New transponder mode S vs. mode C

I live in San Antonio, Texas, USA. We fly out of a field 15 nautical
miles away from San Antonio International airport and are basically on
final approach for a lot of jet traffic. There are also two Air Force
bases in the immediate area. There is no requirement in the U.S. to
have mode S as there will be in Europe. However, if there is less
power consumption due to fewer interrogations or if there is more
accuracy on TCAS, I would be willing to go with it. I use a Cambridge
302 for GPS.
Stefan wrote:
Tom N. schrieb:
Any opinions? I plan to install a new Becker transponder in my ASW-28.
Should I go with the old mode C unit or pay extra for the new mode S
unit? Thanks.

Tor answer this question, it would be extremely helpful to know in which
part of the world you intend to fly.

Tom N. schrieb:
There is no requirement in the U.S. to
have mode S as there will be in Europe. However, if there is less
power consumption due to fewer interrogations or if there is more
accuracy on TCAS, I would be willing to go with it.

It seems you pretty much answered your question yourself.

Tom N. wrote:
Thanks everyone. Can you tell me why mode S is more desirable? Even
with mode S, I don't think that I could display traffic on my PDA.
Eric Greenwell wrote:

What country are you in (my guess was the US, but maybe not)? If it's
the USA, mode S is slightly more desirable because is will use less
power in area with a lot of radars; if it's Europe, you should get it.
You also have more choices there than the US for mode S.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA
Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly

"Transponders in Sailplanes" on the Soaring Safety Foundation website
www.soaringsafety.org/prevention/articles.html

"A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation" at www.motorglider.org

Hi Tom!

your 302 does not qualify as a certified GPS for the mode S transponder.

Best Regards


Hans


Tom N. schrieb:
I live in San Antonio, Texas, USA. We fly out of a field 15 nautical
miles away from San Antonio International airport and are basically on
final approach for a lot of jet traffic. There are also two Air Force
bases in the immediate area. There is no requirement in the U.S. to
have mode S as there will be in Europe. However, if there is less
power consumption due to fewer interrogations or if there is more
accuracy on TCAS, I would be willing to go with it. I use a Cambridge
302 for GPS.
Stefan wrote:
Tom N. schrieb:
Any opinions? I plan to install a new Becker transponder in my ASW-28.
Should I go with the old mode C unit or pay extra for the new mode S
unit? Thanks.
Tor answer this question, it would be extremely helpful to know in which
part of the world you intend to fly.

US military fighter type aircraft do not currently have TCAS
Do not rely on TCAS to keep you safe
BT

"Tom N." wrote in message
ups.com...
I live in San Antonio, Texas, USA. We fly out of a field 15 nautical
miles away from San Antonio International airport and are basically on
final approach for a lot of jet traffic. There are also two Air Force
bases in the immediate area. There is no requirement in the U.S. to
have mode S as there will be in Europe. However, if there is less
power consumption due to fewer interrogations or if there is more
accuracy on TCAS, I would be willing to go with it. I use a Cambridge
302 for GPS.
Stefan wrote:
Tom N. schrieb:
Any opinions? I plan to install a new Becker transponder in my ASW-28.
Should I go with the old mode C unit or pay extra for the new mode S
unit? Thanks.

Tor answer this question, it would be extremely helpful to know in which
part of the world you intend to fly.

ok..
so next we are going to want ADS-B in our gliders?
someone should figure how to get that target data displayed on the moving
map with WinPilot (or similar) on the PDA

B

"Mike Schumann" wrote in message
news
You need a graphic display device, like a Garmin 430 to see traffic.
Beware. The FAA has announced that new radars will not support the
Traffic Info function, so the main advantage of Mode S will be gone. I
would opt for a low cost solution, as eventually ADS-B will obsolete both
Mode S and Mode C transponders.

Mike Schumann

"Eric Greenwell" wrote in message
news:Ngc3h.1954$qJ6.1740@trndny07...
Roger wrote:
S mode gives you traffic and is wonderful if you fly where there is
other transpoder equiped aircraft. It has been very useful to me in
general aviation.

Can you tell us what additional equipment it takes to get the traffic,
how the traffic is displayed, and where the traffic information is
available? For example, I think I read in the AOPA newsletter that the
traffic info was being cut back in a number of places, and was mainly
available near large cities, but I've never used the system.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA
Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly

"Transponders in Sailplanes" on the Soaring Safety Foundation website
www.soaringsafety.org/prevention/articles.html

"A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation" at www.motorglider.org

BT wrote:
US military fighter type aircraft do not currently have TCAS
Do not rely on TCAS to keep you safe

This is correct. However, there is no doubt a TCAS will keep you safeR!
But then again, you must have a transponder to be see on their screen.
It's an overkill on a 2-33 going around the pattern all day long, but
certainly not in a modern glider within 30 miles of a class B or C
airspace.

I fly for the same company involved in the mid-air. Trust me, at the
speed we fly, gliders are hard to see. Heck, even thermalling in a
glider, other gliders can be hard to spot!

Richard
Phoenix AZ

On Nov 4, 9:43 pm, Eric Greenwell wrote:
wrote:
On Nov 4, 5:32 pm, "Tom N." wrote:
Any opinions? I plan to install a new Becker transponder in my ASW-28.
Should I go with the old mode C unit or pay extra for the new mode S
unit? Thanks.

The new Becker mode S unit is about the same price as the old A/C.
Its 2,064 Euros (plus $200 for an ACK-30 encode).
This is what I got for my Antares 20E... See:
http://www.becker-avionics.com/files...01).pdfSeveral stores offer the mode C Becker for less than $2000 US dollars,
so you might want to check around if price is important; otherwise, it
is more desirable.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA
Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly

"Transponders in Sailplanes" on the Soaring Safety Foundation website
www.soaringsafety.org/prevention/articles.html

"A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation" atwww.motorglider.org

Right, its the list price above for the Becker...

"jeplane" wrote in message
ups.com...
BT wrote:
US military fighter type aircraft do not currently have TCAS
Do not rely on TCAS to keep you safe

This is correct. However, there is no doubt a TCAS will keep you safeR!
But then again, you must have a transponder to be see on their screen.
It's an overkill on a 2-33 going around the pattern all day long, but
certainly not in a modern glider within 30 miles of a class B or C
airspace.

I fly for the same company involved in the mid-air. Trust me, at the
speed we fly, gliders are hard to see. Heck, even thermalling in a
glider, other gliders can be hard to spot!

Richard
Phoenix AZ


I will agree on the safeR part.. but only from part of the variety of
aircraft flying.
Gliders are hard to see.. so are T-38s coming at you nose on. T-38s don't
have TCAS.

Would it have made a difference if it was a Cessna Single Engine at cruise
altitude instead of a glider? Probabily not.. there still may have been an
accident.. granted the Cessna Single would more likely have a transponder,
so the BIZ Jet would have gotten a TCAS return.. but that Cessna with no TIS
display would never have gotten a return on the Jet or the Glider.

I do fly 2-33s inside the Mode C Veil and up to 12K MSL in summer.. and
other gliders much higher. Not just around the traffic pattern. The 2-33,
Grob 103 and LS-4 all show up on approach radar with no transponder.
Center's tend to filter non transponder returns to reduce clutter.

BT

BT wrote:
"jeplane" wrote in message
ups.com...
BT wrote:
US military fighter type aircraft do not currently have TCAS
Do not rely on TCAS to keep you safe
This is correct. However, there is no doubt a TCAS will keep you safeR!
But then again, you must have a transponder to be see on their screen.
It's an overkill on a 2-33 going around the pattern all day long, but
certainly not in a modern glider within 30 miles of a class B or C
airspace.

I fly for the same company involved in the mid-air. Trust me, at the
speed we fly, gliders are hard to see. Heck, even thermalling in a
glider, other gliders can be hard to spot!

Richard
Phoenix AZ


I will agree on the safeR part.. but only from part of the variety of
aircraft flying.
Gliders are hard to see.. so are T-38s coming at you nose on. T-38s don't
have TCAS.

Are the T-38s in contact with a radar facility that will inform it of a
transponder or even primary target? Do they have equipment that will
detect a transponder signal, even though they aren't using TCAS?

I ask because I've heard a number of times, from people that seem like
they ought to know, that fighters don't have any trouble detecting
another aircraft, unless they are near the ground. The aircraft/fighter
collisions I can remember all took place near the ground, like Chip
Garner's glider, and a crop duster here in Washington state.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA
Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly

"Transponders in Sailplanes" on the Soaring Safety Foundation website
www.soaringsafety.org/prevention/articles.html

"A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation" at www.motorglider.org