Old airframe, new engine

In article ,
(Jim Strand) wrote:

You are able to select any tactical jet airframe from the past. We'll
assume all engines would fit properly. What bird would you like to
fly again if it had modern engines and avionics as well?

Well, I'm not a pilot - but a Blackburn Buccaneer with the engines out of
the F/A-22 would surely have serious entertainment value.

---
John Dallman

Mary Shafer wrote in message . ..

TRANSONIC ACCELERATION PROCEDURE

Transonic acceleration is accomplished at either a level altitude or
during a climb-and-descent maneuver.

*snip*

I suspect that the SR-71A-1 manual and your 'Dash-1' are one and the same.
By some miracle the former has been de-classified and is online. The page you
refer to can be found at:

http://www.sr-71.org/blackbird/manual/2/2-41.htm

*Warning* you may lose more than a few hours of your day if you follow the
above link.

cheers,
aaron

On Tue, 21 Oct 2003 12:03:05 GMT, "Doug \"Woody\" and Erin Beal"
wrote:

On 10/20/03 9:42 PM, in article ,
"Mary Shafer" wrote:

Essentially, the SR-71 climbs at constant qbar (400 KEAS) to Mach 0.9,
then descends at a constant rate to Mach 1.25 (450 KEAS at 30,000
feet), and then climbs again at a different constant qbar (450 KEAS)
to cruise.

Thanks for the detailed response. Must come with the retirement.

I thinned the list of newsgroups down so I have a little more time to
type. And I'm a very fast typist.

I'm
interested in the 450 KEAS limit and the "Do not use excessive load factors
to prevent exceeding..." comment. What is an excessive load factor in this
flight regime. 1.5G? 2.0G?

Definitely in that vicinity. Let's see, section 4, probably. Limit
Load Factor Diagram, Symmetrical, Turning, and Rolling Flight,
Transonic Penetration (climb or descent). Symmetrical is 2.0 g up to
Mach 1.80 and rolling is 1.6 g. The absolute most you can pull is 3.5
g symmetrically or 2.8 g rolling, below 50,000 ft, at airspeeds
between 310 and 450 KEAS, at a gross weight of 80,000 to 90,000 lb.
It's less above and below those weights.

And the maximum design qbar works out to 500 KEAS, but the limit
airspeed is 450 KEAS.

The Ritowski climb is essentially the same thing. I think that the numbers
are different for most aircraft, but for the Hornet, it's 400KCAS to .85 in
the mid 30's, push it over to exceed 1.0, and climb supersonic afterward.
Works great on FCF's for the mil lock-up procedure (above 1.23M).

I just didn't know it had a name. I remember this from the optimal
trajectory work done in the '60s, in fact.

Someone has posted the URL for the SR-71 Dash-1, by the way. That was
made from the exact same copy that Dryden copied all of its from, as
it's probably the only formally declassified and marked copy
around--the thing is four inches thick and there wasn't any point in
going through and marking out the classification stamps in more than
one copy, because it's just too much work.

Mary

--
Mary Shafer Retired aerospace research engineer

On Tue, 21 Oct 2003 06:47:05 -0500, "John Carrier"
wrote:

I'm curious why the 450 limit is such an issue ... your quote implies bad
things happen if it's exceeded. I realize the SR had a relatively low
q-limit, but I didn't believe it that low. Was another factor the issue?

No. The design limit is 500 KEAS.

Mary

--
Mary Shafer Retired aerospace research engineer

On 23 Oct 2003 20:11:35 -0700, (Aaron Holtzman)
wrote:

Mary Shafer wrote in message . ..

TRANSONIC ACCELERATION PROCEDURE

Transonic acceleration is accomplished at either a level altitude or
during a climb-and-descent maneuver.

*snip*

I suspect that the SR-71A-1 manual and your 'Dash-1' are one and the same.

Naturally. See, it's the SR-71A-1, SR-71A-dash-1. In the USAF
universe, every airplane has a series of publications designated by
the aircraft designation (SR-71A) followed by a dash and a number
telling what publication it is. SR-71A-1, the Dash-1, is the flight
manual for the SR-71. All USAF flight manuals are Dash-1s (they're
NATOPS manuals for the USN).

By some miracle the former has been de-classified and is online.

It was no miracle that it was declassified. The USAF declassified the
airplane and everything about it, after removing the recce gear, so
that NASA could operate the airplane in a reasonable manner. The real
miracle was that they gave us three SR-71s, all the parts and support
equipment, and a big tank full of JP-7. Throwing in a Dash-1 was
fairly minor.

Putting it online is more a matter of boring scut work than miracle
and I'm sure many folks are grateful to the person who did that scut
work.

http://www.sr-71.org/blackbird/manual/2/2-41.htm

I'm glad you posted this. It'll save me a lot of typing. Notice that
the URL ends in the section and page, i.e. /2/2-41.htm is section 2,
page 2-41.

Mary

--
Mary Shafer Retired aerospace research engineer

I suspect that the SR-71A-1 manual and your 'Dash-1' are one and the same.
By some miracle the former has been de-classified and is online. The page
you
refer to can be found at:

http://www.sr-71.org/blackbird/manual/2/2-41.htm

Thanks for the link. They are the same. Navy calls it NATOPS, but their
format is virtually identical.

Usually there are one or more supplements for the weapons system and
tactical information. Usually there was a confidential manual and then a
secret supplement. The confidential manual had performance data in the form
of PsubS diagrams ... very useful if interpreted properly (I'd love to see
an SR's PsubS ... generally a low Q, hi energy airplane creates some
fascinating data).

R / John

No. The design limit is 500 KEAS.

So the online dash one (looked it up from the former post) says. Lots of
jets have design limits versus "operational" limits (F-14 850 and 780). I'm
a bit surprised, I thought it would be a bit higher. It's actually somewhat
less than a Mig-25.

R / John

doug- Got any F-8 or Turkey personal experience numbers you want to share?
I'd
assume they'd be much better. BRBR

Got my Mach 2 pin in a clean F-4D...

Saw 800 KIAS in a F-16N, at 200 ft AGL over by Yuma...don't know the mach
number...
P. C. Chisholm
CDR, USN(ret.)
Old Phart Phormer Phantom, Turkey, Viper, Scooter and Combat Buckeye Phlyer

Aaron Holtzman wrote:

Mary Shafer wrote in message . ..

TRANSONIC ACCELERATION PROCEDURE

Transonic acceleration is accomplished at either a level altitude or
during a climb-and-descent maneuver.

*snip*

I suspect that the SR-71A-1 manual and your 'Dash-1' are one and the same.
By some miracle the former has been de-classified and is online. The page you
refer to can be found at:

http://www.sr-71.org/blackbird/manual/2/2-41.htm

*Warning* you may lose more than a few hours of your day if you follow the
above link.

cheers,
aaron
Great link! Thanks for posting it. It's now a test of willpower
between work and reading the manual.

Mike Lechnar

Mark- of my acquaintance called the Crusader the
"Ensign Eater." Sounds like a REALLY steep learning curve.. BRBR

Cutlass...

F-8 drivers were some of the best I have ever seen, like Thud drivers, had to
be....
P. C. Chisholm
CDR, USN(ret.)
Old Phart Phormer Phantom, Turkey, Viper, Scooter and Combat Buckeye Phlyer