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Do you crab or forward slip in X wind landings



 
 
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  #21  
Old February 26th 17, 08:10 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Bob Whelan[_3_]
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Posts: 400
Default Do you crab or forward slip in X wind landings

This thread is more interesting than I would have guessed. I thought
standard practice was to teach both. That's what we did when I was a
student pilot. Crabbing was emphasized as the better technique for
managing larger cross winds (and we students figured it out, just fine).


I no longer remember if I was taught both. Learning in a (slab-sided) 2-33, I
was *certainly* taught slips as a means to increase sink, and I remember them
being useful/great-fun in early-model, top-only-spoilered, 1-26's. Upon
transitioning into flaps-only single-seaters, I found slipping approaches
unnecessary/not-realistically-worth-practicing due to (in the case of the
wimpily-ruddered) HP-14, full flaps resulting in something less than a 4/1
L/D, and, in the case of the (less-powerfully-flapped) Zuni, slips with full
flaps actually *reducing* the sink rate.

As for the actual touchdowns, I always sought to 2-point-on the HP-14 (easy to
do), while simultaneously (if possible) angling into any "significant
crosswind" by way of minimizing drift at touchdown; I can't recall ever
landing the HP on pavement in a crosswind. OTOH, in the Zuni (especially on
pavement) I routinely wheeled-on the ship with partial flaps in significant
crosswinds, just because it was easier to do gracefully than attempt an
easily-ballooned flare-to-a-2-point attempt. (The HP also wheeled on nicely,
but I thought it counterproductive - in a "useful most often" skills sense -
to routinely do so.)

Does it go without saying all flaps-only skills were self-taught (i.e.
reading, thinking, doing)? Definitely a good idea (and challenging fun if
approached with the right mindset) to continually attempt to increase the
variety/competency of skills in one's collection...

Bob W.
  #22  
Old February 26th 17, 08:58 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Phil Plane
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Posts: 9
Default Do you crab or forward slip in X wind landings

Crab for grass, slip for paved.

I never understood why you would slip until I started using a paved runway. It is surprising how much crosswind you can handle without the low wing dragging, but on a narrow runway it might be necessary to land offset from centerline so the low wing is over the runway and the high wing is over the obstacles beside the runway.
  #23  
Old February 26th 17, 09:00 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
[email protected]
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Posts: 2,124
Default Do you crab or forward slip in X wind landings

On Sunday, February 26, 2017 at 1:25:53 PM UTC-5, Tango Eight wrote:
This thread is more interesting that I would have guessed. I thought standard practice was to teach both. That's what we did when I was a student pilot. Crabbing was emphasized as the better technique for managing larger cross winds (and we students figured it out, just fine).

It's obvious to any pilot proficient with both slips and crabbing approaches that the cross wind limits of the crabbing approach are vastly higher than what you can manage with slipping alone. About 50%, I'd reckon.

see also: Peter Schiff, The Proficient Pilot.

best,
Evan Ludeman / T8


I teach both but find most end up preferring slip. I do insist on slip when teaching in the Cub. My airplane- my rules.
UH
  #24  
Old February 26th 17, 09:11 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Bruce Hoult
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Default Do you crab or forward slip in X wind landings

On Sunday, February 26, 2017 at 11:00:40 PM UTC+3, wrote:
On Sunday, February 26, 2017 at 1:25:53 PM UTC-5, Tango Eight wrote:
This thread is more interesting that I would have guessed. I thought standard practice was to teach both. That's what we did when I was a student pilot. Crabbing was emphasized as the better technique for managing larger cross winds (and we students figured it out, just fine).

It's obvious to any pilot proficient with both slips and crabbing approaches that the cross wind limits of the crabbing approach are vastly higher than what you can manage with slipping alone. About 50%, I'd reckon.

see also: Peter Schiff, The Proficient Pilot.

best,
Evan Ludeman / T8


I teach both but find most end up preferring slip. I do insist on slip when teaching in the Cub. My airplane- my rules.
UH


If you're in danger of touching a wingtip in the cub then you should think about landing across the runway instead of along it!
  #25  
Old February 26th 17, 09:48 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Tango Eight
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Posts: 962
Default Do you crab or forward slip in X wind landings

On Sunday, February 26, 2017 at 3:00:40 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Sunday, February 26, 2017 at 1:25:53 PM UTC-5, Tango Eight wrote:
This thread is more interesting that I would have guessed. I thought standard practice was to teach both. That's what we did when I was a student pilot. Crabbing was emphasized as the better technique for managing larger cross winds (and we students figured it out, just fine).

It's obvious to any pilot proficient with both slips and crabbing approaches that the cross wind limits of the crabbing approach are vastly higher than what you can manage with slipping alone. About 50%, I'd reckon.

see also: Peter Schiff, The Proficient Pilot.

best,
Evan Ludeman / T8


I teach both but find most end up preferring slip. I do insist on slip when teaching in the Cub. My airplane- my rules.
UH


In high wing tail dragger powered airplanes, I think we all slip. And if we can't manage with a slip, it's time to find another runway! Schiff's advocacy for crabbing was mostly for low wing tri geared things (up to / including 777, lol).

-Evan
  #26  
Old February 26th 17, 10:16 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Charlie M. (UH & 002 owner/pilot)
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Posts: 1,383
Default Do you crab or forward slip in X wind landings

True, I've been taught slips and crabs, both have their uses depending on aircraft, surface and wind. Good to know both.

Here's one for all you.....

Whats the definition of "excessive cross wind?"




"When you run out of rudder"

LOL.....
  #27  
Old February 27th 17, 12:23 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
[email protected]
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Posts: 465
Default Do you crab or forward slip in X wind landings

Whats the definition of "excessive cross wind?"

In the Cessna I used to have, I suppose the time I almost touched the runway with the wingtip was a bit excessive.

OTOH in the HP-14 I used to have, I avoided days with any significant crosswind, due to the wings being long and low.
  #28  
Old February 27th 17, 01:13 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Dan Marotta
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Default Do you crab or forward slip in X wind landings

I used to slip the B-727 all the way to touchdown...

On 2/26/2017 1:48 PM, Tango Eight wrote:
On Sunday, February 26, 2017 at 3:00:40 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Sunday, February 26, 2017 at 1:25:53 PM UTC-5, Tango Eight wrote:
This thread is more interesting that I would have guessed. I thought standard practice was to teach both. That's what we did when I was a student pilot. Crabbing was emphasized as the better technique for managing larger cross winds (and we students figured it out, just fine).

It's obvious to any pilot proficient with both slips and crabbing approaches that the cross wind limits of the crabbing approach are vastly higher than what you can manage with slipping alone. About 50%, I'd reckon.

see also: Peter Schiff, The Proficient Pilot.

best,
Evan Ludeman / T8

I teach both but find most end up preferring slip. I do insist on slip when teaching in the Cub. My airplane- my rules.
UH

In high wing tail dragger powered airplanes, I think we all slip. And if we can't manage with a slip, it's time to find another runway! Schiff's advocacy for crabbing was mostly for low wing tri geared things (up to / including 777, lol).

-Evan


--
Dan, 5J
  #29  
Old February 27th 17, 01:37 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Jonathan St. Cloud
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Posts: 1,463
Default Do you crab or forward slip in X wind landings

At 3;23 of this video is a great shot of a DG 1001 (?) in a slip. Great video too.

On Sunday, February 26, 2017 at 4:13:50 PM UTC-8, Dan Marotta wrote:
I used to slip the B-727 all the way to touchdown...

On 2/26/2017 1:48 PM, Tango Eight wrote:
On Sunday, February 26, 2017 at 3:00:40 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Sunday, February 26, 2017 at 1:25:53 PM UTC-5, Tango Eight wrote:
This thread is more interesting that I would have guessed. I thought standard practice was to teach both. That's what we did when I was a student pilot. Crabbing was emphasized as the better technique for managing larger cross winds (and we students figured it out, just fine).

It's obvious to any pilot proficient with both slips and crabbing approaches that the cross wind limits of the crabbing approach are vastly higher than what you can manage with slipping alone. About 50%, I'd reckon.

see also: Peter Schiff, The Proficient Pilot.

best,
Evan Ludeman / T8
I teach both but find most end up preferring slip. I do insist on slip when teaching in the Cub. My airplane- my rules.
UH

In high wing tail dragger powered airplanes, I think we all slip. And if we can't manage with a slip, it's time to find another runway! Schiff's advocacy for crabbing was mostly for low wing tri geared things (up to / including 777, lol).

-Evan


--
Dan, 5J


  #30  
Old February 27th 17, 02:11 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Martin Gregorie[_5_]
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Posts: 1,224
Default Do you crab or forward slip in X wind landings

On Sun, 26 Feb 2017 16:37:51 -0800, Jonathan St. Cloud wrote:

At 3;23 of this video is a great shot of a DG 1001 (?) in a slip. Great
video too.

URL please.



--
martin@ | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
org |
 




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