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Lancair crash at SnF



 
 
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  #111  
Old April 25th 08, 06:19 PM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Bertie the Bunyip[_24_]
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Posts: 2,969
Default Lancair crash at SnF

KAE wrote in
:

On Fri, 25 Apr 2008 11:15:25 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip
wrote:

WingFlaps wrote in
:

On Apr 25, 8:50*pm, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
Larry Dighera wrote
innews:3ui2149cg0sac5dsdsi4f05v8t42
:

On Fri, 25 Apr 2008 01:27:52 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip


wrote in :

The best way to do it is with a steep bank. Very steep.

The bank angle may be quantified:

Good grief Larry, you really are an idiot.
Of course it can be quatified, but the numbers only tell a minute
part of the story. I can categorically state that I can do a 180

with
70 deg bank at VSO 1.2 deadstick and come out the other end in one
piece. Can you? Try it using those figures and send my the answer

via
my Ouiji board.


Well I cannot understand you you can load the plane up like that and
not raise stall speed beyond 1.2Vs so you must be using a wing drop

to
acclerate the turn? Do you could just stall out of the turn -but

how
much height do you loose in the stall and it's recovery?


No, you have to lower the nose continuously to offload as you go

around
the bend. You will end up fairy nose low at the end of the turn

alright
but you can recover that as you level the wings. The turn is pretty
rapid at that speed so you won't be in it too long. It's as about "on
the edge" as you can get. It's the only way it can be done unles you
have an airplane with an outrageous climb. If you're proficient in

spins
try it at a bit of altitude and a reduced bank angle. You can increase
the bank in subsequent attempts as you become more comfortable. just
don't get the idea that this will make you good enough to try it in
anger on it's own!


Bertie


Is that a good description of how Bob Hoover used to fly his engine
out performance in the Shrike commander?
His energy management routine was one of the best parts of an airshow.
Kirk


Well, in many ways this is a lot more demanding. he would have had a lot
of energy in sotre for that dispaly, doing this, you're relatively low
and you have no speed to spare bar what you can make for yourself by
getting the nose down. I'm not saying you have to be a flying god to do
it, but you do have to be able to do this sort of manuever accurately
without even thinking about it, and that isn't part of any syllabus I
know of.


Bertie


  #112  
Old April 25th 08, 06:45 PM posted to rec.aviation.piloting,rec.aviation.student
[email protected]
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Posts: 1,130
Default Lancair crash at SnF

On Apr 25, 7:11 am, WingFlaps wrote:

"In physics...The scalar absolute value (magnitude) of velocity is
speed."

Cheers


But it's relative to space, not the earth, as I posted earlier.
Earth pulls straight down, nothing more. Do this, as we have done many
times: Go out and fly on a day when the upper winds are at 30 or 40
knots and get under the hood, do 30 degree banked turns, maintaining a
constant altitude and power setting, and see if the airspeed changes.
Got to be done over flat land, BTW. Any orographic lift will screw up
the altitude. You won't see any performance changes, but the
airplane's flight path over the ground sure isn't circular. Try 45
degree banked turns. Try it in a glide. See if you can prove me wrong.

Dan
  #113  
Old April 25th 08, 08:59 PM posted to rec.aviation.piloting,rec.aviation.student
WingFlaps
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Posts: 621
Default Lancair crash at SnF

On Apr 26, 5:45*am, wrote:
On Apr 25, 7:11 am, WingFlaps wrote:

"In physics...The scalar absolute value (magnitude) of velocity is
speed."


Cheers


* * * *But it's relative to space, not the earth, as I posted earlier.
Earth pulls straight down, nothing more. Do this, as we have done many
times: Go out and fly on a day when the upper winds are at 30 or 40
knots and get under the hood, do 30 degree banked turns, maintaining a
constant altitude and power setting, and see if the airspeed changes.
Got to be done over flat land, BTW. Any orographic lift will screw up
the altitude. You won't see any performance changes, but the
airplane's flight path over the ground sure isn't circular. Try 45
degree banked turns. Try it in a glide. See if you can prove me wrong.


WTF? I wasn't talking about speed over the ground...
  #114  
Old April 25th 08, 09:00 PM posted to rec.aviation.piloting,rec.aviation.student
WingFlaps
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 621
Default Lancair crash at SnF

On Apr 26, 3:48*am, Stefan wrote:
WingFlaps schrieb:

In everyday's language, the word velocity stands for the _magnitude_ of
the vector.
Nope. Not even at high school. The magnitude is "speed".
Maybe where you live. Not where I live.

BS. This is stated in any basic physics text book -even Wiki knows it:


"In physics...The scalar absolute value (magnitude) of velocity is
speed."


What part of "everyday's language" wasn't clear?


I can see you have trouble with English too.

Cheers

  #115  
Old April 25th 08, 10:43 PM posted to rec.aviation.piloting,rec.aviation.student
Stefan
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 578
Default Lancair crash at SnF

WingFlaps schrieb:

In everyday's language, the word velocity stands for the _magnitude_ of
the vector.
Nope. Not even at high school. The magnitude is "speed".
Maybe where you live. Not where I live.
BS. This is stated in any basic physics text book -even Wiki knows it:
"In physics...The scalar absolute value (magnitude) of velocity is
speed."

What part of "everyday's language" wasn't clear?


I can see you have trouble with English too.


If my mediocre English is offending you, then feel free to converse in
German, French, Italian or Spanish with me. I know all those languages
better than English, which obviously isn't my native language. How many
languages do _you_ speak?

Nevertheless I know English good enough to know that in general use
velocity is synonymous to speed. I don't expect you to agree with me,
but maybe you accept an excerpt from the OED:


velocity

1. a. Rapidity or celerity of motion; swiftness, speed.

1849 Macaulay Hist. Eng. iii. I. 379 The flying coaches are extolled as
far superior to any similar vehicles ever known in the world. Their
velocity is the subject of special commendation.

c. In scientific use, speed together with the direction of travel, as a
vector quantity.


So again: If, outside a strictly scientific or technical environment,
you choose to use a technical term which has a different meaning in
general use than in scientific use, then better advise it.
  #116  
Old April 25th 08, 11:38 PM posted to rec.aviation.piloting,rec.aviation.student
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6
Default Lancair crash at SnF

On Apr 25, 3:43 pm, Stefan wrote:
WingFlaps schrieb:

In everyday's language, the word velocity stands for the _magnitude_ of
the vector.
Nope. Not even at high school. The magnitude is "speed".
Maybe where you live. Not where I live.
BS. This is stated in any basic physics text book -even Wiki knows it:
"In physics...The scalar absolute value (magnitude) of velocity is
speed."
What part of "everyday's language" wasn't clear?

I can see you have trouble with English too.


If my mediocre English is offending you, then feel free to converse in
German, French, Italian or Spanish with me. I know all those languages
better than English, which obviously isn't my native language. How many
languages do _you_ speak?

Nevertheless I know English good enough to know that in general use
velocity is synonymous to speed. I don't expect you to agree with me,
but maybe you accept an excerpt from the OED:

velocity

1. a. Rapidity or celerity of motion; swiftness, speed.

1849 Macaulay Hist. Eng. iii. I. 379 The flying coaches are extolled as
far superior to any similar vehicles ever known in the world. Their
velocity is the subject of special commendation.

c. In scientific use, speed together with the direction of travel, as a
vector quantity.

So again: If, outside a strictly scientific or technical environment,
you choose to use a technical term which has a different meaning in
general use than in scientific use, then better advise it.


Stefan, this English speaker understands you (both your grammar and
your arguments) perfectly. I can't say the same of the gibberish
posted by Wingflaps.
  #117  
Old April 26th 08, 12:09 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting,rec.aviation.student
WingFlaps
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 621
Default Lancair crash at SnF

On Apr 26, 10:38*am, wrote:
On Apr 25, 3:43 pm, Stefan wrote:





WingFlaps schrieb:


In everyday's language, the word velocity stands for the _magnitude_ of
the vector.
Nope. Not even at high school. The magnitude is "speed".
Maybe where you live. Not where I live.
BS. This is stated in any basic physics text book -even Wiki knows it:
"In physics...The scalar absolute value (magnitude) of velocity is
speed."
What part of "everyday's language" wasn't clear?
I can see you have trouble with English too.


If my mediocre English is offending you, then feel free to converse in
German, French, Italian or Spanish with me. I know all those languages
better than English, which obviously isn't my native language. How many
languages do _you_ speak?


Nevertheless I know English good enough to know that in general use
velocity is synonymous to speed. I don't expect you to agree with me,
but maybe you accept an excerpt from the OED:


velocity


1. a. Rapidity or celerity of motion; swiftness, speed.


1849 Macaulay Hist. Eng. iii. I. 379 The flying coaches are extolled as
far superior to any similar vehicles ever known in the world. Their
velocity is the subject of special commendation.


c. In scientific use, speed together with the direction of travel, as a
vector quantity.


So again: If, outside a strictly scientific or technical environment,
you choose to use a technical term which has a different meaning in
general use than in scientific use, then better advise it.


Stefan, this English speaker understands you (both your grammar and
your arguments) perfectly. *I can't say the same of the gibberish
posted by Wingflaps.- Hide quoted text -


Bwhahahhahaha. Stefan's got a TROLL fwend.

Cheers
  #118  
Old April 26th 08, 12:30 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting,rec.aviation.student
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6
Default Lancair crash at SnF

On Apr 25, 5:09 pm, WingFlaps wrote:
On Apr 26, 10:38 am, wrote:



On Apr 25, 3:43 pm, Stefan wrote:


WingFlaps schrieb:


In everyday's language, the word velocity stands for the _magnitude_ of
the vector.
Nope. Not even at high school. The magnitude is "speed".
Maybe where you live. Not where I live.
BS. This is stated in any basic physics text book -even Wiki knows it:
"In physics...The scalar absolute value (magnitude) of velocity is
speed."
What part of "everyday's language" wasn't clear?
I can see you have trouble with English too.


If my mediocre English is offending you, then feel free to converse in
German, French, Italian or Spanish with me. I know all those languages
better than English, which obviously isn't my native language. How many
languages do _you_ speak?


Nevertheless I know English good enough to know that in general use
velocity is synonymous to speed. I don't expect you to agree with me,
but maybe you accept an excerpt from the OED:


velocity


1. a. Rapidity or celerity of motion; swiftness, speed.


1849 Macaulay Hist. Eng. iii. I. 379 The flying coaches are extolled as
far superior to any similar vehicles ever known in the world. Their
velocity is the subject of special commendation.


c. In scientific use, speed together with the direction of travel, as a
vector quantity.


So again: If, outside a strictly scientific or technical environment,
you choose to use a technical term which has a different meaning in
general use than in scientific use, then better advise it.


Stefan, this English speaker understands you (both your grammar and
your arguments) perfectly. I can't say the same of the gibberish
posted by Wingflaps.- Hide quoted text -


Bwhahahhahaha. Stefan's got a TROLL fwend.

Cheers


Yep, I'm someone who recognizes the futility of arguing with an
arrogant, clueless blowhard. But as long as you're critiquing the
grammar of non-English speakers, critique this from a self-declared
English speaker:

Well I cannot understand you you can load the plane up like that and
not raise stall speed beyond 1.2Vs so you must be using a wing drop to
acclerate the turn? Do you could just stall out of the turn -but how
much height do you loose in the stall and it's recovery?

  #119  
Old April 26th 08, 12:41 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting,rec.aviation.student
Steve Hix
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 340
Default Lancair crash at SnF

In article ,
Stefan wrote:

WingFlaps schrieb:

In everyday's language, the word velocity stands for the _magnitude_ of
the vector.
Nope. Not even at high school. The magnitude is "speed".
Maybe where you live. Not where I live.
BS. This is stated in any basic physics text book -even Wiki knows it:
"In physics...The scalar absolute value (magnitude) of velocity is
speed."
What part of "everyday's language" wasn't clear?


I can see you have trouble with English too.


If my mediocre English is offending you, then feel free to converse in
German, French, Italian or Spanish with me. I know all those languages
better than English, which obviously isn't my native language. How many
languages do _you_ speak?


There are those who might argue that he doesn't actually speak any
competently.

Your English is just fine.
  #120  
Old April 26th 08, 12:51 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting,rec.aviation.student
WingFlaps
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 621
Default Lancair crash at SnF

On Apr 26, 11:30*am, wrote:
On Apr 25, 5:09 pm, WingFlaps wrote:





On Apr 26, 10:38 am, wrote:


On Apr 25, 3:43 pm, Stefan wrote:


WingFlaps schrieb:


In everyday's language, the word velocity stands for the _magnitude_ of
the vector.
Nope. Not even at high school. The magnitude is "speed".
Maybe where you live. Not where I live.
BS. This is stated in any basic physics text book -even Wiki knows it:
"In physics...The scalar absolute value (magnitude) of velocity is
speed."
What part of "everyday's language" wasn't clear?
I can see you have trouble with English too.


If my mediocre English is offending you, then feel free to converse in
German, French, Italian or Spanish with me. I know all those languages
better than English, which obviously isn't my native language. How many
languages do _you_ speak?


Nevertheless I know English good enough to know that in general use
velocity is synonymous to speed. I don't expect you to agree with me,
but maybe you accept an excerpt from the OED:


velocity


1. a. Rapidity or celerity of motion; swiftness, speed.


1849 Macaulay Hist. Eng. iii. I. 379 The flying coaches are extolled as
far superior to any similar vehicles ever known in the world. Their
velocity is the subject of special commendation.


c. In scientific use, speed together with the direction of travel, as a
vector quantity.


So again: If, outside a strictly scientific or technical environment,
you choose to use a technical term which has a different meaning in
general use than in scientific use, then better advise it.


Stefan, this English speaker understands you (both your grammar and
your arguments) perfectly. *I can't say the same of the gibberish
posted by Wingflaps.- Hide quoted text -


Bwhahahhahaha. Stefan's got a TROLL *fwend.


Cheers


Yep, I'm someone who recognizes the futility of arguing with an
arrogant, clueless blowhard. *But as long as you're critiquing the
grammar of non-English speakers, critique this from a self-declared
English speaker:


I declare you're a troll.

Cheers
 




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