death of GA in NY

In article ,
Larry Dighera wrote:
How much money do you think we have paid to bail out TWA, Continental,
United etc...?

Oh, you mean like federalizing the security screeners, and paying
billions to the families of 9/11 victims in exchange for their
forfeiting their right to sue the airlines, or the direct subsidies?

No, he probably means the huge "get out of jail free" fund that the
federal government made available to companies that are so mismanaged
that they have no business being in business.



JKG

wrote in message
...

The slow death of GA is in acceleration in the NY area. TEB FBO's moving
out pushing the feeding chain down. FBO's now requiring TSA clearance
even for renters (not just trainees as required by law; since when did
FBO's become worse than homeland security?).

FBO's outside of TEB losing students by the dozens due to fuel and the 3rd
price hike in less than a month.

Nice going everyone. I always thought what would finally kill GA would be
the media or anti airport sentiment; not FBO's. There is not one that I
would recommend within 25 miles of new york city.

And .. if you respond and defend an FBO here I can only wonder why.


I know you think the world revolves around NY, but there are many more
airfields and airplanes outside the NYC area that will continue, dispite any
cease in GA around the big apple.

Since I rarely ever even file a flight plan, I'm not too concerned about
user fees either.

On 12 Sep 2005 13:07:13 -0700, "Michael"
wrote in
.com::

There are already large numbers of flight schools out there, located in
the middle of nowhere, which are quite prepaed to take pilots from zero
to 250-hour CFI/CFII/MEI without any contact with recreational GA (or
real-world flying).

Yep.

What percentage of airline flight crew would you estimate were trained
in the military?

Read the "Fuel Price Affect" (sic) posted on the AOPA member board (easy to
hack into their site if you are not a member; I-pilot is a bit tougher,
but doable): Rising AV gas prices are definitely having an "affect."

wrote:

The slow death of GA is in acceleration in the NY area.


I believe you're missing the smaller picture. TEB has been *small* GA
unfriendly for quite some time now. It's all about money: which makes more
for the FBO, a 4 172s or 1 citation?

Right now, MMU is pretty good about small GA. But I predict that this won't
last long. The best break we "little plane" pilots got in a while in this
area was the rejection of the idea to extend CDW's 4/22 and put in an ILS.

And, of course, we've several smaller airports in the neighborhood. We do
need to work to keep them. NJ's been pretty good about this recently, I'm
please to note, trying to buy development rights and such.

TEB with its volume of commercial GA operations is, I suspect, less the rule
than the exception. Fortunately, I don't think most GA airports can handle
the traffic TEB's receiving.

Further to this, one particular FBO at TEB had a recent insurance problem.
Even though this wasn't related to small GA, a consequence was a severe
restriction in what could be done with their rented planes.

At least, that's the story. There's still the fact that small airplanes
take space and management that makes more money on larger planes.

- Andrew

Larry Dighera wrote:
On 12 Sep 2005 13:07:13 -0700, "Michael"
wrote in
.com::

There are already large numbers of flight schools out there, located in
the middle of nowhere, which are quite prepaed to take pilots from zero
to 250-hour CFI/CFII/MEI without any contact with recreational GA (or
real-world flying).

Yep.

What percentage of airline flight crew would you estimate were trained
in the military?

IIRC the proportion dropped below 50% within the past 5-10 years and is
continuing to drop as the airline industry grows and the military keeps
shrinking.

-cwk.

Larry Dighera wrote:

What percentage of airline flight crew would you estimate were trained
in the military?

Not much. In the seventies and eighties it was a substantial
proportion, but we don't use that many pilots in the military
these days so there aren't that many transitioning into civil
careers. Many of the reserve and NG pilots flying now have
non-flying careers they go back to.

I don't think fuel prices will have a permanant effect. How many gallons of
fuel could you buy for the same as a new Skyhawk on 1970? How about now?

I would guess that consumption in every recreational activity that burns
petrolium fuel is is down. How much gas did you burn in those twin 350s this
weekend? It looked to me that boating was way off this weekend.

"Skylune" wrote in message
lkaboutaviation.com...
Read the "Fuel Price Affect" (sic) posted on the AOPA member board (easy
to
hack into their site if you are not a member; I-pilot is a bit tougher,
but doable): Rising AV gas prices are definitely having an "affect."

"Andrew Gideon" wrote in message
gonline.com...
wrote:

The slow death of GA is in acceleration in the NY area.


I believe you're missing the smaller picture. TEB has been *small* GA
unfriendly for quite some time now. It's all about money: which makes
more
for the FBO, a 4 172s or 1 citation?

Right now, MMU is pretty good about small GA. But I predict that this
won't
last long. The best break we "little plane" pilots got in a while in this

I wouldn't call a $35.00 landing/parking/handling fee by Signature the only
FBO small GA friendly

Steve S wrote:

"Andrew Gideon" wrote in message
gonline.com...

wrote:


The slow death of GA is in acceleration in the NY area.


I believe you're missing the smaller picture. TEB has been *small* GA
unfriendly for quite some time now. It's all about money: which makes
more
for the FBO, a 4 172s or 1 citation?

Right now, MMU is pretty good about small GA. But I predict that this
won't
last long. The best break we "little plane" pilots got in a while in this


I wouldn't call a $35.00 landing/parking/handling fee by Signature the only
FBO small GA friendly


Agreed. A reasonable overnight parking fee ($10 a night ?) I could go
along with but $35 will pretty much guarantee a lot of GA aircraft
will avoid that FBO. In their own way they are contributing to the
extermination of general aviation.

Just as with excessive income taxes, there is a point of diminishing
returns. There somes a point where reducing tax rates actually results
in an overall increase in tax revenues because people start increasing
economic activities. I think some of these FBOs need a little dose of
supply side economic thinking.