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#1
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All,
I purchased an 8 Amp-hour battery for use in my ASW-20 about 6 months ago. I had been running a radio, ELT, 302/303 combination, and IPAQ 3800. With that combination my battery would last longer than I wanted to be in the air; generally more than 5 hours. I recently removed the 303 and added an SN10B with one meter, so the electric instrumentation suite is now a radio, ELT, SN10 with one meter, 302 and IPAQ 3800. At first I didn't notice any difference in battery performance, but lately it seems the battery has been lasting progressively shorter periods, and this past weekend the SN10 gave me a low battery warning after only 2 hours in the air, and that was without arming the ELT. I keep my battery on the charger on float whenever I'm not flying, which means it stays on the charger all the time except on weekends, and it's not even a year old. Does anyone have a sense of whether I am facing a battery that is failing, a short somewhere, or simply too many instruments on 1 battery? The battery is a PowerSonic 1280, and the charger is a standard RR14650A gell cell automatic charger. I also don't have the tech sheets on all the instruments to add up the current drain so I can't calculate the expected performance from the battery. Respectfully, |
#3
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You need to measure the battery voltage when it has been on charge for
enough time that you expect it will be fully charged. You said you were using a float charger. If that's the case, then the voltage on float should be about 13.8 to 13.9 volts - - the manufacturer has a table for correct float voltage based on temperature. If the float charger is designed for gel cells, then its output float voltage will be set somewhat lower than the voltage AGM sealed lead acid battery requires for float. However, the battery you have is most likely an AGM, not a gel-cell. After the battery has been removed from charge for more than 30 minutes, check the voltage again. With no load and room temperature, a fully charged battery will have a voltage of about 12.8 volts. A half discharged battery will be about 12.5 volts at no load. In any case, you will never fully charge a sealed lead acid battery with a voltage regulated charger designed to float charge the battery. The most you can expect is about 80 to 85%. To fully charge the battery, you would need to bring the voltage up to near 15 volts, but it cannot be left at this voltage for a prolonged period as the battery will be overcharged and eventually, damaged. Sealed batteries don't handle overcharging well. A good automatic battery charger will account for this and switch over to a lower maintenance charge after the battery is fully charged. If the battery will not have a load on it while charging, the best charger is a 3 stage that provides bulk, absorption, and float or maintenance. all the best, bumper wrote in message ups.com... All, I purchased an 8 Amp-hour battery for use in my ASW-20 about 6 months ago. I had been running a radio, ELT, 302/303 combination, and IPAQ 3800. With that combination my battery would last longer than I wanted to be in the air; generally more than 5 hours. I recently removed the 303 and added an SN10B with one meter, so the electric instrumentation suite is now a radio, ELT, SN10 with one meter, 302 and IPAQ 3800. At first I didn't notice any difference in battery performance, but lately it seems the battery has been lasting progressively shorter periods, and this past weekend the SN10 gave me a low battery warning after only 2 hours in the air, and that was without arming the ELT. I keep my battery on the charger on float whenever I'm not flying, which means it stays on the charger all the time except on weekends, and it's not even a year old. Does anyone have a sense of whether I am facing a battery that is failing, a short somewhere, or simply too many instruments on 1 battery? The battery is a PowerSonic 1280, and the charger is a standard RR14650A gell cell automatic charger. I also don't have the tech sheets on all the instruments to add up the current drain so I can't calculate the expected performance from the battery. Respectfully, |
#4
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#5
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![]() wrote in message ups.com... All, I purchased an 8 Amp-hour battery for use in my ASW-20 about 6 months ago. I had been running a radio, ELT, 302/303 combination, and IPAQ 3800. With that combination my battery would last longer than I wanted to be in the air; generally more than 5 hours. I recently removed the 303 and added an SN10B with one meter, so the electric instrumentation suite is now a radio, ELT, SN10 with one meter, 302 and IPAQ 3800. At first I didn't notice any difference in battery performance, but lately it seems the battery has been lasting progressively shorter periods, and this past weekend the SN10 gave me a low battery warning after only 2 hours in the air, and that was without arming the ELT. snip The progressively-shorter periods would indicate to me that the battery is deteriorating. Yep, even if it's pretty new PowerSonic is a pretty good brand, but when I was in the alarm industry, we went through a period where the PowerSonics were being sworn at by all the techs, because they were being replaced so often. Six months later, it wasn't a problem anymore. Probably just a single bad pallet. It could be you just got a battery that didn't live very long. Tim Ward |
#6
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Tim,
Small world, I have an alarm company in Vallejo, CA (Morgan Alarm), though I seldom visit, as my son and daughter-in-law are allowing me to mostly retire. We experienced the same QC issues with both Powersonic and Yuasa. Now, with most of the small AGM sealed lead-acid batteries coming from China, I suspect several brands are coming from the same factory. Cases and fittings appear identical. We've had good results with ELK brand, but even so, when you use 200+ per month, there's the occasional early failure. We replace our customers batteries every 5 years, though they can go longer. For glider use, I suggest replacing them at 3 years. Cheap insurance. bumper "Tim Ward" wrote in message link.net... wrote in message ups.com... All, I purchased an 8 Amp-hour battery for use in my ASW-20 about 6 months ago. I had been running a radio, ELT, 302/303 combination, and IPAQ 3800. With that combination my battery would last longer than I wanted to be in the air; generally more than 5 hours. I recently removed the 303 and added an SN10B with one meter, so the electric instrumentation suite is now a radio, ELT, SN10 with one meter, 302 and IPAQ 3800. At first I didn't notice any difference in battery performance, but lately it seems the battery has been lasting progressively shorter periods, and this past weekend the SN10 gave me a low battery warning after only 2 hours in the air, and that was without arming the ELT. snip The progressively-shorter periods would indicate to me that the battery is deteriorating. Yep, even if it's pretty new PowerSonic is a pretty good brand, but when I was in the alarm industry, we went through a period where the PowerSonics were being sworn at by all the techs, because they were being replaced so often. Six months later, it wasn't a problem anymore. Probably just a single bad pallet. It could be you just got a battery that didn't live very long. Tim Ward |
#7
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![]() wrote in message ups.com... You didn't say much about your charger. If it is a cheap one-stage "trickle charger", look no further. Go out and buy yourself a good 3-stage float charger (you will pay about $50.00) and a new battery. Overcharging by a few tenths of a volt can easily ruin a battery in the timeframe you mentioned. As others have mentioned, it is also possible that you just got unlucky and got a bad one. Vaughn |
#8
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I hate top posting in general, but it seems to fit here. Bumper has
noted very important points, and to add fuel to the fire, it is important that the battery is designed for the intended service. The only 1280 I see on the Power-Sonic sebsite is the PSH1280 which is designed for UPS applications, and for 15 minute discharges of roughly 20 amps. I would not be at all surprised (they don't say) that just 2 or 3 of those will significantly reduce capacity. Your far more reasonable discharge would be less severe, but I'd still guess it is low on the number of cycles vs their more "traditional" designs. On Sun, 11 Sep 2005 21:13:47 -0700, "bumper" wrote: You need to measure the battery voltage when it has been on charge for enough time that you expect it will be fully charged. You said you were using a float charger. If that's the case, then the voltage on float should be about 13.8 to 13.9 volts - - the manufacturer has a table for correct float voltage based on temperature. If the float charger is designed for gel cells, then its output float voltage will be set somewhat lower than the voltage AGM sealed lead acid battery requires for float. However, the battery you have is most likely an AGM, not a gel-cell. After the battery has been removed from charge for more than 30 minutes, check the voltage again. With no load and room temperature, a fully charged battery will have a voltage of about 12.8 volts. A half discharged battery will be about 12.5 volts at no load. In any case, you will never fully charge a sealed lead acid battery with a voltage regulated charger designed to float charge the battery. The most you can expect is about 80 to 85%. To fully charge the battery, you would need to bring the voltage up to near 15 volts, but it cannot be left at this voltage for a prolonged period as the battery will be overcharged and eventually, damaged. Sealed batteries don't handle overcharging well. A good automatic battery charger will account for this and switch over to a lower maintenance charge after the battery is fully charged. If the battery will not have a load on it while charging, the best charger is a 3 stage that provides bulk, absorption, and float or maintenance. all the best, bumper wrote in message oups.com... All, I purchased an 8 Amp-hour battery for use in my ASW-20 about 6 months ago. I had been running a radio, ELT, 302/303 combination, and IPAQ 3800. With that combination my battery would last longer than I wanted to be in the air; generally more than 5 hours. I recently removed the 303 and added an SN10B with one meter, so the electric instrumentation suite is now a radio, ELT, SN10 with one meter, 302 and IPAQ 3800. At first I didn't notice any difference in battery performance, but lately it seems the battery has been lasting progressively shorter periods, and this past weekend the SN10 gave me a low battery warning after only 2 hours in the air, and that was without arming the ELT. I keep my battery on the charger on float whenever I'm not flying, which means it stays on the charger all the time except on weekends, and it's not even a year old. Does anyone have a sense of whether I am facing a battery that is failing, a short somewhere, or simply too many instruments on 1 battery? The battery is a PowerSonic 1280, and the charger is a standard RR14650A gell cell automatic charger. I also don't have the tech sheets on all the instruments to add up the current drain so I can't calculate the expected performance from the battery. Respectfully, |
#9
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Hi,
One item that I don't think anyone has mentioned is to make sure that your iPAQ is fully charged (or nearly so) before connecting it to your glider battery. With a low battery an iPAQ can draw 1 A or more until charged. That can make a major difference in glider battery life. Good Soaring, Paul Remde Cumulus Soaring, Inc. http://www.cumulus-soaring.com wrote in message ups.com... All, I purchased an 8 Amp-hour battery for use in my ASW-20 about 6 months ago. I had been running a radio, ELT, 302/303 combination, and IPAQ 3800. With that combination my battery would last longer than I wanted to be in the air; generally more than 5 hours. I recently removed the 303 and added an SN10B with one meter, so the electric instrumentation suite is now a radio, ELT, SN10 with one meter, 302 and IPAQ 3800. At first I didn't notice any difference in battery performance, but lately it seems the battery has been lasting progressively shorter periods, and this past weekend the SN10 gave me a low battery warning after only 2 hours in the air, and that was without arming the ELT. I keep my battery on the charger on float whenever I'm not flying, which means it stays on the charger all the time except on weekends, and it's not even a year old. Does anyone have a sense of whether I am facing a battery that is failing, a short somewhere, or simply too many instruments on 1 battery? The battery is a PowerSonic 1280, and the charger is a standard RR14650A gell cell automatic charger. I also don't have the tech sheets on all the instruments to add up the current drain so I can't calculate the expected performance from the battery. Respectfully, |
#10
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![]() "Paul Remde" wrote in message news:EXgVe.345487$xm3.13822@attbi_s21... Hi, One item that I don't think anyone has mentioned is to make sure that your iPAQ is fully charged (or nearly so) before connecting it to your glider battery. With a low battery an iPAQ can draw 1 A or more until charged. That can make a major difference in glider battery life. Good Soaring, Paul Remde Cumulus Soaring, Inc. http://www.cumulus-soaring.com Quite true. Less current draw, but for the same reason, don't use the PDA's backlight unless you need it. Then, bow towards Washington, DC (if you're in the US) and chant, "you can't catch me - - you can't catch me" several times .. . . then turn off the transponder if you're far away from heavy traffic areas. bumper |
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