Oral exam place and questions

I've been reading about oral exams for a private pilot license (in the U.S.),
and two questions have come to mind.

Where does this exam take place? Is it in a classroom, or in a testing
center, or is it actually in the aircraft?

When you are asked math-type questions, are you expected to answer with just a
ballpark figure or an exact answer? In the latter case, can you use a
calculator, or pencil and paper, or must you do it in your head?

If I'm asked how long it will take to go 84 nm at 120 kts, I know that it's
about 40 minutes, but if an exact answer is required I don't see how I could
practically provide that without a calculator.

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Mxsmanic wrote:

Where does this exam take place? Is it in a classroom, or in a testing
center, or is it actually in the aircraft?

It's usually done at the point of the checkride, inside the FBO in some
convenient place where you go over the paperwork and then outside in the
vicinity of the aircraft, typically the candidate being asked questions
while demonstrating the checkride.

When you are asked math-type questions, are you expected to answer with just a
ballpark figure or an exact answer? In the latter case, can you use a
calculator, or pencil and paper, or must you do it in your head?

You're not typically asked math-type questions. Generally questions are
asked about aircraft systems and your preflight planning is examined.
In flight, you might be asked to compute some things as part of your
normal cross country navigation. Accuracy to what you can get on the
whizwheel is accceptable.

If I'm asked how long it will take to go 84 nm at 120 kts, I know that it's
about 40 minutes, but if an exact answer is required I don't see how I could
practically provide that without a calculator.

Whizwheels were the classic, calculators are acceptable.

Ron Natalie writes:

Whizwheels were the classic, calculators are acceptable.

A whizwheel being like the small E6-B I got at the pilot store? I still
haven't studied it very much, although I used to be very good with a slide
rule.

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Mxsmanic wrote:

Ron Natalie writes:

Whizwheels were the classic, calculators are acceptable.

A whizwheel being like the small E6-B I got at the pilot store?

that's the one. Though whizwheel is a more generic term for
circular slide rules and can also refer to different variants
like the Jeppesen CR-5 (the main difference is how the wind
triangle is computed on the backside)

--Sylvain

On Apr 9, 5:54 pm, Ron Natalie wrote:
Mxsmanic wrote:
Where does this exam take place? Is it in a classroom, or in a testing
center, or is it actually in the aircraft?

It's usually done at the point of the checkride, inside the FBO in some
convenient place where you go over the paperwork and then outside in the
vicinity of the aircraft, typically the candidate being asked questions
while demonstrating the checkride.



When you are asked math-type questions, are you expected to answer with just a
ballpark figure or an exact answer? In the latter case, can you use a
calculator, or pencil and paper, or must you do it in your head?

You're not typically asked math-type questions. Generally questions are
asked about aircraft systems and your preflight planning is examined.
In flight, you might be asked to compute some things as part of your
normal cross country navigation. Accuracy to what you can get on the
whizwheel is accceptable.

If I'm asked how long it will take to go 84 nm at 120 kts, I know that it's
about 40 minutes, but if an exact answer is required I don't see how I could
practically provide that without a calculator.

Whizwheels were the classic, calculators are acceptable.

Traditionally the students were told what calculations to do ahead of
time and would arrive with a flight plan, W&B, performance, balanced
field, etc asked for by the DE the night before the ride. However, the
FSDO is now asking the examiners to throw those out and make the
student do another one right there to ensure the CFI isn't doing it
for them. Usually the DE will ask the student to plan some sort of
cross country (complete with runway requirements, performance, etc),
then go get coffee and 1/2 watch the process but then go over the
results. A great DE sets aside the entire day for the checkride to
avoid rushing the student, although 1/2 a day is probably the most
common.

-Robert, CFII

"Robert M. Gary" wrote in message
oups.com...
On Apr 9, 5:54 pm, Ron Natalie wrote:
Mxsmanic wrote:
Where does this exam take place? Is it in a classroom, or in a
testing
center, or is it actually in the aircraft?

It's usually done at the point of the checkride, inside the FBO in some
convenient place where you go over the paperwork and then outside in the
vicinity of the aircraft, typically the candidate being asked questions
while demonstrating the checkride.



When you are asked math-type questions, are you expected to answer
with just a
ballpark figure or an exact answer? In the latter case, can you use a
calculator, or pencil and paper, or must you do it in your head?

You're not typically asked math-type questions. Generally questions are
asked about aircraft systems and your preflight planning is examined.
In flight, you might be asked to compute some things as part of your
normal cross country navigation. Accuracy to what you can get on the
whizwheel is accceptable.

If I'm asked how long it will take to go 84 nm at 120 kts, I know that
it's
about 40 minutes, but if an exact answer is required I don't see how I
could
practically provide that without a calculator.

Whizwheels were the classic, calculators are acceptable.

Traditionally the students were told what calculations to do ahead of
time and would arrive with a flight plan, W&B, performance, balanced
field, etc asked for by the DE the night before the ride. However, the
FSDO is now asking the examiners to throw those out and make the
student do another one right there to ensure the CFI isn't doing it
for them. Usually the DE will ask the student to plan some sort of
cross country (complete with runway requirements, performance, etc),
then go get coffee and 1/2 watch the process but then go over the
results. A great DE sets aside the entire day for the checkride to
avoid rushing the student, although 1/2 a day is probably the most
common.

-Robert, CFII

I had only ever heard of the 1/2 day scheduling--so now I'm curious:
Does a geate DE actually use the entire day, or just have it available?

Peter

On Apr 10, 6:47 am, "Peter Dohm" wrote:
"Robert M. Gary" wrote in ooglegroups.com...



On Apr 9, 5:54 pm, Ron Natalie wrote:
Mxsmanic wrote:
Where does this exam take place? Is it in a classroom, or in a
testing
center, or is it actually in the aircraft?

It's usually done at the point of the checkride, inside the FBO in some
convenient place where you go over the paperwork and then outside in the
vicinity of the aircraft, typically the candidate being asked questions
while demonstrating the checkride.

When you are asked math-type questions, are you expected to answer
with just a
ballpark figure or an exact answer? In the latter case, can you use a
calculator, or pencil and paper, or must you do it in your head?

You're not typically asked math-type questions. Generally questions are
asked about aircraft systems and your preflight planning is examined.
In flight, you might be asked to compute some things as part of your
normal cross country navigation. Accuracy to what you can get on the
whizwheel is accceptable.

If I'm asked how long it will take to go 84 nm at 120 kts, I know that
it's
about 40 minutes, but if an exact answer is required I don't see how I
could
practically provide that without a calculator.

Whizwheels were the classic, calculators are acceptable.

Traditionally the students were told what calculations to do ahead of
time and would arrive with a flight plan, W&B, performance, balanced
field, etc asked for by the DE the night before the ride. However, the
FSDO is now asking the examiners to throw those out and make the
student do another one right there to ensure the CFI isn't doing it
for them. Usually the DE will ask the student to plan some sort of
cross country (complete with runway requirements, performance, etc),
then go get coffee and 1/2 watch the process but then go over the
results. A great DE sets aside the entire day for the checkride to
avoid rushing the student, although 1/2 a day is probably the most
common.

-Robert, CFII

I had only ever heard of the 1/2 day scheduling--so now I'm curious:
Does a geate DE actually use the entire day, or just have it available?

Peter- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

As a CFI I appreciate it when a DE only does one checkride per day
because it puts less time pressure on the student. Sometimes things
don't work out right and extra time is needed. If the checkride is at
9am and the DE has another at noon, the DE will be more pressured.
About 1/2 the DEs will only schedule one per day because of this.
However, at $400 a pop, I can see why someone would want to do more
than 1 per day. Around here the DEs are scheduled pretty far out. Many
schedule 40 days out (which is REALLY hard as a CFI to ensure the
student "peaks" at the right time, accounting for illness,
maintenance, etc). Other DEs will only work out of certain airports
(simply because they dont' want to drive far from their house). We
have a great bunch of DEs out here (don't get me wrong) but the more
flexibility they give the student, the easier it is for me to make the
stars align at the right time.

-Robert

Traditionally the students were told what calculations to do ahead of
time and would arrive with a flight plan, W&B, performance, balanced
field, etc asked for by the DE the night before the ride. However, the
FSDO is now asking the examiners to throw those out and make the
student do another one right there to ensure the CFI isn't doing it
for them. Usually the DE will ask the student to plan some sort of
cross country (complete with runway requirements, performance, etc),
then go get coffee and 1/2 watch the process but then go over the
results. A great DE sets aside the entire day for the checkride to
avoid rushing the student, although 1/2 a day is probably the most
common.

-Robert, CFII

I had only ever heard of the 1/2 day scheduling--so now I'm curious:
Does a geate DE actually use the entire day, or just have it available?

Peter- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

As a CFI I appreciate it when a DE only does one checkride per day
because it puts less time pressure on the student. Sometimes things
don't work out right and extra time is needed. If the checkride is at
9am and the DE has another at noon, the DE will be more pressured.
About 1/2 the DEs will only schedule one per day because of this.
However, at $400 a pop, I can see why someone would want to do more
than 1 per day. Around here the DEs are scheduled pretty far out. Many
schedule 40 days out (which is REALLY hard as a CFI to ensure the
student "peaks" at the right time, accounting for illness,
maintenance, etc). Other DEs will only work out of certain airports
(simply because they dont' want to drive far from their house). We
have a great bunch of DEs out here (don't get me wrong) but the more
flexibility they give the student, the easier it is for me to make the
stars align at the right time.

-Robert

Thanks, that's a lot of good information that I never knew.

Peter

Robert M. Gary wrote:


Traditionally the students were told what calculations to do ahead of
time and would arrive with a flight plan, W&B, performance, balanced
field, etc asked for by the DE the night before the ride.

Really? I don't remember that tradition. I took my ride in '88 and at
that time, the DE would (maybe) tell you where the pseudo cross country was
going to go. On the day of the examination, you were required to do the
flight plan right there in front of the DE. As I recall, the PTS had a
requrement that the flight plan must be completed in 30 min. Later on (in
the rule overhaul of '96, IIRC), they dropped the 30 min. time limit.

However, the
FSDO is now asking the examiners to throw those out and make the
student do another one right there to ensure the CFI isn't doing it
for them.

That's probably not a bad idea. More likely than a CFI doing the plan for
the student, is the student just having a computer do the whole thing for him
in advance.

John Galban=====N4BQ (PA28-180)

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JGalban via AviationKB.com writes:

As I recall, the PTS had a
requrement that the flight plan must be completed in 30 min. Later on (in
the rule overhaul of '96, IIRC), they dropped the 30 min. time limit.

Why was there ever a time limit? Presumably you prepare flight plans in
advance, and it's not a race against the clock, but something you do
deliberately and carefully, however long it takes.

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