Tow cars and trailers

Your diatribe reminded me of a line from a long forgotten
movie from the '70's called 'Rancho Deluxe'. I clipped
the quote below from a review of that movie. Oversized
SUV's rate right up there with Coca-Cola and MacDonalds
as proof what clever marketing combined with US tastes
can produce And I happen to drive a F150-great
tow vehicle, lousy gas mileage.


'I've seen more of this state's poor cowboys, miners,
railroaders and Indians go broke buyin' pickup trucks.
The poor people of this state are dope fiends for pickup
trucks. As soon's they get ten cents ahead they trade
in on a new pickup truck. The families, homesteads,
schools, hospitals and happiness of Montana have been
sold down the river to buy pickup trucks!... And there's
a sickness here worse than alcohol and dope. It is
the pickup truck death! And there's no cure in sight.'


Conversely, I cannot understand why people would want
to drive something the size of a Tahoe, or Suburban
or whatever on a daily basis. Most of these are simply
marketing exercises to improve profits. Cheap, relatively
unsophisticated light truck design. Add massive body
(to cart sprung bendy chassis) - way up
high so the CG gets even worse, and market it as a
lifestyle. Give it slab sides to look macho - Very
good for profits, even if the roll over accident rate
soars...

Stewart Kissel wrote:
Your diatribe reminded me of a line from a long forgotten
movie from the '70's called 'Rancho Deluxe'. I clipped
the quote below from a review of that movie. Oversized
SUV's rate right up there with Coca-Cola and MacDonalds
as proof what clever marketing combined with US tastes
can produce And I happen to drive a F150-great
tow vehicle, lousy gas mileage.


'I've seen more of this state's poor cowboys, miners,
railroaders and Indians go broke buyin' pickup trucks.
The poor people of this state are dope fiends for pickup
trucks. As soon's they get ten cents ahead they trade
in on a new pickup truck. The families, homesteads,
schools, hospitals and happiness of Montana have been
sold down the river to buy pickup trucks!... And there's
a sickness here worse than alcohol and dope. It is
the pickup truck death! And there's no cure in sight.'



Conversely, I cannot understand why people would want
to drive something the size of a Tahoe, or Suburban
or whatever on a daily basis. Most of these are simply
marketing exercises to improve profits. Cheap, relatively

unsophisticated light truck design. Add massive body

(to cart sprung bendy chassis) - way up
high so the CG gets even worse, and market it as a
lifestyle. Give it slab sides to look macho - Very
good for profits, even if the roll over accident rate
soars...




Was that a diatribe? - Blush

On May 19, 2:06 pm, Stewart Kissel
wrote:
Your diatribe reminded me of a line from a long forgotten
movie from the '70's called 'Rancho Deluxe'. I clipped
the quote below from a review of that movie. Oversized
SUV's rate right up there with Coca-Cola and MacDonalds
as proof what clever marketing combined with US tastes
can produce And I happen to drive a F150-great
tow vehicle, lousy gas mileage.

'I've seen more of this state's poor cowboys, miners,
railroaders and Indians go broke buyin' pickup trucks.
The poor people of this state are dope fiends for pickup
trucks. As soon's they get ten cents ahead they trade
in on a new pickup truck. The families, homesteads,
schools, hospitals and happiness of Montana have been
sold down the river to buy pickup trucks!... And there's
a sickness here worse than alcohol and dope. It is
the pickup truck death! And there's no cure in sight.'

Conversely, I cannot understand why people would want
to drive something the size of a Tahoe, or Suburban
or whatever on a daily basis. Most of these are simply
marketing exercises to improve profits. Cheap, relatively

unsophisticated light truck design. Add massive body



(to cart sprung bendy chassis) - way up
high so the CG gets even worse, and market it as a
lifestyle. Give it slab sides to look macho - Very
good for profits, even if the roll over accident rate
soars...- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I own a 2001 VW Eurovan camper. It has the Passat engine (6 cyl, 24
valve) and 16 " wheels. It tows like a dream
and gets near 20 mpg. They quit importing to the US in 2003 and now
are in high demand. I paid a little over
30k for mine. A year later for the exact same vehicle the price went
to 40k and now people are paying
up to 50k for a low mileage version of the 2001-2003 models.

It also doubles as a good around town vehicle (unlike most RVs) It
seats six and drives and parks like any
midsize car.

George

bikensoar wrote:
I own a 2001 VW Eurovan camper. It has the Passat engine (6 cyl, 24
valve) and 16 " wheels. It tows like a dream
and gets near 20 mpg. They quit importing to the US in 2003 and now
are in high demand. I paid a little over
30k for mine. A year later for the exact same vehicle the price went
to 40k and now people are paying
up to 50k for a low mileage version of the 2001-2003 models.

I've had a '97 Eurovan Camper for 10 years and 100,000 miles. It still
gets over 20 MPG on the highway, tows beautifully, and had no trouble
pulling our Duo over the steepest mountain passes in California, Nevada,
and Utah...

Marc

Americans consumes nearly 30 times as much energy as
Africans, 10 times as much as East Asians, 5 times
the world average.

So much for Americans giving up on their behemoths...I
clipped the following from today SanFranChron.


Gas prices don't scare buyers of big SUVs
After 2-year slump, demand rebounds

Michael Taylor, Chronicle Staff Writer

Sunday, May 20, 2007

In these days of nearly $4-a-gallon gasoline, a
three-ton SUV that practically requires a bank loan
to fill 'er up would seem to be a tough sell.

Americans, however, are not shunning these beasts.
Far from it. Auto industry figures show that after
a two-year slump, sales of the gas guzzlers are up
over 2006 -- in some cases, way up.

The numbers for large SUVs rose nearly 6 percent in
the first quarter of 2007, and the April figures were
up 25 percent from April 2006, according to automakers'
statistics provided by Edmunds.com, an automotive research
Web site.

The bigger the guzzler, the better the numbers. Sales
of GMC's Yukon XL were up a whopping 72 percent last
month, and the totals for its Chevrolet sister, the
Suburban, rose 38 percent. Topping off the tank on
either one can cost as much as $120.

It's a Class I hitch, with the 1-1/4' bar.

Sad story here. I just had the hitch replaced. Another
'School of Hard Knocks' diploma for my wall. I need
a larger wall.

The first hitch just about tore off the bottom of my
trunk. The hitch bolted to the central rear tie down
loop and also through the 'Oh Too Thin' sheet metal
of the bottom of the trunk. I recently found the bottom
of the trunk severely cracked with the spare tire about
to fall out. I think the damage was not from towing,
but from the times I was jacking up the front of the
trailer to release it from the hitch, but the connection
not releasing. So, I was just jacking up the rear
of the car and the front of the trailer. To get it
to release, I had to step on the draw bar (glad my
shoe is small enough to fit) and put a bit of weight
on it. I've since found keeping the ball and hitch
wiped clean before connecting allows them to separate
easily. Putting oil on the ball works, too, but attracts
dirt and then leaves this big ol' greasy spot on my
shin.

The trunk got welded up and a new style hitch installed.
This new hitch attaches to the same central tow loop
but instead of going into the thin (very, very thin)
sheet metal of the bottom of the trunk, the two arms
reach more forward where they can bolt into the 'frame
rails'. Holes already exist in the frame rails, so
no drilling was required for this hitch.

A couple of months ago, I also had a transmission oil
cooler added.

Neither the hitch nor the tranny cooler are supplied
by Honda.

I just returned from a 900 mile round trip of towing
the trailer to Cordele, Georgia and back. I haven't
noted a problem with the new hitch.

The only problem I have now after a week of flying
is that I'm back into the drudgery of work :-(

Ray


At 15:36 19 May 2007, Tuno wrote:
Ray, did you have trouble getting a classs III hitch
on your Accord?
(I assume the dealer wouldn't touch this?)

On May 21, 9:24 am, Ray Lovinggood
wrote:
It's a Class I hitch, with the 1-1/4' bar.

Sad story here. I just had the hitch replaced. Another
'School of Hard Knocks' diploma for my wall. I need
a larger wall.

The first hitch just about tore off the bottom of my
trunk. The hitch bolted to the central rear tie down
loop and also through the 'Oh Too Thin' sheet metal
of the bottom of the trunk. I recently found the bottom
of the trunk severely cracked with the spare tire about
to fall out. I think the damage was not from towing,
but from the times I was jacking up the front of the
trailer to release it from the hitch, but the connection
not releasing. So, I was just jacking up the rear
of the car and the front of the trailer. To get it
to release, I had to step on the draw bar (glad my
shoe is small enough to fit) and put a bit of weight
on it. I've since found keeping the ball and hitch
wiped clean before connecting allows them to separate
easily. Putting oil on the ball works, too, but attracts
dirt and then leaves this big ol' greasy spot on my
shin.

The trunk got welded up and a new style hitch installed.
This new hitch attaches to the same central tow loop
but instead of going into the thin (very, very thin)
sheet metal of the bottom of the trunk, the two arms
reach more forward where they can bolt into the 'frame
rails'. Holes already exist in the frame rails, so
no drilling was required for this hitch.

A couple of months ago, I also had a transmission oil
cooler added.

Neither the hitch nor the tranny cooler are supplied
by Honda.

I just returned from a 900 mile round trip of towing
the trailer to Cordele, Georgia and back. I haven't
noted a problem with the new hitch.

The only problem I have now after a week of flying
is that I'm back into the drudgery of work :-(

Ray

At 15:36 19 May 2007, Tuno wrote:

Ray, did you have trouble getting a classs III hitch
on your Accord?
(I assume the dealer wouldn't touch this?)

Ray, I tried taking your minivan remark from the other day to heart
(note to others: this was spoken at the airfield, so don't try to find
it on RAS!)
and fixed up my wife's old Voyager. It didn't hurt to see Frank
Paynter's
setup when he was at Perry, either.

However, my efforts at being nice to its transmission have resulted in
a small river of transmission fluid flowing away from it in the
parking lot
this afternoon. I'm still sticking to the Toyota pickup for now...

Ray Lovinggood wrote:

The first hitch just about tore off the bottom of my
trunk. The hitch bolted to the central rear tie down
loop and also through the 'Oh Too Thin' sheet metal
of the bottom of the trunk.


Never forget the two magic phrases:

"Never let a gorilla near your engine"

and

"Gorillas live in garages"

This sound advice was offered by one Brigadier Prendergast (Ret.), who
wrote one of the best guides to the overland route from London to Delhi.
I forgot it once. My transmission suffered from the resulting TLC.


--
martin@ | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
org |

Jeep Liberty CRD
2.8L diesel. At 80 mph, I get 24 mpg running petroleum diesel; 22 mpg
running 100% biodiesel.
Not a bad compromise.

"Bill Daniels" bildan@comcast-dot-net wrote in message
. ..
Well, gas is $3.50/Gal in many parts of the US and who is to say it won't
be $4/gal next summer. This is starting to hurt - and getting me to think
of a more economical vehicle.

Many of us drive larger vehicles than we might otherwise choose simply to
pull our trailers 1% of the time. 99% of the time, we could be driving,
say, a Volkswagen Passat TDI diesel getting 45mpg. The problem isn't the
gas milage when towing a glider trailer. We don't do that often enough
for it to impact out annual fuel budget. The problem is a big SUV as a
daily driver.

So, are there any tricks here? One is to simply own two cars. One to
pull a trailer and another for a daily driver that gets good milage.
Paying license fees, insurance and other fixed costs for a vehicle driven
1% of the time seems outrageous though.

The other thread about surge brakes got me thinking WAY outside the box.
Is there a way for the trailer to be self-propelled? If one were to
install a load sensor in the trailer tongue that could sense the pull of
the tow vehicle as well as the push of an over-running trailer, could that
control a small power plant in the trailer that drove the trailer's
wheels? If done perfectly, a light towing vehicle might not feel the
trailer at all.

If the trailer power were electric, you would have a parallel, plug-in
hybrid. The car engine would charge the trailer batteries when they were
not needed for propulsion and the electrics would kick in on the hills.
Downhill regenerative braking would also charge the trailer batteries as
could large solar panels on the trailer.

It might work fine for a short commute to the glider field and maybe not
so well on a cross country trip but it's fun thinking about.

Bill Daniels

Jeep Liberty CRD
2.8L diesel. At 80 mph, I get 24 mpg running petroleum diesel; 22 mpg
running 100% biodiesel.
Not a bad compromise.

"Bill Daniels" bildan@comcast-dot-net wrote in message

Bill,

I'd agree, that sounds good. I looked into one of those a couple of
years ago, but ended up not doing anything about it. How do you like
the way it drives, and how big of a guy are you? How much diesel
noise do you have when driving it? I've owned several diesels, most
recently a 1982 MB 300SD. Shot it due to old age and too many things
broken, too bad, it was among the best cars I've ever driven. My
attraction to the Jeep is somewhat reduced by the experience I had
once with a rental Cherokee, maybe in about 1987. Biggest pos I ever
drove. Have they gotten it better in the Liberty? I know that the
engine will last forever, but will the car? What's the mpg with the
general mix of everyday city and country driving?

Thanks,
Ed