SAFETY TOOLS IN OUR COCKPIT

I am interested in knowing how other pilots feel about the
preferred sequence of implementation of safety tools in our
cockpits, under latter flight stress, for: a field landing, a
tree landing, or a water landing.

The scenario is: no crew, flight over inhospitable terrain
resulting in a likely crash, unknown cell phone coverage and
no other gliders in the air.

The location is: Eastern flatlands or Western mountains.

The TOOLS a Radio (121.5), SPOT (911), ELT (armed on panel),
PLB (on parachute harness).

Thanks,

Doug Whitehead

On Oct 16, 11:53*am, wrote:
I *am *interested *in *knowing *how *other *pilots *feel *about *the
preferred *sequence *of *implementation *of *safety *tools *in *our
cockpits, under *latter *flight *stress, *for: *a *field *landing, *a
tree *landing, *or *a *water *landing.

The *scenario *is: *no *crew, *flight *over *inhospitable *terrain
resulting *in *a *likely *crash, *unknown *cell *phone *coverage *and
no *other *gliders *in the *air.

The *location *is: *Eastern flatlands *or *Western *mountains..

The *TOOLS *a Radio (121.5), SPOT (911), *ELT (armed *on *panel),
PLB (on *parachute *harness).

Thanks,

Doug *Whitehead

What is the point of this rather tortured question?

First I would not fly over inhospitable terrain where things are
"likely to result in a crash". I assume that is not exactly what was
implied.

Second the question is creating a bit of a false paradox. If you are
in a distress situation you will use whatever tools you have. Like you
are not seriously considering wether to carry a VHF radio or not
right? Some things like a PLB or ELT give no way of signalling
anything besides a critical situation. Radio and SPOT or a cellphone
(if you get lucky) or even a sat phone (largish and a bit pricey, but
maybe not outrageous ~$2k + subscription if you really fly a lot in
inhospitable areas). Iridium is the only sat phone with good USA
coverage and the handsets/antennas are really too large to use in the
air unless you install an external antenna, so normally they would be
used post-landout or crash.

If you are flying anywhere XC you really ought to be carrying a radio.
Anybody want to argue against that? If you crash and are not
incapacitated and the radio, battery, tail/antenna is not damaged then
use it. You can use it to raise an alarm or try to get help, before
you crash or get further in trouble. Carry a handheld as well, the
range may not be great but they are handy for talking to search
aircraft, etc. Many of us own handheld radios already for use around
the airport etc. Handy for talking to search aircraft if say your tail/
antenna is broken. Carry an adapter cable from the ships' battery to
the VHF handheld.

Discussing an "ELT" is a waste of time, you need to be clear if you
mean a 121.5MHz ELT or a 406 MHz ELT (which all also transmit a
121.5MHz homing signal). Since SARAST/COSPAS monitoring of 121.5MHz
ELTs is going away on Feburary 2009 I think they are of very limited
value and would not consider one. Local SAR organizations will still
be able to home on the signal but without the SARSAT alerting and
initial doppler fix their utility is greatly reduced). A 121.5MHz
beacon signal by itself may not initiate a search unless somebody
reports you overdue (there are a large number of false 121.5Mhz beacon
transmissions) SAR folks might want to weigh in on their local
policies about this.

And sadly based on GA aircraft stats, in the event of a crash the ELT
impact activation is likely to *not* work. I'd be very surprised say
if a well controlled water landing would activate an ELT. However if
the arm/on switch is on the panel you can manually trip these before
the impact. Especially with a 406 MHz ELT this will at least get a
message out that you are in distress (via the unique encoded 406 MHz
ID) even if the satellites can't doppler locate the fix before the ELT
signal dissapears. Most PLB antennas are unweildy and I don't fancy my
chances of trying to fly a glider in a distress situation, unpack the
PLB and deploy at he antenna in the cockpit (although the latest ACR
PLBs have an antenna that is easy to deply). Since I fly with a SPOT
mounted in the cockpit I could instead just activate the "911" feature
while in flight, and leave the PLB on my parachute harness for later
use.

Another problem with all ELTs is getting the antenna in a good
position where the antenna has a good sky view., not near conducting
components and has a suitable ground plane. Many of the ELT antenna
installations I've seen in gliders are awful and would likely produce
a radiated signal worse than a PLB placed on the ground.

Also no currently affordable 406MHz ELTs that you would install in a
glider includes a GPS for transmitting very accurate position data,
SARSAT/COSPAS can doppler locate the ELT but that takes more time
(multipl passes of the LEOSAR satellites) and has less accuracy than
just having the GPS location transmitted by the PLB or ELT. Lower cost
ELTs with GPS or external GPS inputs are coming.

So for all the above reasons, and more, I would choose a 406 MHz PLB
over an ELT (especially a 121.5MHz ELT). They cost a lot less than
current 406 MHz ELTs, and they can travel with you on the parachute
harness. PLBs with GPS don't cost much more than those without, so I'd
only look at the GPS enabled ones.

The ELT has the advantage that if you are lucky it might activate on
impact. If things are that bad that I could not trigger the PLB then
I'm more likely dead. Helping SAR find a fatal crash is good goal but
not top of my list. ELTs may also have advantages in battery life and
radiated RF power, but I suspect for gliders the antenna issues
usually mitigate the radiate power and the latest PLBs offer
impressive transmit times. For power-aircraft where ELT and antenna
installation is usually a lot easier I would look at the ELT option
(and I disagree with AOPA on not requiring mandatory 406MHz ELT
carriage in power aircraft).

For me the best use of the SPOT messenger in SPOTcast (tracking) mode.
Mounted up in the glareshield or canopy rail where it has very good
view of the sky. The tracking locations give people an indication of
where you currently are (as long as they have Internet access) or
about where you last were if you crash. Obviously if the SPOT
messenger works post-crash then people will know where you are (as
long as somebody knows to expect you and where to look to find your
SPOT info), even if you are incapacitated. If the SPOT messenger no
longer can transmit its tracking messages and you can't move it/
activate it's "911" feature then at least there is still an area
around the last reported position to start a search. BTW there are
lots of ways to model this but the 10 minute tracking locations give a
location uncertainty about the same as the current SARSAT doppler
location of a 121.5MHz ELT. (~10+ mile radius) And a great way to
focus initial SAR search locations.

Since I want the SPOT mounted on the glider where it has a good sky
view I also have a PLB on my parachute harness in case of bail out. I
also like how with the whole SARSAT/COSPAS works and works with SAR
organizatiosn etc. and feel more comfortable about this in a real life
and death situation than the "we'll call the local 911 telephone
operator" that the SPOT "911" service offers. I also like the idea of
carrying two separate SAR alerting devices.

The question sounded bleak, with scenarios of tree landings and
inhospitable areas. If so then the cost of a SPOT Messenger and/or a
PLB seems low compared to the risks. Both can also be used for other
activities, hiking, hunting, flying GA aircraft etc.

A lot of survival depends on organization and not just relying on
toys. So have you told people where you expect to fly to and what you
want them to do if you are late/missing? Do you check in with the FBO
or other glider pilots by radio, and make blind radio status reports
even if you don't know others are listening, etc. Have you left
information on what emergency equipment you carry, registered the
406MHz ELT or PLB with NOAA and provided current emergency contact
info, do the right people have access to your SPOT account? Have you
create a shared/public SPOT page, etc., etc.


Darryl

On Oct 16, 1:44*pm, Darryl Ramm wrote:

lots of good info..

Thanks for taking the time to write that all up, but it makes me
wonder now how we ever flew cross country without all this stuff.
When I started all I had was a 360 channel radio and money for a pay
phone if I was lucky enough to land anywhere near one. In my
emergency kit I carried (and still do) a whistle, flashlight, hiking
compass, warm shirt, and a space blanket.

After I had hiked out of one field and just missed my crew as she
drove past, not to see her again for another 2 hours, I started
carrying a handheld radio

In those days a call to another pilot to let them know you were low,
and where, was one of the best protections. I think it still is.
Don't forget to make the OK call as you climb out of the hole, or land
safe, though.

Andy

Doug,
One positive change that came from 9/11 is that airliners now
monitor 121.5. Daryl gave a pretty thorough rundown on your "toolkit",
so lets talk about one of the most basic. If you survive your
outlanding or crash, there are few places in the US that an airliner
won't be within line-of-sight at some time. If your glider radio was
destroyed, hopefully you have a handheld. Transmitting on 121.5 could
be a very good resource.
Frankly, I have never heard of a sailplane gone missing that wasn't
found quickly, as contrasted with WW2 wrecks that are stumbled onto.
Realistically, someone heard you, saw you, or knew of your intentions.
Of course, if you routinely drive to the gliderport, rig, and takeoff
for a straight-out without saying a word to a soul, you are putting
yourself more at risk.
Give someone a rough idea of your plan before you depart, make
position reports on glider frequency, and keep your batteries charged!

Good luck.

Dean Chantiles "GO"

"First I would not fly over inhospitable terrain where things are
"likely to result in a crash". I assume that is not exactly what was
implied."
Think about the above statement made.Most of us flying in the west ARE
flying over inhospitable terrain on cross country, unless of course one just
flies around local gliderports, and even than there could be plenty of real
estate, where one may be not found for a while.(Steve Fosset for instance
was not that far from civilization, as the bird flies when he was find).
Being prepared is not a bad idea.
I think the purpose of Doug's exercise, is to bring out ideas others may
use, which he or someone else may adopt.
An example; I once landed on a rather sloped runway , (uphill of course) and
failing to turn the glider perpendicular to the runway just before my roll
out stopped, I had one heck of a time climbing out of the ship without it
wanting to roll backwards. I now carry an "S" hook with me, which I can use
to hook to the shoulder harness and to the spoiler handle/brake. I never
had to use this contraption since, but I am sure it will work next time
needed. So I carry it. One may or may not wants to adopt one's idea, but it
does not hurt to share.
Just my five cents worth. PeterK

"Darryl Ramm" wrote in message
...
On Oct 16, 11:53 am, wrote:
I am interested in knowing how other pilots feel about the
preferred sequence of implementation of safety tools in our
cockpits, under latter flight stress, for: a field landing, a
tree landing, or a water landing.

The scenario is: no crew, flight over inhospitable terrain
resulting in a likely crash, unknown cell phone coverage and
no other gliders in the air.

The location is: Eastern flatlands or Western mountains.

The TOOLS a Radio (121.5), SPOT (911), ELT (armed on panel),
PLB (on parachute harness).

Thanks,

Doug Whitehead

What is the point of this rather tortured question?

First I would not fly over inhospitable terrain where things are
"likely to result in a crash". I assume that is not exactly what was
implied.

Second the question is creating a bit of a false paradox. If you are
in a distress situation you will use whatever tools you have. Like you
are not seriously considering wether to carry a VHF radio or not
right? Some things like a PLB or ELT give no way of signalling
anything besides a critical situation. Radio and SPOT or a cellphone
(if you get lucky) or even a sat phone (largish and a bit pricey, but
maybe not outrageous ~$2k + subscription if you really fly a lot in
inhospitable areas). Iridium is the only sat phone with good USA
coverage and the handsets/antennas are really too large to use in the
air unless you install an external antenna, so normally they would be
used post-landout or crash.

If you are flying anywhere XC you really ought to be carrying a radio.
Anybody want to argue against that? If you crash and are not
incapacitated and the radio, battery, tail/antenna is not damaged then
use it. You can use it to raise an alarm or try to get help, before
you crash or get further in trouble. Carry a handheld as well, the
range may not be great but they are handy for talking to search
aircraft, etc. Many of us own handheld radios already for use around
the airport etc. Handy for talking to search aircraft if say your tail/
antenna is broken. Carry an adapter cable from the ships' battery to
the VHF handheld.

Discussing an "ELT" is a waste of time, you need to be clear if you
mean a 121.5MHz ELT or a 406 MHz ELT (which all also transmit a
121.5MHz homing signal). Since SARAST/COSPAS monitoring of 121.5MHz
ELTs is going away on Feburary 2009 I think they are of very limited
value and would not consider one. Local SAR organizations will still
be able to home on the signal but without the SARSAT alerting and
initial doppler fix their utility is greatly reduced). A 121.5MHz
beacon signal by itself may not initiate a search unless somebody
reports you overdue (there are a large number of false 121.5Mhz beacon
transmissions) SAR folks might want to weigh in on their local
policies about this.

And sadly based on GA aircraft stats, in the event of a crash the ELT
impact activation is likely to *not* work. I'd be very surprised say
if a well controlled water landing would activate an ELT. However if
the arm/on switch is on the panel you can manually trip these before
the impact. Especially with a 406 MHz ELT this will at least get a
message out that you are in distress (via the unique encoded 406 MHz
ID) even if the satellites can't doppler locate the fix before the ELT
signal dissapears. Most PLB antennas are unweildy and I don't fancy my
chances of trying to fly a glider in a distress situation, unpack the
PLB and deploy at he antenna in the cockpit (although the latest ACR
PLBs have an antenna that is easy to deply). Since I fly with a SPOT
mounted in the cockpit I could instead just activate the "911" feature
while in flight, and leave the PLB on my parachute harness for later
use.

Another problem with all ELTs is getting the antenna in a good
position where the antenna has a good sky view., not near conducting
components and has a suitable ground plane. Many of the ELT antenna
installations I've seen in gliders are awful and would likely produce
a radiated signal worse than a PLB placed on the ground.

Also no currently affordable 406MHz ELTs that you would install in a
glider includes a GPS for transmitting very accurate position data,
SARSAT/COSPAS can doppler locate the ELT but that takes more time
(multipl passes of the LEOSAR satellites) and has less accuracy than
just having the GPS location transmitted by the PLB or ELT. Lower cost
ELTs with GPS or external GPS inputs are coming.

So for all the above reasons, and more, I would choose a 406 MHz PLB
over an ELT (especially a 121.5MHz ELT). They cost a lot less than
current 406 MHz ELTs, and they can travel with you on the parachute
harness. PLBs with GPS don't cost much more than those without, so I'd
only look at the GPS enabled ones.

The ELT has the advantage that if you are lucky it might activate on
impact. If things are that bad that I could not trigger the PLB then
I'm more likely dead. Helping SAR find a fatal crash is good goal but
not top of my list. ELTs may also have advantages in battery life and
radiated RF power, but I suspect for gliders the antenna issues
usually mitigate the radiate power and the latest PLBs offer
impressive transmit times. For power-aircraft where ELT and antenna
installation is usually a lot easier I would look at the ELT option
(and I disagree with AOPA on not requiring mandatory 406MHz ELT
carriage in power aircraft).

For me the best use of the SPOT messenger in SPOTcast (tracking) mode.
Mounted up in the glareshield or canopy rail where it has very good
view of the sky. The tracking locations give people an indication of
where you currently are (as long as they have Internet access) or
about where you last were if you crash. Obviously if the SPOT
messenger works post-crash then people will know where you are (as
long as somebody knows to expect you and where to look to find your
SPOT info), even if you are incapacitated. If the SPOT messenger no
longer can transmit its tracking messages and you can't move it/
activate it's "911" feature then at least there is still an area
around the last reported position to start a search. BTW there are
lots of ways to model this but the 10 minute tracking locations give a
location uncertainty about the same as the current SARSAT doppler
location of a 121.5MHz ELT. (~10+ mile radius) And a great way to
focus initial SAR search locations.

Since I want the SPOT mounted on the glider where it has a good sky
view I also have a PLB on my parachute harness in case of bail out. I
also like how with the whole SARSAT/COSPAS works and works with SAR
organizatiosn etc. and feel more comfortable about this in a real life
and death situation than the "we'll call the local 911 telephone
operator" that the SPOT "911" service offers. I also like the idea of
carrying two separate SAR alerting devices.

The question sounded bleak, with scenarios of tree landings and
inhospitable areas. If so then the cost of a SPOT Messenger and/or a
PLB seems low compared to the risks. Both can also be used for other
activities, hiking, hunting, flying GA aircraft etc.

A lot of survival depends on organization and not just relying on
toys. So have you told people where you expect to fly to and what you
want them to do if you are late/missing? Do you check in with the FBO
or other glider pilots by radio, and make blind radio status reports
even if you don't know others are listening, etc. Have you left
information on what emergency equipment you carry, registered the
406MHz ELT or PLB with NOAA and provided current emergency contact
info, do the right people have access to your SPOT account? Have you
create a shared/public SPOT page, etc., etc.


Darryl

On Oct 16, 7:36*pm, "Peter" wrote:
"First I would not fly over inhospitable terrain where things are
"likely to result in a crash". I assume that is not exactly what was
implied."
Think about the above statement made.Most of us flying in the west ARE
flying over inhospitable terrain on cross country, unless of course one just
flies around local gliderports, and even than there could be plenty of real
estate, where one may be not found for a while.(Steve Fosset for instance
was not that far from civilization, as the bird flies when he was find).
Being prepared is not a bad idea.
I think the purpose of Doug's exercise, is to bring out ideas others may
use, which he or someone else *may adopt.
An example; I once landed on a rather sloped runway , (uphill of course) and
failing to turn the glider *perpendicular to the runway just before my roll
out stopped, I had one heck of a time climbing out of the ship without it
wanting to roll backwards. I now carry an "S" hook with me, which I can use
to *hook to the shoulder harness and to the *spoiler handle/brake. I never
had to use this contraption since, but I am sure it will work next time
needed. So I carry it. One may or may not wants to adopt one's idea, but it
does not hurt to share.
Just my five cents worth. PeterK

"Darryl Ramm" wrote in message

...
On Oct 16, 11:53 am, wrote:



I am interested in knowing how other pilots feel about the
preferred sequence of implementation of safety tools in our
cockpits, under latter flight stress, for: a field landing, a
tree landing, or a water landing.

The scenario is: no crew, flight over inhospitable terrain
resulting in a likely crash, unknown cell phone coverage and
no other gliders in the air.

The location is: Eastern flatlands or Western mountains.

The TOOLS a Radio (121.5), SPOT (911), ELT (armed on panel),
PLB (on parachute harness).

Thanks,

Doug Whitehead

What is the point of this rather tortured question?

First I would not fly over inhospitable terrain where things are
"likely to result in a crash". I assume that is not exactly what was
implied.

Second the question is creating a bit of a false paradox. If you are
in a distress situation you will use whatever tools you have. Like you
are not seriously considering wether to carry a VHF radio or not
right? Some things like a PLB or ELT give no way of signalling
anything besides a critical situation. Radio and SPOT or a cellphone
(if you get lucky) or even a sat phone (largish and a bit pricey, but
maybe not outrageous ~$2k + subscription if you really fly a lot in
inhospitable areas). Iridium is the only sat phone with good USA
coverage and the handsets/antennas are really too large to use in the
air unless you install an external antenna, so normally they would be
used post-landout or crash.

If you are flying anywhere XC you really ought to be carrying a radio.
Anybody want to argue against that? If you crash and are not
incapacitated and the radio, battery, tail/antenna is not damaged then
use it. You can use it to raise an alarm or try to get help, before
you crash or get further in trouble. *Carry a handheld as well, the
range may not be great but they are handy for talking to search
aircraft, etc. *Many of us own handheld radios already for use around
the airport etc. Handy for talking to search aircraft if say your tail/
antenna is broken. Carry an adapter cable from the ships' battery to
the VHF handheld.

Discussing an "ELT" is a waste of time, you need to be clear if you
mean a 121.5MHz ELT or a 406 MHz ELT (which all also transmit a
121.5MHz homing signal). Since SARAST/COSPAS monitoring of 121.5MHz
ELTs is going away on Feburary 2009 I think they are of very limited
value and would not consider one. Local SAR organizations will still
be able to home on the signal but without the SARSAT alerting and
initial doppler fix their utility is greatly reduced). A 121.5MHz
beacon signal by itself may not initiate a search unless somebody
reports you overdue (there are a large number of false 121.5Mhz beacon
transmissions) SAR folks might want to weigh in on their local
policies about this.

And sadly based on GA aircraft stats, in the event of a crash the ELT
impact activation is likely to *not* work. I'd be very surprised say
if a well controlled water landing would activate an ELT. However if
the arm/on switch is on the panel you can manually trip these before
the impact. Especially with a 406 MHz ELT this will at least get a
message out that you are in distress (via the unique encoded 406 MHz
ID) even if the satellites can't doppler locate the fix before the ELT
signal dissapears. Most PLB antennas are unweildy and I don't fancy my
chances of trying to fly a glider in a distress situation, unpack the
PLB and deploy at he antenna in the cockpit (although the latest ACR
PLBs have an antenna that is easy to deply). Since I fly with a SPOT
mounted in the cockpit I could instead just activate the "911" feature
while in flight, and leave the PLB on my parachute harness for later
use.

Another problem with all ELTs is getting the antenna in a good
position where the antenna has a good sky view., not near conducting
components and has a suitable ground plane. Many of the ELT antenna
installations I've seen in gliders are awful and would likely produce
a radiated signal worse than a PLB placed on the ground.

Also no currently affordable 406MHz ELTs that you would install in a
glider includes a GPS for transmitting very accurate position data,
SARSAT/COSPAS can doppler locate the ELT but that takes more time
(multipl passes of the LEOSAR satellites) and has less accuracy than
just having the GPS location transmitted by the PLB or ELT. Lower cost
ELTs with GPS or external GPS inputs are coming.

So for all the above reasons, and more, *I would choose a 406 MHz PLB
over an ELT (especially a 121.5MHz ELT). They cost a lot less than
current 406 MHz ELTs, and they can travel with you on the parachute
harness. PLBs with GPS don't cost much more than those without, so I'd
only look at the GPS enabled ones.

The ELT has the advantage that if you are lucky it might activate on
impact. If things are that bad that I could not trigger the PLB then
I'm more likely dead. Helping SAR find a fatal crash is good goal but
not top of my list. ELTs may also have advantages in battery life and
radiated RF power, but I suspect for gliders the antenna issues
usually mitigate the radiate power and the latest PLBs offer
impressive transmit times. For power-aircraft where ELT and antenna
installation is usually a lot easier I would look at the ELT option
(and I disagree with AOPA on not requiring mandatory 406MHz ELT
carriage in power aircraft).

For me the best use of the SPOT messenger in SPOTcast (tracking) mode.
Mounted up in the glareshield or canopy rail where it has very good
view of the sky. The tracking locations give people an indication of
where you currently are (as long as they have Internet access) or
about where you last were if you crash. Obviously if the SPOT
messenger works post-crash then people will know where you are (as
long as somebody knows to expect you and where to look to find your
SPOT info), even if you are incapacitated. If the SPOT messenger no
longer can transmit its tracking messages and you can't move it/
activate it's "911" feature then at least there is still an area
around the last reported position to start a search. BTW there are
lots of ways to model this but the 10 minute tracking locations give a
location uncertainty about the same as the current SARSAT doppler
location of a 121.5MHz ELT. (~10+ mile radius) *And a great way to
focus initial SAR search locations.

Since I want the SPOT mounted on the glider where it has a good sky
view I also have a PLB on my parachute harness in case of bail out. I
also like how with the whole SARSAT/COSPAS works and *works with SAR
organizatiosn etc. and feel more comfortable about this in a real life
and death situation than the "we'll call the local 911 telephone
operator" that the SPOT "911" service offers. I also like the idea of
carrying two separate SAR alerting devices.

The question sounded bleak, with scenarios of tree landings and
inhospitable areas. If so then the cost of a SPOT Messenger and/or a
PLB seems low compared to the risks. Both can also be used for other
activities, hiking, hunting, flying GA aircraft etc.

A lot of survival depends on organization and not just relying on
toys. So have you told people where you expect to fly to and what you
want them to do if you are late/missing? Do you check in with the FBO
or other glider pilots by radio, and make blind radio status reports
even if you don't know others are listening, etc. Have you left
information on what emergency equipment you carry, registered the
406MHz ELT or PLB with NOAA and provided current emergency contact
info, do the right people have access to your SPOT account? Have you
create a shared/public SPOT page, etc., etc.

Darryl

It was just a (obvious?) pedantic point on my part. Hopefully we all
are doing some thinking about risks nut if you think you are doing
stuff likely to lead to a crash then something is wrong (unless you
are deliberately suicidal).

I might be flying over the top of some very inhospitable terrain but I
want glide out options, with good margins (depending on risks/
conditions) to safe land-out options. If I'm low on a ridge etc. I
want somewhere to fall off safely, etc. I fly a motorglider... and I
never want to rely on the motor starting. However I do want to
consider what might happen in the very unlikely case that I end up
stuck in that inhospitable terrain.

I also do not want to be too complacent that I'll be found easily if
something goes bad. We lost a very experienced glider pilot in a fatal
crash on the White Mountains within the last few years and the crash
site was found after a few days thanks to hard work by fellow glider
pilots. It could have been longer. Radio position and intention
reports made by the pilot helped the search. For me it is easy to
imagine horrible scenarios where an injured pilots who are not found
until it is too late, and between the extreme conditions say in the
mountains or desert an injured pilot may not last long.

The key to survival does not start with the tools/toys, it starts with
thinking, risk analysis and planning around survival scenarios, and
folding in how the toys help.

Another pedantic comment is I would rather call the items mentioned
signalling devices than survival devices/tools. That helps break down
the big picture. A good starting point for survival and rescue
planning after looking at the risks is breaking down and analyzing
what you need in categories like signalling, shelter, hydration, food
and protection. What's group is more important and what you need in
each group etc. depends on the risk and scenario analysis, your budget
and how much space you have to carry stuff. I recommend reading some
good books on mountain and/or desert survival for ideas. e.g. see a
list of books at http://www.equipped.org/books.htm and also trying to
find out as much as you can about how equipment like SPOT and PLBs
etc. really work. I see lots of folks buying toys but do not really
understanding how they work. (Lets see where to start... I wear my
SPOT messenger on my parachute harness but why are there gaps in the
tracking data? How long will your PLB transmit for? (at what
temperatures?) Does your PLB shut down the either the 121.5 MHz or 406
MHz signal after a while to save power? What signal will the search
aircraft likely be looking for? If you think a PLB from another pilot
might have been activated what can you do? Does it continuously
resample the GPS coordinates or if you move it how quickly will it
update the GPS location it is transmitting? Will the SPOT messenger
transmit just the ID without location if it can't get a GPS signal?
How do you tell if the SPOT messenger has successfully sent a distress
signal? How do you tell if the SPOT has a GPS signal? How long will
the SPOT batteries last in "911" mode?...).

What I don't get is the pilot's we all see getting into their gliders
in a T-shirt and shorts and a bottle of water and not much else, and
nobody having a clue where they are heading, and flying for hundreds
of km over mountains and high desert etc. Just one little incident
away from a major problem.

Darryl

On 16 Oct, 19:53, wrote:

The TOOLS a Radio (121.5), SPOT (911), ELT (armed on panel),
PLB (on parachute harness).

At my club we all carry pyrotechnic mini-flares as well.

Ian

On Oct 17, 3:39*am, Ian wrote:
On 16 Oct, 19:53, wrote:

The *TOOLS *a Radio (121.5), SPOT (911), *ELT (armed *on *panel),
PLB (on *parachute *harness).

At my club we all carry pyrotechnic mini-flares as well.

Ian


Ian, where I fly in the USA I'd be very hesitant to use a rocket flare
because of fire dangers. And personally, although good flares are
carefully designed, I just don't like the idea of carrying
pryotechnics in a motorglider carrying lots of fuel - there is enough
stuff there already to go wrong.

In the UK rocket or smoke flares may make more sense but I think SPOT
is a pretty amazing device for clubs that have internet access and can
use real-time tracking (aka SPOTcasting) to track glider locations.
Williams Soaring Center where I often fly from has SPOT messengers for
their rental fleet and many of the private owners there are now flying
with their own SPOT messengers. The operations staff track the SPOT
locations during the day and the "help" signal is used to request
landout retrieves - in addition the the standard VHF radio/radio
relays. The issue with SPOT in a club situation is the device user
interface is not obvious and people need to understand how to get into
SPOTcast mode etc. A good thing to do is to have the club operations
staff confirm they are receiving a SPOTcast signal before or soon
after the glider takes off, just make it a standard thing to to. And
there needs to be some standardization of what OK/help messages mean.

So just thinking about the signal category of survival equipment here
is a list of what I carry. Shelter, hydration, food, navigation,
medical/first-aid and protection are separate categories to think
about, although there are overlaps. (and remember it's really about
preparation and planning and your own personal need, not just lists of
toys)...

On person/cargo pants pockets
- cell phone
- printed telephone numbers/contact list (don't rely on the list in
the cell phone)
- telephone calling card
- cash and credit cards

On parachute harness in an Allen Silver SMAK pack or in pockets sewn
in the sheepskin pad
- 406MHz PLB with GPS, current battery, registered with NOAA with up
to date info including glider registration, FBO phone numbers, etc.
- parachute canopy (spread out, a great orange/white high visibility
target)
- signal mirror (retroreflective aiming type, low cost and much
better than trying to use a CD etc.)
- whistle and lanyard
- mini-flint firestarter and tinder (fire danger!)
- aluminized mylar survival blanket (shiny side out may make s high
visibility target).


In glider
- VHF radio
- Sectional charts/Garmin GPS/flight computers etc. with database of
VHF radio frequencies
- SPOT Messenger, with up to date contact info and a shared SPOT page
and trusted people with full access to my account.
- Handheld VHF radio with NiMh rechargeable battery pack
- Xenon strobe signal light
- Spare battery pack for VHF radio with AA style battery pack and
LiFeS2 batteries
- Spare LiFeS2 batteries for SPOT and VHF handheld (Energizer Lithium
non-rechargable, long shelf life, work at very low temperatures and
huge power capacity)
- Adapter cables for cell phone and VHF radio to power from the ships
batteries
- high intensity LED "tactical style flashlight (great for signaling
but also get one with multiple light levels so you don't blind
yourself at night).
- Spare CR132 Lithium batteries for tactical flashlight
- Additional aluminized mylar survival blankets (shiny side out may
make s high visibility target).
- Avgas, engine oil, paper rags, foam seat cushions etc. (I usually
fly a motorglider) suitable for starting a signal fire if safe to do
so - but as already mentioned I'd be very hesitant to do so given
where I fly)

Other signal related things to consider carrying...
- Iridum sat phone (in USA, other choices overseas) with spare
batteries, cables etc.
- A dedicated emergency cell phone with better coverage (e.g. if you
daily use an AT&T GSM iPhone like me you may want a cell phone with
better coverage for where you fly (e.g. Verizon CDMA)).
- A laser signal flare. These are getting very impressive and good
ones are daylight visible but expensive $200+ (e.g.
https://www.greatlandlaser.com/index.php?productID=162).
- Survival booklet with information on ground/air signals etc.
- For two seat glider carry two of all personal signal items, e.g.
signal mirrors, whistles, etc. preferably on each person/parachute.