Are the Israelis using smaller Hellfire warheads?

I've seen it suggested on some web pages that the Israelis are using
smaller Hellfire warheads for their anti-terror strikes than come standard.
Is this true and, if so, does anyone have a good cite?

Thanks,

-Jeff B.
yeff at erols dot com

"Yeff" wrote in message
...
I've seen it suggested on some web pages that the Israelis are using
smaller Hellfire warheads for their anti-terror strikes than come
standard.
Is this true and, if so, does anyone have a good cite?


I hadn't heard that, but it would probably make sense, seeing as the
standard armor-percing hellfire warhead is overkill for a soft target like a
car.

From: "Thomas J. Paladino Jr."
Date: 4/20/2004 3:06 PM Central Daylight Time
Message-id:


"Yeff" wrote in message
...
I've seen it suggested on some web pages that the Israelis are using
smaller Hellfire warheads for their anti-terror strikes than come
standard.
Is this true and, if so, does anyone have a good cite?


I hadn't heard that, but it would probably make sense, seeing as the
standard armor-percing hellfire warhead is overkill for a soft target like a
car.


And way too much overkill for squishy targets like Hamas leaders.

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

"Thomas J. Paladino Jr." wrote in
:


"Yeff" wrote in message
...
I've seen it suggested on some web pages that the Israelis are using
smaller Hellfire warheads for their anti-terror strikes than come
standard.
Is this true and, if so, does anyone have a good cite?


I hadn't heard that, but it would probably make sense, seeing as the
standard armor-percing hellfire warhead is overkill for a soft target
like a car.



It's only a ~22 lb. warhead. And some of those cars may be "armored".

Changing the weight of the warhead could affect flight characteristics of
the missile.
--
Jim Yanik
jyanik-at-kua.net

Glenfiddich wrote in
:

On Tue, 20 Apr 2004 15:52:44 -0400, Yeff wrote:

I've seen it suggested on some web pages that the Israelis are using
smaller Hellfire warheads for their anti-terror strikes than come
standard. Is this true and, if so, does anyone have a good cite?

Highly likely - if it *was* a Hellfire.

Check the early pictures of the last airstrike - the blast didn't even
remove the car's hubcaps.
Ignore later pictures - reports say the car was vandalised by souvenir
seekers.


Well,Hellfire uses a shaped charge warhead,so it makes a "jet' of
penetrating metal,tearing through the car's interior and the blast may
occur outside the car,and it would not affect the hubcaps/wheelcovers.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik-at-kua.net

(B2431) wrote:

From: "Thomas J. Paladino Jr."
Date: 4/20/2004 3:06 PM Central Daylight Time
Message-id:


"Yeff" wrote in message
...
I've seen it suggested on some web pages that the Israelis are using
smaller Hellfire warheads for their anti-terror strikes than come
standard.
Is this true and, if so, does anyone have a good cite?


I hadn't heard that, but it would probably make sense, seeing as the
standard armor-percing hellfire warhead is overkill for a soft target like a
car.


And way too much overkill for squishy targets like Hamas leaders.

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

Sure...why waste all that money on the bigger ones when you can
buy the little ones and get two Hamas leaders for the price of
one?
--

-Gord.

"Yeff" wrote in message
...
I've seen it suggested on some web pages that the Israelis are using
smaller Hellfire warheads for their anti-terror strikes than come
standard.
Is this true and, if so, does anyone have a good cite?


From what I understand, the Israelis have converted both the TOW and
Hellfire to use blast/frag warheads instead of the usual shaped charge ones.
Blast/frag is more efficient for attacking the target set they are going
after. I don't know about weight though.

"Jim Yanik" wrote in message
.. .
Glenfiddich wrote in
:

On Tue, 20 Apr 2004 15:52:44 -0400, Yeff wrote:

I've seen it suggested on some web pages that the Israelis are using
smaller Hellfire warheads for their anti-terror strikes than come
standard. Is this true and, if so, does anyone have a good cite?

Highly likely - if it *was* a Hellfire.

Check the early pictures of the last airstrike - the blast didn't even
remove the car's hubcaps.
Ignore later pictures - reports say the car was vandalised by souvenir
seekers.


Well,Hellfire uses a shaped charge warhead,so it makes a "jet' of
penetrating metal,tearing through the car's interior and the blast may
occur outside the car,and it would not affect the hubcaps/wheelcovers.

Think about what you just said. The fact that the standard Hellfire uses a
HEAT warhead does not really greatly affect the blast effect; it only means
that a portion of the blast has been used (as it expands outward) to invert
the liner and turn it into a stream of really hot metal and gas focused on a
small area. The explosive still exhibits a generally spherical blast pattern
overall. Set a fifteen pound demo shaped charge against the average
passenger vehicle and you'll see that it does not *need* the shaped charge
effect to do a pretty good number on the target; that much HE going off in
close contact to the car will tend to ruin everyone's day if they were
unfortunate enough to be inside it.

Brooks


--
Jim Yanik
jyanik-at-kua.net

Kevin Brooks wrote in message
...


Think about what you just said. The fact that the standard Hellfire
uses a
HEAT warhead does not really greatly affect the blast effect; it only
means
that a portion of the blast has been used (as it expands outward) to
invert
the liner and turn it into a stream of really hot metal and gas
focused on a
small area. The explosive still exhibits a generally spherical blast
pattern
overall. Set a fifteen pound demo shaped charge against the average
passenger vehicle and you'll see that it does not *need* the shaped
charge
effect to do a pretty good number on the target; that much HE going
off in
close contact to the car will tend to ruin everyone's day if they were
unfortunate enough to be inside it.

Brooks

I don't believe you, I think we need to see a few hundred more test
shots. ;-)

--
Scott
--------
Let every nation know, whether it wishes us well or ill, that we shall
pay any price, bear any burden, meet any hardship, support any friend,
oppose any foe to assure the survival and the success of liberty. John
F Kennedy

"Kevin Brooks" wrote in
:


"Jim Yanik" wrote in message
.. .
Glenfiddich wrote in
:

On Tue, 20 Apr 2004 15:52:44 -0400, Yeff
wrote:

I've seen it suggested on some web pages that the Israelis are
using smaller Hellfire warheads for their anti-terror strikes than
come standard. Is this true and, if so, does anyone have a good
cite?

Highly likely - if it *was* a Hellfire.

Check the early pictures of the last airstrike - the blast didn't
even remove the car's hubcaps.
Ignore later pictures - reports say the car was vandalised by
souvenir seekers.


Well,Hellfire uses a shaped charge warhead,so it makes a "jet' of
penetrating metal,tearing through the car's interior and the blast
may occur outside the car,and it would not affect the
hubcaps/wheelcovers.

Think about what you just said. The fact that the standard Hellfire
uses a HEAT warhead does not really greatly affect the blast effect;
it only means that a portion of the blast has been used (as it expands
outward) to invert the liner and turn it into a stream of really hot
metal and gas focused on a small area. The explosive still exhibits a
generally spherical blast pattern overall. Set a fifteen pound demo
shaped charge against the average passenger vehicle and you'll see
that it does not *need* the shaped charge effect to do a pretty good
number on the target; that much HE going off in close contact to the
car will tend to ruin everyone's day if they were unfortunate enough
to be inside it.

Brooks


--
Jim Yanik
jyanik-at-kua.net



I *did* think about what I wrote.
The blast is going to occur in a place where the roughly spherical blast
front is not likely to affect wheel covers or hubcaps.
The jet will not do much damage in itself,the majority of damage inside -
will- be caused by the blast.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik-at-kua.net