Cirrus and Lancair Make Bonanza Obsolete?

"Jeff" wrote:
If the SR22 had its design with retract gear, it would be much faster.

Probably not. In fact, I believe I recall one of the Klapmeier's saying
the design is already so slick, they figured retracting the gear would
add only about 5 knots to cruise TAS.


The
comanche 400

Oh, puh-leeeze!
--
Dan
C172RG at BFM

"ArtP" wrote:
Just what about their safety record do you find so encouraging?


Nothing. The OP said they have atrocious safety records due to their
spin characteristics.
--
Dan
C172RG at BFM

Jeff wrote
I dont agree with fixed gear being safer in IMC, I have a turbo arrow and
putting the gear down is second nature.
By the time you get to your FAF you have it in landing configuration, no
problems..

That's not what he's talking about. The risk we're concerned with is
not gear-up landing (which is, for all practical purposes, a financial
rather than a life-and-lib risk) but loss of control in IMC. Having
the gear hanging out means it takes that much longer to overspeed the
airplane, giving the pilot that much more time to recover from the
unusual attitude.

Michael

"R. Hubbell" wrote in message news:tRNsb.1659$iS6.406@fed1read04...
On Thu, 13 Nov 2003 02:32:02 -0800
Jeff wrote:

If I had 300k to spend I would get a Barron


You'll find two engines means you are twice as likely to loose one.
Kaaaaaching!


R. Hubbell



perhaps, but the odds of losing (not loosing) _all_ of your engines
simultaneously go up by several orders of magnitude.

g_a

On 13-Nov-2003, (Michael) wrote:

That's not what he's talking about. The risk we're concerned with is
not gear-up landing (which is, for all practical purposes, a financial
rather than a life-and-lib risk) but loss of control in IMC. Having
the gear hanging out means it takes that much longer to overspeed the
airplane, giving the pilot that much more time to recover from the
unusual attitude.

I agree, However, as has been pointed out elsewhere in this thread, the
Cirrus is an extremely "clean" airplane even with its fixed gear. That's
how it achieves its exceptional cruise speed performance. On an airplane
like an Arrow you can extend the gear to greatly increase drag when things
get dicey. Obviously not an option in the Cirrus, but they could employ
spoilers or similar devices to achieve the same purpose.

--
-Elliott Drucker

On Thu, 13 Nov 2003 18:19:00 GMT, wrote:


On an airplane
like an Arrow you can extend the gear to greatly increase drag when things
get dicey. Obviously not an option in the Cirrus, but they could employ
spoilers or similar devices to achieve the same purpose.

Lancair does offer spoilers, but Cirrus does not.

"Dan Luke" wrote in message
...
"Tom S." wrote:
So let's send all the Bonanza's to the junkyard.

Let's send all the cars over 10 years old there too.

Gee, some V-tails are older than most people in this group.

And they're still being maintained and flown because, until recently, a
new airplane was virtually the same as a thirty-year old one. There was
little incentive to buy new. You could by an old Bo in decent shape and
make it as good as a new one (or better) for a lot less money.

Hint for the slow: We're talking USED aircraft.

...and the effect that the new designs may be having on used aircraft
prices. I was in the market for about an '85 model Bo or 210 a while
back, but now I'd seriously think about spending a little more and
getting a Cirrus.

That's nice, but read the subject line.

I hope to hell a current design can obsolesce a design that is basically 55
years old, and which has not been produced in nearly ten years.

"Dan Luke" wrote in message
...
"Tom S." wrote:
They're not; they have atrocious safety records due to their spin
characteristics.

Baloney. There has been one fatal accident attributed to a spin, and in
that one the pilots failed to deplot the recovery chute.

More than one (why do only fatals count) and in that one, it FAILED to
deploy. Nice to know that the only spin recovery is to deploy (maybe) a
'chute.

"Dan Luke" wrote in message
...
"ArtP" wrote:
Just what about their safety record do you find so encouraging?


Nothing. The OP said they have atrocious safety records due to their
spin characteristics.

Which is why the insurance is so high.

"Thomas Borchert" wrote in message
...
Tom,

they have atrocious safety records due to their spin
characteristics.


Do you maybe have any source for numbers that support this statement?
Hint: They don't exist. You're wrong.

Okay...tell me the recommended spin recovery for Cirrus.

Tell me the low altitude recovery procedure.