Question: Researching Project

Tilt wrote:

I forgot to mention one thing. I'm not really keen on a tail dragger. The
bearhawk also looks a bit compact. I'm a bigger tall sort of guy and like
my elbow room. I was hoping for some more room in the back for a 4 place
craft.

Please let us know when you found this plane: bigger than a Bearhawk, faster
than 150kt for less than CA$75k. Oh, and with affordable operating costs I
should add. Maintaining and feeding an engine to haul around something
bigger than the Bearhawk at 150kt costs more than most of us would like.

- Holger

On 12 Dec 2003 09:08 AM, Tilt posted the following:

I understand that most home-builts (or at least the one's I'm looking
at) are not very big. I'm 6 feet tall and weigh around 225 lbs. I like
the 4 seater idea because I can see myself taking my family or friends
on trips (not sure how far I'd go...too early in my thinking). I'd
like the ability to take passengers that are around 200 lbs each. Not
that it'll be that way everytime, but I'd like to have that ability.
Realistically the passenger weight loads would probably vary a lot. So
I do understand that space will be limited, but I just don't want to
be stuffed in like a sardine!!

You wouldn't be stuffed like a sardine into a Bearhawk. If you want a
similar sized plane that will accept tricycle gear, look into the Murphy
Super Rebel kit but good luck building one for less than your stated
budget. Other options might be one of the Aerocomp kits or an RV-10,
but again, I don't know anything about the price. Part of the
Bearhawk's huge appeal is that you have the choice of building from
either a kit or from scratch.

Oh, and one other thing...I hate to say it but, easthetics does play a
little role in my choice. For my eyes, I can't see myself owning a BD-
4 or a Bearhawk. I understand everyone has a different eye for beauty.
I'm partial to something a bit more newer looking and sleek.

There is something wrong with your eyes if you can lump the Bearhawk
together with the BD-4 looks wise. Do you have a current medical
certificate? Seriously.

----------------------------------------------------
Del Rawlins-
Remove _kills_spammers_ to reply via email.
Unofficial Bearhawk FAQ website:
http://www.rawlinsbrothers.org/bhfaq/

"Tilt" wrote in message
news:Of2Cb.663673$pl3.69462@pd7tw3no...

So can anyone point me in the direction of some good quality (proven)
aircraft projects that I can research further? As long as they (somewhat)
follow the above criteria.

You'll probably need a partner to go in with you on this one. . .

http://www.aircraftdesigns.com/

Rich S.

You wouldn't be stuffed like a sardine into a Bearhawk. If you want a
similar sized plane that will accept tricycle gear, look into the Murphy
Super Rebel kit but good luck building one for less than your stated
budget. Other options might be one of the Aerocomp kits or an RV-10,
but again, I don't know anything about the price. Part of the
Bearhawk's huge appeal is that you have the choice of building from
either a kit or from scratch.


I've looked at the RV-10 a bit. It looks nice. The craft seems to have the
majority of the things I'm looking for. It's a low wing setup but I don't
think that's a huge deal.

I'll check out the Aerocomp.


Oh, and one other thing...I hate to say it but, easthetics does play a
little role in my choice. For my eyes, I can't see myself owning a BD-
4 or a Bearhawk. I understand everyone has a different eye for beauty.
I'm partial to something a bit more newer looking and sleek.

There is something wrong with your eyes if you can lump the Bearhawk
together with the BD-4 looks wise. Do you have a current medical
certificate? Seriously.


I know, I know!!! I'm not saying the Bearhawk looks like the BD-4. ;^) I'm
mostly getting at the fact that the newer looking machines like the
composite Jabiru or Van's RV's are what suit me. The Bearhawk is not an ugly
aircraft (by any stretch), but it's a bit plain jane to me. If the Jabiru
was a bit bigger and could handle a slightly larger load, I'd certainly have
my kit.

No, I don't have my medical. I'm not a pilot (yet). This project is a very
long term item with me. If I actually get started with a couple years from
now, I'll be happy. I currently have no place to build. I'll be getting my
license sometime with a couple years from now. I'm only 33 years old yet,
and have young kids, so I have plenty of time on my side.

I have had aeromedicals done a couple of times for flights in military
aircraft. Passed them without a problem.

Cheers,
Lyle

You're right I'd need a partner (or 2) on this one. However, that actually
may happen. I do have 2 other parties interested along with me.

The Stallion is very nice. It certainly exceeds the items I was looking for.
I wonder if you could build this aircraft with fixed gear? It'd bring the
speed down a bit, but it would save a few bucks I'm sure.

Thanks Rich...I really like it.

Lyle



"Rich S." wrote in message
...
"Tilt" wrote in message
news:Of2Cb.663673$pl3.69462@pd7tw3no...

So can anyone point me in the direction of some good quality (proven)
aircraft projects that I can research further? As long as they
(somewhat)
follow the above criteria.

You'll probably need a partner to go in with you on this one. . .

http://www.aircraftdesigns.com/

Rich S.

If total cost is a real concern along with getting just what you want, then
the real answer is to build from plans and modify as needed. Many design
modifications have been tried and tested for a number of different aircraft.

One plans built design that has a growing number of builders is the VISION
from American Affordable Aircraft (http://www.visionaircraft.com). While
the supplier does not currently have plans for a four place, there are
builders that are doing the ground work on this now and after the mods are
proven, the designer may offer this in the future. Since you say it may be
a couple of years before you begin building, this may be the thing to wait
for.

The cost of construction for the VISION is very reasonable. The company is
also working on components to help with reducing construction times. Check
out the web site above, you may like it.

Bryan


"Tilt" wrote in message
news:hunCb.674520$6C4.525759@pd7tw1no...
I'm going to add a bit of info to add to the equation...

I really would prefer a composite style 'kit' along the lines of the
Jabiru.
I like the trike style setup for landing gear, I've never been a fan of
tail-draggers.

I understand that most home-builts (or at least the one's I'm looking at)
are not very big. I'm 6 feet tall and weigh around 225 lbs. I like the 4
seater idea because I can see myself taking my family or friends on trips
(not sure how far I'd go...too early in my thinking). I'd like the ability
to take passengers that are around 200 lbs each. Not that it'll be that
way
everytime, but I'd like to have that ability. Realistically the passenger
weight loads would probably vary a lot. So I do understand that space will
be limited, but I just don't want to be stuffed in like a sardine!!

I was checking out the New Glastar 4 seater last night (on their website),
and I was thinking it may be the one. However, I came across the height
limit for backseaters. 5 feet tall!!!! How usefull is that??!!!

Anyways, this is what I'm looking at. Maybe I'm putting too much emphysis
on
the 4 seater thing. One could say that you'd probably mostly only ever fly
with one other person. And for the occational longer trips with the family
you could rent a Cessna or something. But then again, that defeats the
whole
purpose of building my own aircraft.

Oh, and one other thing...I hate to say it but, easthetics does play a
little role in my choice. For my eyes, I can't see myself owning a BD-4 or
a
Bearhawk. I understand everyone has a different eye for beauty. I'm
partial
to something a bit more newer looking and sleek.

Cheers,
Lyle


"Tilt" wrote in message
news:Of2Cb.663673$pl3.69462@pd7tw3no...
Hi,

I'm looking to get into a homebuilt project within a few years from now.
I've been doing some early research to see what's out there and look at
options.

I haven't come close to picking a final subject as my project yet, but I
have some pretty good ideas of what I want. So far the aircraft that
interests me the most is a Jabiru J450. I'm sort of looking for a
high-wing
4 place type plane. I want something with a bit of performance (able to
reach around 150 knots or higher), and some VERY light aerobatics. Now I
already understand that the Jabiru doesn't quite go fast enough for my
needs, but it gives you an idea of what I'm looking for.

As far as money goes, I don't want to break the bank, but I don't want
to
cheap it out. I may have others go in on this project with me. I know I
don't really want to spend much more than around $75,000 (Canadian).
It's
hard to think of cost figures this early.

So can anyone point me in the direction of some good quality (proven)
aircraft projects that I can research further? As long as they
(somewhat)
follow the above criteria.

Thanks,
Lyle
(Alberta, Canada)

Took a look at the Murphy Super Rebel and the Aerocomp Comp Air 6. I must
say, I'm impressed. The Comp Air 6 is real nice. Both these aircraft are
getting into the 'quite expensive' category, but they're still a hell of a
lot cheaper than a new Cessna (or a used one in some cases).

Everyone that's responded so far has given me valuable information. I
certainly appreciate it!!

Thanks,
Lyle


"Del Rawlins" wrote in message
...
You wouldn't be stuffed like a sardine into a Bearhawk. If you want a
similar sized plane that will accept tricycle gear, look into the Murphy
Super Rebel kit but good luck building one for less than your stated
budget. Other options might be one of the Aerocomp kits or an RV-10,
but again, I don't know anything about the price. Part of the
Bearhawk's huge appeal is that you have the choice of building from
either a kit or from scratch.

Oh, and one other thing...I hate to say it but, easthetics does play a
little role in my choice. For my eyes, I can't see myself owning a BD-
4 or a Bearhawk. I understand everyone has a different eye for beauty.
I'm partial to something a bit more newer looking and sleek.

There is something wrong with your eyes if you can lump the Bearhawk
together with the BD-4 looks wise. Do you have a current medical
certificate? Seriously.

----------------------------------------------------
Del Rawlins-
Remove _kills_spammers_ to reply via email.
Unofficial Bearhawk FAQ website:
http://www.rawlinsbrothers.org/bhfaq/

aircraft (by any stretch), but it's a bit plain jane to me. If the
Jabiru
was a bit bigger and could handle a slightly larger load, I'd
certainly have
my kit.

No, I don't have my medical. I'm not a pilot (yet). This project is
a very
long term item with me. If I actually get started with a couple
years from
now, I'll be happy. I currently have no place to build. I'll be
getting my
license sometime with a couple years from now. I'm only 33 years
old yet,
and have young kids, so I have plenty of time on my side.


Lyle,

only 33 with kids, while their young hurry and get your license,
don't wait, you don't have as long as you think. I started about the
same age, now I'm 54 and I still don't have my license, not because I
could not, only because I didn't get on with it.
--
---
Cheers,
Jonathan Lowe.
/
don't bother me with insignificiant nonsence such as spelling,
I don't care if it spelt properly
/
Sometimes I fly and sometimes I just dream about it.
:-)



I have had aeromedicals done a couple of times for flights in
military
aircraft. Passed them without a problem.

Cheers,
Lyle

On 15 Dec 2003 05:49 AM, Model Flyer posted the following:

No, I don't have my medical. I'm not a pilot (yet). This project is a
very
long term item with me. If I actually get started with a couple years
from
now, I'll be happy. I currently have no place to build. I'll be
getting my
license sometime with a couple years from now. I'm only 33 years old
yet,
and have young kids, so I have plenty of time on my side.


Lyle,

only 33 with kids, while their young hurry and get your license,
don't wait, you don't have as long as you think. I started about the
same age, now I'm 54 and I still don't have my license, not because I
could not, only because I didn't get on with it.

That is a good point. I turn 30 in a few months and have been working,
more or less, on the Bearhawk since I was 24. I got married about 3
years ago (no kids yet), but the one thing that I absolutely made sure
that I got done first was to get my private pilot certificate. Now, I
don't fly much and there isn't much time in my logbook, but it is a
whole lot easier to start back flying once you have your ticket, than it
is to get back to work on that ticket. Getting your license requires a
consistent, sustained effort so it will take some prior planning to make
it happen. The more often, and more consistently you can fly the faster
you will finish. No offense to Model Flyer because I don't know his
situation, but if you make a half-assed effort at it without adequate
planning you will never finish. As it was, I had enough trouble with
weather that it took longer and cost more than I had planned.

----------------------------------------------------
Del Rawlins-
Remove _kills_spammers_ to reply via email.
Unofficial Bearhawk FAQ website:
http://www.rawlinsbrothers.org/bhfaq/

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. I can see that once my kids get to that 8
or 9 age mark (and up) the cash flow will probably be minimal.

Hard to say at this point. Finances are always a tricky thing. I own a small
business and do okay. I'm neither rich or poor at this point. However, I do
have a lot of 'irons in the fire'. There could be the chance within the next
year or two that I could get my licence. A few things have to fall into
place before that'll happen.

My oldest kid is 5, so I think I have a couple years before the real big
expenses start rolling in. However, with the fact that I'm only 33, I feel
this is what's going for me. I have already agreed with myself that this
project will take many years to accomplish. I'm in no panic. I love to fly
and go whenever I get the chance, however, I'm truly looking forward to the
building portion of this project. I'm a true 'jack-of-all-trades' and come
from a long line of the same. I love to build stuff. In many ways I often
look forward to the build of any project rather than the final outcome.

Looking forward to this.

Cheers,
Lyle


"Model Flyer" wrote in message
...
Lyle,

only 33 with kids, while their young hurry and get your license,
don't wait, you don't have as long as you think. I started about the
same age, now I'm 54 and I still don't have my license, not because I
could not, only because I didn't get on with it.
--
---
Cheers,
Jonathan Lowe.
/
don't bother me with insignificiant nonsence such as spelling,
I don't care if it spelt properly
/
Sometimes I fly and sometimes I just dream about it.
:-)