great flights using only
mother nature.

On Oct 19, 2:17*pm, Robert Danewid
wrote:
Since two years I own an ASW 28-18E and since May I have a share in an
ASH 26E.

My experience is that I get more pure gliding hours today than I did 2
years ago when I was flying my good old H304 (which I flew for 20 years).

If you can afford it, SSG/SLG will certainly give you more pure gliding
hours than a pure glider.

"Cheating"? Certainly, but it comes with age I think. When I was 20 I
could not belive that 30 years later I will be flying a glider with a
noisy engine on my back and that - most terrible of all - there will *be
a slight smell of gasoline in the cockpit. At that time it was quite
common to make 2 outlandings on teh same day.

SSG/SLG is a good thing for those of us that wants to glide more because
now we can afford it.

Certainly pure gliders is certainly not on the brink of extinction! But
for some of us fortunate guys who can afford it, today we have SSG and
SLG to make life easier.

Robert
ASW28-18E *RD
ASH 26E JA
(and former owner of a Jantar Std, ASW 19B and a beautiful Glasflügel 304)

Dan Silent skrev:



the trend is............MOTORGLIDERS

out of 100 ASG29 delivered 60 are motorgliders
90 pct of DG built are motorgliders
HPH Ltd will sell jets gliders to every lawyer and dentist!
Schempp-Hirth is doing nothing.....
Rolladen-Schneider out of business!
Lots of Sinuses, Tauruses, Apises all motorgliders.......
nothing else relevant worldwide!!!

ARE PURE GLIDERS ON THE BRINK OF EXTINCTION?

Daniel Scopel
Silent 2 Targa
C-GODY serial 2027
Volez souvent et soyez prudent.
http://pages. videotron. com/dscopel/- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Fortunately I can't afford a new glider of any kind, so I'm spared the
anguish of searching for a new 'pure' glider. I'll have to continue
enduring the 100+ hours a year I soar with my 30 year old Speed
Astir. Damn the luck.

"Robert Danewid" wrote in message
...

"Cheating"? Certainly, but it comes with age I think. When I was 20 I
could not belive that 30 years later I will be flying a glider with a
noisy engine on my back and that - most terrible of all - there will be a
slight smell of gasoline in the cockpit. At that time it was quite common
to make 2 outlandings on teh same day.


Robert
ASW28-18E RD
ASH 26E JA
(and former owner of a Jantar Std, ASW 19B and a beautiful Glasflügel 304)




Cheating?

After careful observation, I've determined that all 100% of successful
raptors are of the self-launch variety. Many of them will also revert to
motoring home in a pinch.

What could be more natural than a SLG? "Pure" gliders are disabled.

bumper
ASH26E
Quiet Vent and MKII "high tech" yaw string"

Bumper says "Pure" gliders are disabled."

I would concur, but the disability has little to do with the motor and
much to do with the pilot(s) of said machines

Martin Gregorie wrote:
On Sun, 19 Oct 2008 08:18:10 -0700, Brad wrote:

As a bottom feeder in the economic food chain, when all gliders that are
flying are motorgliders, I'll be looking at all the pictures I took when
I used to be able to fly a non-powered sailplane. Since it will be
somewhat impossible for me to ever afford a powered sailplane.

No complaints, just an honest asessment.

Move near to a winching site and you'll have the last laugh as fuel
prices go sky high.

Doesn't a winch launch use more fuel than a self-launch? And won't the
fuel he uses to commute to work eat into any savings from winch launching?

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA
* Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly

* Updated! "Transponders in Sailplanes" http://tinyurl.com/y739x4
* New Jan '08 - sections on Mode S, TPAS, ADS-B, Flarm, more

* "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation" at www.motorglider.org

Doesn't a winch launch use more fuel than a self-launch? And won't the
fuel he uses to commute to work eat into any savings from winch launching?

--


Eric

We average 1/2 liter of fuel per winch launch. This has been the
average over the last 10 years. We launch from a 1000 meter field and
get 350-400 meter launches.
We launch everything from K8's to Nimbus 3DT's. The consumption goes
up if you are only launching double seaters but overall 1/2 liter per
launch is the average.

Bob

wrote:
Doesn't a winch launch use more fuel than a self-launch? And won't the
fuel he uses to commute to work eat into any savings from winch launching?

--

We average 1/2 liter of fuel per winch launch. This has been the
average over the last 10 years. We launch from a 1000 meter field and
get 350-400 meter launches.
We launch everything from K8's to Nimbus 3DT's. The consumption goes
up if you are only launching double seaters but overall 1/2 liter per
launch is the average.

That's really good! My ASH 26 E uses a little more than that for the
same launch height, but not much more. It does save me about 10 gallons
of auto fuel when I fly, because I can fly from the local airport
instead of driving to the nearest gliderport.


--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA
* Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly

* Updated! "Transponders in Sailplanes" http://tinyurl.com/y739x4
* New Jan '08 - sections on Mode S, TPAS, ADS-B, Flarm, more

* "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation" at www.motorglider.org

"Eric Greenwell" wrote in message
...
wrote:
Doesn't a winch launch use more fuel than a self-launch? And won't the
fuel he uses to commute to work eat into any savings from winch
launching?

--

We average 1/2 liter of fuel per winch launch. This has been the
average over the last 10 years. We launch from a 1000 meter field and
get 350-400 meter launches.
We launch everything from K8's to Nimbus 3DT's. The consumption goes
up if you are only launching double seaters but overall 1/2 liter per
launch is the average.

That's really good! My ASH 26 E uses a little more than that for the same
launch height, but not much more. It does save me about 10 gallons of auto
fuel when I fly, because I can fly from the local airport instead of
driving to the nearest gliderport.


Your self launcher is limited to just launching you. A winch can launch
anybody with a CG hook. It looks likely that competitively priced electric
winches will be possible which use only around 1 KWH per launch. That's
less than 10 cents most places.

If the new EPA lead polution rules eliminate 100LL, local airports may open
up for winch launch since a large fraction of the piston fleet will be
grounded or forced to use prohibitively expensive fuel. Most non-jet
airports are seeing a significant drop in flight operations.

I can see both self launchers and winch launch increasing at the expense of
aero tow operations.

On Oct 21, 4:46*pm, Eric Greenwell wrote:
wrote:
Doesn't a winch launch use more fuel than a self-launch? And won't the
fuel he uses to commute to work eat into any savings from winch launching?

--

We average 1/2 liter of fuel per winch launch. This has been the
average over the last 10 years. We launch from a 1000 meter field and
get 350-400 meter launches.
We launch everything from K8's to Nimbus 3DT's. The consumption goes
up if you are only launching double seaters but overall 1/2 liter per
launch is the average.

That's really good! My ASH 26 E uses a little more than that for the
same launch height, but not much more. It does save me about 10 gallons
of auto fuel when I fly, because I can fly from the local airport
instead of driving to the nearest gliderport.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA
* Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly

* Updated! "Transponders in Sailplanes"http://tinyurl.com/y739x4
* * * New Jan '08 - sections on Mode S, TPAS, ADS-B, Flarm, more

* "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation" atwww.motorglider.org

Eric

What is your average fuel consumption per launch? You have warmup time
and taxi time and such. I asked on of our flyers with a DG800 what he
uses and he averages about 3 liters per launch over time.
Of course when I asked the Antares pilot what his fuel consumption
average was he just laughed! Some guys just don't want to contribute
to scientific study!!!

Bob

Bill Daniels wrote:

That's really good! My ASH 26 E uses a little more than that for the same
launch height, but not much more. It does save me about 10 gallons of auto
fuel when I fly, because I can fly from the local airport instead of
driving to the nearest gliderport.


Your self launcher is limited to just launching you.

Yes, and that's true of almost all self-launchers in the USA. It's
different in Europe, where a lot of self-launchers are owned by clubs
and partnerships, so each self-launcher might launch 5 to 10 pilots many
times over the course of a year. Multiple owners really makes good use
of the flexibility of a self-launcher, while greatly reducing the cost
of ownership. I've promoted partnerships for self-launchers in the USA,
but it remains rare.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA
* Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly

* Updated! "Transponders in Sailplanes" http://tinyurl.com/y739x4
* New Jan '08 - sections on Mode S, TPAS, ADS-B, Flarm, more

* "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation" at www.motorglider.org