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#41
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barrel roll in 172
"Stefan" wrote The first safety rule of aviation I've learnt was "never assume". Reading this group, it seems that many pilots are assuming an awful lot. Surely you do understand where we are coming from. An ounce of prevention is better than a pound of death by crash. -- Jim in NC |
#42
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barrel roll in 172
Stefan wrote:
Morgans schrieb: Don't encourage that type of behavior with a yes. Where did he write that he wants top try it? He was just wondering. and a blown barrel roll could stall the plane, Gee... and then fall out of the sky in pieces, I assume. I wonder what your comment would have been if a journalist had written this. I'll bet he is not going to wear a parachute, either, which is required. No. As it's illegal to do barrel roll a 172, there can't be a legal requirement to wear a chute while doing so. You obviously aren't very familiar with the IRS. You are required to report and pay taxes on money gained illegally. :-) Matt |
#43
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barrel roll in 172
mikeytag wrote:
Would you really feel safe going inverted in a gravity fed fuel system? The 172 is probably not the best choice for this type of maneuver, although you could probably pull it off if you rolled quick enough. It isn't gravity that feeds the fuel, it is force caused by acceleration. Gravity can be the source of acceleration, but it doesn't have to be the source. In a loop, intertial force can be the source. I've flown a loop in a 150 and its fuel system had no problem when inverted at the top of the loop. Matt |
#44
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barrel roll in 172
Dudley Henriques wrote:
Scotty McCray flew a Schweizer 2-22 EK for his demonstrations. We appeared at the same shows many many times and I knew him quite well. The 2-22 wasn't exactly the "cleanest" glider in the world by today's standards. Scotty was an absolute master at energy control. His technique for energy management was in my opinion the best I've ever seen done in an unpowered aircraft. I think I watched Scotty perform hundreds of barrel rolls in the 2-22 and never once did I see him dish it out of a roll. Strangely enough, it was the addition of horsepower to his aerobatics that killed him down in Brazil in 73, when the Decathlon he dished out of a low altitude roll. One of the nicest and finest guys I knew in aviation. Dudley Henriques What does "dished out" mean? Matt |
#45
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barrel roll in 172
In article ,
Matt Whiting wrote: Dudley Henriques wrote: Scotty McCray flew a Schweizer 2-22 EK for his demonstrations. We appeared at the same shows many many times and I knew him quite well. The 2-22 wasn't exactly the "cleanest" glider in the world by today's standards. Scotty was an absolute master at energy control. His technique for energy management was in my opinion the best I've ever seen done in an unpowered aircraft. I think I watched Scotty perform hundreds of barrel rolls in the 2-22 and never once did I see him dish it out of a roll. Strangely enough, it was the addition of horsepower to his aerobatics that killed him down in Brazil in 73, when the Decathlon he dished out of a low altitude roll. One of the nicest and finest guys I knew in aviation. Dudley Henriques What does "dished out" mean? Matt, this and your previous post show you do not have a broad knowledge of the world of aerobatics. Please do not dispute those that do. Your condescending tone is most inappropriate. |
#46
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barrel roll in 172
In article ,
"Morgans" wrote: Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't an aileron roll a negative 1 G maneuver? You spin on an axis, through the plane's center of gravity. For an instant, the pilot is upside down, hanging by the belt. Inertia, centrifugal force. Think three dimensional. You do not have to maintain level flight. Pick a down-line. Altitude and gravity are your friends, put the nose down. :-)) |
#47
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barrel roll in 172
Morgans schrieb:
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't an aileron roll a negative 1 G maneuver? You spin on an axis, through the plane's center of gravity. For an instant, the pilot is upside down, hanging by the belt. No. This is called a slow roll or simply a roll. The 707 roll was indeed a barrel roll. Check it out on Jay's webpage. Hardly an authoritative source. Stefan |
#48
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barrel roll in 172
"Matt Whiting" wrote in message ... Dudley Henriques wrote: Scotty McCray flew a Schweizer 2-22 EK for his demonstrations. We appeared at the same shows many many times and I knew him quite well. The 2-22 wasn't exactly the "cleanest" glider in the world by today's standards. Scotty was an absolute master at energy control. His technique for energy management was in my opinion the best I've ever seen done in an unpowered aircraft. I think I watched Scotty perform hundreds of barrel rolls in the 2-22 and never once did I see him dish it out of a roll. Strangely enough, it was the addition of horsepower to his aerobatics that killed him down in Brazil in 73, when the Decathlon he dished out of a low altitude roll. One of the nicest and finest guys I knew in aviation. Dudley Henriques What does "dished out" mean? Matt When you do a roll, the second half of the roll requires changing rudder and blending stick in elevator and aileron. If you are late on the rudder change, or late on the elevator blending out from forward elevator to back elevator, its possible to allow the airplane to change from rolling on its longitudinal axis to an arc through the back side recovery. Basically what happens is that you "slide" off the roll axis and widen the roll nose low through the arc. In effect, you are changing the aircraft's roll axis from a controlled slow roll to an aileron roll format, which is primarily aileron and allows the nose to arc naturally during the roll unlike the slow roll format where the airplane is "flown" through the entire roll from the roll initiation at the apex of the pull on the airplane's longitudinal axis. We call this coming in late and allowing this to happen on the back side "dishing out" of the roll. Allowing this to happen is one of the major killers, if not THE major killer of pilots doing low altitude roll maneuvers. Not allowing dishout on a roll is so critical in low altitude demonstration work that when I practiced slow rolls for demonstration purposes, I would set the airplane on the roll apex at it's inverted nose attitude while right side up after a pull to the set point from a point where the altimeter needle was covering the 0 on the altimeter, then roll the airplane from the initiation point returning the needle to recover the 0 again as level flight was achieved again on recovery. Any deviation from that standard was considered a blown roll, and the entire practice session would have to be re-flown. Dudley Henriques |
#49
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barrel roll in 172
Matt Whiting wrote:
Your thousands of hours aside, this is simply an incorrect statement. A barrel roll requires flying a loop and you can't fly a loop at 1 G. It sounds like you are describing an aileron roll. The descriptions from the aerobatic website, it appears, disagree with your understanding of a barrel roll and aileron roll: http://www.iac.org/begin/figures.html#Aileron%20Rolls -- Peter |
#50
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barrel roll in 172
Morgans wrote
The 707 roll was indeed a barrel roll. Check it out on Jay's webpage. Again....check the definition of a "barrel roll" at the web site posted by Peter and my previous post. Big John, dispite his thousands of hours, simply doesn't know what a "barrel roll" is. I'll put my Navy training and 22,000 hours and ATP/CFI ratings up against his anyday. :-) I've been waiting for two years for John to post an authoritative source for his concept of a "barrel roll". http://www.iac.org/begin/figures.html#Aileron%20Rolls |
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