Which PDA ?

I am thinking of upgrading my PDA for my GNII.
The display should be readable in sun light. Presently I use a1550 as
primary with a 302 and the 39xx as a back up with a 302A. Maybe I
should get a CAI Nav display and one good PDA. Which one? Please make
recomendations.
Udo

On May 7, 4:53*pm, Udo wrote:
I am thinking of upgrading my PDA for my GNII.
The display should be readable in sun light. Presently I use a1550 as
primary with a 302 and the 39xx as a back up with a 302A. Maybe I
should get a CAI Nav display and one good PDA. Which one? Please make
recomendations.
Udo

Udo -

This is not the answer you're looking for, but in my experience
people's opinion/reaction to various PDA displays is a HIGHLY
subjective thing.

If you can, try to find a few different PDAs being used by local
pilots and check them out (in the sunlight or under a glider canopy).
Check them with the backlight turned on and turned off. Different
PDAs do better with different brightness and backlight settings (and
backlighting can severely impact the battery life or run-time).

Also note the viewing angles that work with a given PDA. Gooseneck-
type mounts make this far easier to deal with than a knee-strap or
hard-mounting to the instrument panel.

Good luck!

--Noel
(Who uses an HP iPAQ hx4700 hooked up to an ewMicroRecorder, with the
backlight turned off in sunlight and running XCSoar)

Udo,

I concur with Noel. It is subjective. The PDA's I like are Aero1550
(like yours) and iPaq 3850. The latter is somewhat more "modern" than
3660, but still has a reflective display. I find it quite visible in
sunlight (better than any other color PDA I've seen). I have not seen
ClearNav, but all other LED based TRANSMISSIVE displays I've looked
at, were pretty much invisible in full sunlight.

What I'd like to know is what is current draw of ClearNav at full
brightness (I'll assume visibility)?

Cheers,
Henryk Birecki

"noel.wade" wrote:

On May 7, 4:53*pm, Udo wrote:
I am thinking of upgrading my PDA for my GNII.
The display should be readable in sun light. Presently I use a1550 as
primary with a 302 and the 39xx as a back up with a 302A. Maybe I
should get a CAI Nav display and one good PDA. Which one? Please make
recomendations.
Udo

Udo -

This is not the answer you're looking for, but in my experience
people's opinion/reaction to various PDA displays is a HIGHLY
subjective thing.

If you can, try to find a few different PDAs being used by local
pilots and check them out (in the sunlight or under a glider canopy).
Check them with the backlight turned on and turned off. Different
PDAs do better with different brightness and backlight settings (and
backlighting can severely impact the battery life or run-time).

Also note the viewing angles that work with a given PDA. Gooseneck-
type mounts make this far easier to deal with than a knee-strap or
hard-mounting to the instrument panel.

Good luck!

--Noel
(Who uses an HP iPAQ hx4700 hooked up to an ewMicroRecorder, with the
backlight turned off in sunlight and running XCSoar)

Udo,

"readable in sun light" pretty much eliminates all PDAs. If you've got
the coin you should look at the NK Clear Nav, but you probably already
knew that.

GNII ran nicely, and more visibly than other products, on my hx4705.

~ted/2NO

I have (2) PDA's (fault tolerance / redundancy)

An hx4700 running WinPilot I hate because I cannot see it in bright
light.

The other is an older color ipaq 3635 running GNII that is pretty
readable (acceptable but not great) in bright light.

I did some evaluation of some PDA based units by Symbol Technologies
several years ago for a customer who uses them for on street parking
enforcement (parking tickets for expired meters). They were
ruggedized and very readable. I was trying to "borrow" one to
reprogram to try in the glider but the vendor was not very cooperative.

On May 7, 7:31*pm, Todd wrote:
I have (2) PDA's (fault tolerance / redundancy)

An hx4700 running WinPilot I hate because I cannot see it in bright
light.


Todd - Just a tip: I was surprised to find that if I disabled the
backlight my hx4700 suddenly became easier to read in bright sunlight
(but almost impossible to read in the shade or indoors). Not "easy",
but easier. You might give it a try...

Take care,

--Noel

Hi Noel,

I'm very surprised to hear that. My experience is that even if that works
with the sun shining directly on the screen, it won't work when the sun is
in front of the glider (not shining on the screen). I always have my
backlight on full power. But I'll try turning it off today. I'm very
curious.

Paul Remde

"noel.wade" wrote in message
...
On May 7, 7:31 pm, Todd wrote:
I have (2) PDA's (fault tolerance / redundancy)

An hx4700 running WinPilot I hate because I cannot see it in bright
light.


Todd - Just a tip: I was surprised to find that if I disabled the
backlight my hx4700 suddenly became easier to read in bright sunlight
(but almost impossible to read in the shade or indoors). Not "easy",
but easier. You might give it a try...

Take care,

--Noel

Hi,

I just did some testing with my iPAQ hx4705 and iPAQ 210 in bright morning
sunlight. With the sun on the face of the PDA the backlight made no
difference. The sun overpowers it and the display is pretty easy to read.
Turning the backlight on and off made zero difference in the contrast or
brightness.

With the sun behind the PDA (me looking into the sun with the PDA screen in
shadow) there was a big difference. With the backlight off I could hardly
see either screen. With the backlight on I could see them both much
better - but not great.

So I recommend leaving the backlight on at full power while flying in
gliders. The current draw is much higher but the readability is much, much
better.

For some reason the iPAQ 210 was a little easier to read than the hx4700.
Probably because the hx4700's backlight is about 3 years old. Lights
decrease in brightness with age/use. Another potential explanation is that
I have a Boxwave screen glare reducer on my hx4700 and not on my iPAQ 210.
I was very happy to see that HP made the screen of the 210 slightly textured
so a glare reducer is not required. The iPAQ hx4700's screen is glassy so a
glare reducer is needed. The glare reducer does slightly reduce the screen
brightness. But the difference in brightness in sunlight was negligible.

Paul Remde
Cumulus Soaring, Inc.
http://www.cumulus-soaring.com

"Paul Remde" wrote in message
news:7iCUj.100851$TT4.42547@attbi_s22...
Hi Noel,

I'm very surprised to hear that. My experience is that even if that works
with the sun shining directly on the screen, it won't work when the sun is
in front of the glider (not shining on the screen). I always have my
backlight on full power. But I'll try turning it off today. I'm very
curious.

Paul Remde

"noel.wade" wrote in message
...
On May 7, 7:31 pm, Todd wrote:
I have (2) PDA's (fault tolerance / redundancy)

An hx4700 running WinPilot I hate because I cannot see it in bright
light.


Todd - Just a tip: I was surprised to find that if I disabled the
backlight my hx4700 suddenly became easier to read in bright sunlight
(but almost impossible to read in the shade or indoors). Not "easy",
but easier. You might give it a try...

Take care,

--Noel

Hi Udo,

The best PDA available is the 1550. You can probably still find a good one
if you keep checking ebay every day for a week or 2.

I fly with an iPAQ hx4700 but I'm moving to an iPAQ 210. It doesn't have a
built in serial port so I have worked out a good solution with a CF card
serial port and a customer Nimbus cradle. The 210 seems a bit brighter than
my hx4700 indoors, but that may be due to the backlight in the hx4700
getting dimmer over the 2 to 3 years I've had it. It is similar to the
hx4700 (maybe a little better) in sunlight.

Of course, the ClearNav is the best option. It is very readable in
sunlight. I have about 20 customers lined up to buy them - mainly for that
reason. I'm excited because I have been contracted to write the manual for
it. It is a great product that will be very popular. Let me know if you
want to get onto my waiting list.

Good Soaring,

Paul Remde
Cumulus Soaring, Inc.
http://www.cumulus-soaring.com

"Udo" wrote in message
...
I am thinking of upgrading my PDA for my GNII.
The display should be readable in sun light. Presently I use a1550 as
primary with a 302 and the 39xx as a back up with a 302A. Maybe I
should get a CAI Nav display and one good PDA. Which one? Please make
recomendations.
Udo

Paul, does the ClearNav have an LED backlight screen?

From my research, a screen brightness of 1000 Nits is required for a fully
"sunlight readable" screen. Most PDA's and laptops have about 200 nits. To
get 1000 Nits with a CCL backlight, requires more current that can
reasonably be provided in a battery operated device.

LED backlights seem to be much brighter and use less power than CCL
backlights.

Bill D


"Paul Remde" wrote in message
news:NLtUj.100280$TT4.58952@attbi_s22...
Hi Udo,

The best PDA available is the 1550. You can probably still find a good
one if you keep checking ebay every day for a week or 2.

I fly with an iPAQ hx4700 but I'm moving to an iPAQ 210. It doesn't have
a built in serial port so I have worked out a good solution with a CF card
serial port and a customer Nimbus cradle. The 210 seems a bit brighter
than my hx4700 indoors, but that may be due to the backlight in the hx4700
getting dimmer over the 2 to 3 years I've had it. It is similar to the
hx4700 (maybe a little better) in sunlight.

Of course, the ClearNav is the best option. It is very readable in
sunlight. I have about 20 customers lined up to buy them - mainly for
that reason. I'm excited because I have been contracted to write the
manual for it. It is a great product that will be very popular. Let me
know if you want to get onto my waiting list.

Good Soaring,

Paul Remde
Cumulus Soaring, Inc.
http://www.cumulus-soaring.com

"Udo" wrote in message
...
I am thinking of upgrading my PDA for my GNII.
The display should be readable in sun light. Presently I use a1550 as
primary with a 302 and the 39xx as a back up with a 302A. Maybe I
should get a CAI Nav display and one good PDA. Which one? Please make
recomendations.
Udo