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#1
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More plane ownership?
This is something that has puzzled me for a while...
I (a private pilot) work in the pleasure marine industry and have noticed that almost anyone who wants to own a boat does own a boat. Now, some boats are indeed pretty cheap, but a $20,000 boat is fairly common (approx cost of a 150?). Here in the Clear Lake area of Texas there are something like 10,000 boats sitting in marina slips with an average cost of something like $30,000 each... many cost way, way more than that. A boat slip here on the Texas coast will run you about $5/foot (which is cheap, I know) and insurance for a $100,000 boat will run you maybe $2,000 a year. Most leave their slips once or twice a year. Marine maintenance and gear is not cheap either. That is a whole lot of expense for so little use. That is 10,000 people, here in Houston alone, that never bothered to take a class in boating, but that are willing to drop $30,000 on one, pay $150-$250 on slip rent and $100-$150 per month on insurance. After so much effort learning to fly, why do pilots not do the same thing? Whereas most boaters own a boat, most pilots do not own a plane. Is it initial cost? Boats and planes cost about the same, so I don't think that is it. Is it storage? A boat slip can cost a bit less than a hanger, or a bit more, but planes can use cheap tie-downs. Do people not buy planes because they might have to tie it down outside? Is it lack of use? Boaters have the same problem... when to use the boat in their spare time. Why would they spring for the boat and a pilot with the same time constraints not spring for the plane? Is it insurance? Plane insurance is more costly than boat insurance, but using a tie-down would make up for that. Is it maintenance? Perhaps that is it... planes are required to undergo expensive preventive maintenance where boats just get a tow back to shore when something breaks. Is it really the fear of 'the annual' that causes people not to fly? Is it fear of flying? Do people learn to fly because they want the challenge but secretly believe they are just asking to make their wife a widow every time they fly? Do people not trust an airplane they could buy? I truly want to know the reason for this and the only way I am going to find out is to listen to more pilots. So please, if you are a pilot, and you don't own a plane, please email me with a candid explanation as to why you personally don't own one. I will compile the 'data' and post it back to the group once I have some idea of the answer. Dave 74 Grumman AA5, N9560L dave(a)thecoverts.com |
#2
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Can I make a prediction of what you will find? I don't want to taint your
unscientific survey if you don't want me too. "Dave Covert" wrote in message ... This is something that has puzzled me for a while... I (a private pilot) work in the pleasure marine industry and have noticed that almost anyone who wants to own a boat does own a boat. Now, some boats are indeed pretty cheap, but a $20,000 boat is fairly common (approx cost of a 150?). Here in the Clear Lake area of Texas there are something like 10,000 boats sitting in marina slips with an average cost of something like $30,000 each... many cost way, way more than that. A boat slip here on the Texas coast will run you about $5/foot (which is cheap, I know) and insurance for a $100,000 boat will run you maybe $2,000 a year. Most leave their slips once or twice a year. Marine maintenance and gear is not cheap either. That is a whole lot of expense for so little use. That is 10,000 people, here in Houston alone, that never bothered to take a class in boating, but that are willing to drop $30,000 on one, pay $150-$250 on slip rent and $100-$150 per month on insurance. After so much effort learning to fly, why do pilots not do the same thing? Whereas most boaters own a boat, most pilots do not own a plane. Is it initial cost? Boats and planes cost about the same, so I don't think that is it. Is it storage? A boat slip can cost a bit less than a hanger, or a bit more, but planes can use cheap tie-downs. Do people not buy planes because they might have to tie it down outside? Is it lack of use? Boaters have the same problem... when to use the boat in their spare time. Why would they spring for the boat and a pilot with the same time constraints not spring for the plane? Is it insurance? Plane insurance is more costly than boat insurance, but using a tie-down would make up for that. Is it maintenance? Perhaps that is it... planes are required to undergo expensive preventive maintenance where boats just get a tow back to shore when something breaks. Is it really the fear of 'the annual' that causes people not to fly? Is it fear of flying? Do people learn to fly because they want the challenge but secretly believe they are just asking to make their wife a widow every time they fly? Do people not trust an airplane they could buy? I truly want to know the reason for this and the only way I am going to find out is to listen to more pilots. So please, if you are a pilot, and you don't own a plane, please email me with a candid explanation as to why you personally don't own one. I will compile the 'data' and post it back to the group once I have some idea of the answer. Dave 74 Grumman AA5, N9560L dave(a)thecoverts.com |
#3
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On Mon, 02 Feb 2004 18:52:28 GMT, "Dave Covert"
wrote: So please, if you are a pilot, and you don't own a plane, please email me with a candid explanation as to why you personally don't own one. I will compile the 'data' and post it back to the group once I have some idea of the answer. I own a plane (SR20), it costs me $6000 a year for insurance, $3600 a year for a hangar (no electricity and gravel floor), about $3000 a year in maintenance and I only fly about 100 hours. That works out to $165 an hour. That does not include the cost of the plane. Before buying the Cirrus I was in a club that only charged $70 an hour for a Cessna 172. My FBO will rent a Piper twin for $150. Buying was the biggest financial mistake I ever made. |
#4
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"ArtP" wrote in message ... On Mon, 02 Feb 2004 18:52:28 GMT, "Dave Covert" wrote: So please, if you are a pilot, and you don't own a plane, please email me with a candid explanation as to why you personally don't own one. I will compile the 'data' and post it back to the group once I have some idea of the answer. I own a plane (SR20), it costs me $6000 a year for insurance, $3600 a year for a hangar (no electricity and gravel floor), about $3000 a year in maintenance and I only fly about 100 hours. That works out to $165 an hour. That does not include the cost of the plane. Before buying the Cirrus I was in a club that only charged $70 an hour for a Cessna 172. My FBO will rent a Piper twin for $150. Buying was the biggest financial mistake I ever made. I'll do you one better! I was renting hanger space for $350/month and I could call the FBO and tell them I was going flying. They would take the airplane out of the hanger and fuel it at the self serve pump (and give me a discount). Then they would put the airplane away. The next morning they pulled the airplane out before I arrived. THEN, I bought a hanger lot with deeded runway access and had an 80x80 hanger built. Now I have to pull the airplane in and out, make sure the taxiway is cleared of snow, FOD ect. I am also diagonally across the airport from the fuel island and they don't have a fuel truck. So after spending a couple hundred thousand on my new hanger, I recieved my first natural gas bill...$537...property taxes...~$250/month...electicity ~$50/month. Mike MU-2 |
#5
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Dave, to me this is a no-brainer. With a boat, one pays the registration, sticks
it in the water, and off one goes! No classes, no tests, no big brother regulations, no "fraternity" of jack-ass geezer aviators telling you stupid stuff about you're not a pilot if you have a nose wheel, etc. Plus you can drink beer on the boat and you don't genally die if the motor quits. Best regards, Steve Robertson (geezer, but with a nose wheel) N4732J 1967 Beechcraft A23-24 Musketeer Dave Covert wrote: This is something that has puzzled me for a while... I (a private pilot) work in the pleasure marine industry and have noticed that almost anyone who wants to own a boat does own a boat. Now, some boats are indeed pretty cheap, but a $20,000 boat is fairly common (approx cost of a 150?). Here in the Clear Lake area of Texas there are something like 10,000 boats sitting in marina slips with an average cost of something like $30,000 each... many cost way, way more than that. A boat slip here on the Texas coast will run you about $5/foot (which is cheap, I know) and insurance for a $100,000 boat will run you maybe $2,000 a year. Most leave their slips once or twice a year. Marine maintenance and gear is not cheap either. That is a whole lot of expense for so little use. That is 10,000 people, here in Houston alone, that never bothered to take a class in boating, but that are willing to drop $30,000 on one, pay $150-$250 on slip rent and $100-$150 per month on insurance. After so much effort learning to fly, why do pilots not do the same thing? Whereas most boaters own a boat, most pilots do not own a plane. Is it initial cost? Boats and planes cost about the same, so I don't think that is it. Is it storage? A boat slip can cost a bit less than a hanger, or a bit more, but planes can use cheap tie-downs. Do people not buy planes because they might have to tie it down outside? Is it lack of use? Boaters have the same problem... when to use the boat in their spare time. Why would they spring for the boat and a pilot with the same time constraints not spring for the plane? Is it insurance? Plane insurance is more costly than boat insurance, but using a tie-down would make up for that. Is it maintenance? Perhaps that is it... planes are required to undergo expensive preventive maintenance where boats just get a tow back to shore when something breaks. Is it really the fear of 'the annual' that causes people not to fly? Is it fear of flying? Do people learn to fly because they want the challenge but secretly believe they are just asking to make their wife a widow every time they fly? Do people not trust an airplane they could buy? I truly want to know the reason for this and the only way I am going to find out is to listen to more pilots. So please, if you are a pilot, and you don't own a plane, please email me with a candid explanation as to why you personally don't own one. I will compile the 'data' and post it back to the group once I have some idea of the answer. Dave 74 Grumman AA5, N9560L dave(a)thecoverts.com |
#6
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It is harder to rent a boat than it is to rent a plane. It is harder to own
a plane than it is to own a boat. |
#7
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no tests, no big brother
regulations, no "fraternity" of jack-ass geezer aviators telling you stupid stuff about you're not a pilot if you have a nose wheel, etc. Plus you can drink beer on the boat and you don't genally die if the motor quits. You forgot the bikini-clad deck candy... g Dave |
#8
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I guess I have a different perspective, one that isn't so burdensome...
I own a 74 Grumman Traveler that I tie down for $35. The plane cost me $30K to buy and insurance is less than $1000 a year for my wife (student) and I. Annuals run about $1000 a year (the Grumman is a simple plane). I use about 10 gal/hr and go 115kt in cruise. It is just about like owning an older classic car. I also fly about 100 hours a year so my hourly comes out to about $45/hr. I was going to say that based on your experience, I can see why more people don't own expensive new planes, but then I read in the AOPA mag that Cirrus is selling nearly one plane a day (1000 in less than 3 years). Dave "ArtP" wrote in message ... On Mon, 02 Feb 2004 18:52:28 GMT, "Dave Covert" wrote: So please, if you are a pilot, and you don't own a plane, please email me with a candid explanation as to why you personally don't own one. I will compile the 'data' and post it back to the group once I have some idea of the answer. I own a plane (SR20), it costs me $6000 a year for insurance, $3600 a year for a hangar (no electricity and gravel floor), about $3000 a year in maintenance and I only fly about 100 hours. That works out to $165 an hour. That does not include the cost of the plane. Before buying the Cirrus I was in a club that only charged $70 an hour for a Cessna 172. My FBO will rent a Piper twin for $150. Buying was the biggest financial mistake I ever made. |
#9
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Hey... taint away... g
Dave "Dude" wrote in message ... Can I make a prediction of what you will find? I don't want to taint your unscientific survey if you don't want me too. |
#10
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On Mon, 02 Feb 2004 18:52:28 GMT "Dave Covert" wrote:
This is something that has puzzled me for a while... I (a private pilot) work in the pleasure marine industry and have noticed that almost anyone who wants to own a boat does own a boat. Now, some boats are indeed pretty cheap, but a $20,000 boat is fairly common (approx cost of a 150?). Here in the Clear Lake area of Texas there are something like 10,000 boats sitting in marina slips with an average cost of something like $30,000 each... many cost way, way more than that. A boat slip here on the Texas coast will run you about $5/foot (which is cheap, I know) and insurance for a $100,000 boat will run you maybe $2,000 a year. Most leave their slips once or twice a year. Marine maintenance and gear is not cheap either. That is a whole lot of expense for so little use. price/(time used) doesn't count But I'll bet planes are still more. That is 10,000 people, here in Houston alone, that never bothered to take a class in boating, but that are willing to drop $30,000 on one, pay $150-$250 on slip rent and $100-$150 per month on insurance. After so much effort learning to fly, why do pilots not do the same thing? Whereas most boaters own a boat, most pilots do not own a plane. A boat is cheaper than a plane. You can haul more people on a boat of comparable plane value. You can do a lot more on a boat. Fish, scuba, camping, swimming, cooking, sleeping, kayaking, etc. Is it initial cost? Boats and planes cost about the same, so I don't think that is it. Is it storage? A boat slip can cost a bit less than a hanger, or a bit more, but planes can use cheap tie-downs. Do people not buy planes because they might have to tie it down outside? There are a lot more boat slips than hangars/tie-downs in most coastal towns that also have an airport. The harbors I've seen are maintained by the city or county. Is it lack of use? Boaters have the same problem... when to use the boat in their spare time. Why would they spring for the boat and a pilot with the same time constraints not spring for the plane? Plane more complicated to own, you can't do all the repair work but on a boat you can do all, if you want to.... Is it insurance? Plane insurance is more costly than boat insurance, but using a tie-down would make up for that. I don't follow?? Is it maintenance? Perhaps that is it... planes are required to undergo expensive preventive maintenance where boats just get a tow back to shore when something breaks. Is it really the fear of 'the annual' that causes people not to fly? More expensive, in all areas. Compare marine GPS and aviation GPS. Is it fear of flying? Do people learn to fly because they want the challenge but secretly believe they are just asking to make their wife a widow every time they fly? Do people not trust an airplane they could buy? Ocean boating is very dangerous and yet it's so easy to sail into it but not that many people die. You can be rescued. They have the equivalent of triple A on water in a lot of metro areas now. Call them and get a tow back to port. Or if it gets real hairy call the Coast Guard. There's almost always someone to bail you out. A boat's mission is much more versatile. Harbors and harbor areas generate lots of tourist money too in a lot of cases. Airports that accept govt. money have strings attached and the moeny has to go back into the airport. R. Hubbell I truly want to know the reason for this and the only way I am going to find out is to listen to more pilots. So please, if you are a pilot, and you don't own a plane, please email me with a candid explanation as to why you personally don't own one. I will compile the 'data' and post it back to the group once I have some idea of the answer. Dave 74 Grumman AA5, N9560L dave(a)thecoverts.com |
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